Classic is too easy for 2019 playerbase

Classic Discussion
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Honestly from an outsider point of view, i think the "classic community" will be largely be composed of retail players, with some of these forum edgelords mixed in and the hordes of streamers minions.
I suppose the hope is that Classic will require and possibly foster a good community by requiring players to interact and socialize with one another to tackle the games challenges.

That's my hope at least.

I'm not deluding myself in that Classic will be more difficult than Retail overall. I played Vanilla, I know better. The games mechanics truly have evolved over time. I do miss dungeon strategy though. The need to CC mobs is sorely missed.

I'm also one of those maniacs who liked Gnomer, Maraudon and BRD. Actually I think everyone liked BRD. Except for the one person who is now going to say otherwise. Maybe not them.
1 issue I see is this is going to be 1.12 In 1.12 they had already ruined tanking/dps challenge by getting rid of threat issues. They had DM in there and they had enough gear creep with .5 and other things that MC can probably be full cleared within a week of your guild having 40 level 60s and 1 raid leader that knows how. This is NOT because MC wasn't hard...it's because in 1.12 there had been so much power creep that MC was no longer hard. They have also clearly confirmed 16 debuff slots instead of 8.
11/14/2018 11:52 AMPosted by Xalmuth
I suppose the hope is that Classic will require and possibly foster a good community by requiring players to interact and socialize with one another to tackle the games challenges.

That's my hope at least.

I'm not deluding myself in that Classic will be more difficult than Retail overall. I played Vanilla, I know better. The games mechanics truly have evolved over time. I do miss dungeon strategy though. The need to CC mobs is sorely missed.

I'm also one of those maniacs who liked Gnomer, Maraudon and BRD. Actually I think everyone liked BRD. Except for the one person who is now going to say otherwise. Maybe not them.


Agreed, BRD was my favorite instance. I love Classic and I want to see it live long and shape how blizzard's decision to make WoW single player and arcade oriented was a big mistake.

Classic has major problems and rather than looking at it objectively, people use it as more of a boycott against the Microtransactions, Transmogs, Portals, Flying Mounts, LFG/R, Garrosins, Realm mergers, weak economy, poor community, and crappy loot system.
For those fresh/new to thread.
You are welcome.
https://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/topic/20769699819?page=1

Also OP is an obvious troll.
That thread is just hilarious watching retail players deal with BC instances made current via TW and freaking out over them. Getting Wrecked. Pwned.

perfect quote page 6.
11/14/2018 05:10 AMPosted by Miadra
The biggest thing that hit me when I started running the timewalking dungeons is how many of the newer players are simply not used to dungeons where so many various mechanics are used. It seems like very often the groups will go in thinking it is just a matter of dpsing your way through, and so many of the older dungeons were not like that, you had to remember what methods to use on different bosses, and even different mobs.

It is sort of sad to realize how dumbed down the dungeons became during MoP and moving forward, but I guess I understand why Blizzard did it. In an age where people are not so prone to be willing to invest in huge blocks of time in game, the faster, more simplified dungeons were the way to go.

But it also makes me glad that I remember running most of those older dungeons when they were new, and remember the tactics you had to use to get through them. Sometimes it helps if I am with a group of newer players and I can give them a tip or two.
One of the more hilarious thread titles I've read on this forum. Thanks for the chuckle, OP.
The difficulty is really just displaced from retail. Retail puts the difficulty into M+ and Mythic raids with a heavy reliance on strict and "complicated" mechanics (compared to anything vanilla has to offer).

Vanilla the difficulty was actually finding raiders, as raiding wasn't near as common as it is now, and leveling.

Sure, lots of people are going to die to mobs/runners when leveling likely me included, but as far as raid difficulty and even endgame instance difficulty...it will be far easier compared to current retail raiding/m+. I'm ok with that though.
I've played this game since the day it came out and put THOUSANDS of hours into vanilla wow. It was definitely the peak of my wow career.

Vanilla was not difficult by any means and retail today is the same way.

If you learn your class and learn fight mechanics, there is nothing inherently difficult about this game.

I see people making arguments about how having to CC in vanilla dungeons makes the game difficult. Running up to a pack of mobs and casting polymorph on one of them is not a challenge.

Let's stop pretending like this game was every difficult. It simply takes time to learn a few things here and there, that's about the extent of it.
More epic hilarious quotes.
11/14/2018 06:05 AMPosted by Icowtank
Mobs hit hard in shattered halls. Felt like I was doing mythic plus as a healer. Large spikes of damage, need to pay attention to keep everyone alive.

DO NOT NERF, I'M HAVING FUN.
11/14/2018 08:11 AMPosted by Ryndell
I love how what was supposed to be a fun diversion has become the most challenging 5-man content outside of high level mythic plus. This modern rush rush rush aoe all of the things mentality is why something as simple as cc and controlled pulls have become so foreign. I think it's hilarious to watch these new tanks just get demolished by 3-4 mobs because they think they can pull everything and wait for it to die. What really makes me shake my head is when you tell them to be careful, or los pull, etc etc. they still run in like Leeroy and get rolled. The repair cost is so worth the entertainment.

"like a mythic+8"
"I'm putting "I did my timewalkings" in my next mythic+ Application! "
page ten people coming in telling them how it is.

That thread has convinced me ever so more how much more difficult the overall game was made back then to current bum rush.
I see people making arguments about how having to CC in vanilla dungeons makes the game difficult. Running up to a pack of mobs and casting polymorph on one of them is not a challenge.


Which is harder:

a) position yourself wherever because the area your ability hits is meaningless as all the mobs will clump on you and stay there doing pitiful damage
b) position yourself so your ae ability hits mob x but not mobs y & z beside/behind them so as not to break the CC

The correct answer is clear and obvious...
11/14/2018 01:35 PMPosted by Ellilaine
I see people making arguments about how having to CC in vanilla dungeons makes the game difficult. Running up to a pack of mobs and casting polymorph on one of them is not a challenge.


Which is harder:

a) position yourself wherever because the area your ability hits is meaningless as all the mobs will clump on you and stay there doing pitiful damage
b) position yourself so your ae ability hits mob x but not mobs y & z beside/behind them so as not to break the CC

The correct answer is clear and obvious...


That's not even remotely how M+ functions which is now the "endgame" version of instances function.
11/14/2018 01:35 PMPosted by Ellilaine
I see people making arguments about how having to CC in vanilla dungeons makes the game difficult. Running up to a pack of mobs and casting polymorph on one of them is not a challenge.


Which is harder:

a) position yourself wherever because the area your ability hits is meaningless as all the mobs will clump on you and stay there doing pitiful damage
b) position yourself so your ae ability hits mob x but not mobs y & z beside/behind them so as not to break the CC

The correct answer is clear and obvious...

Don't forget to add
"make sure that you do not accidentally pull extra mobs".
11/14/2018 01:35 PMPosted by Ellilaine
I see people making arguments about how having to CC in vanilla dungeons makes the game difficult. Running up to a pack of mobs and casting polymorph on one of them is not a challenge.


Which is harder:

a) position yourself wherever because the area your ability hits is meaningless as all the mobs will clump on you and stay there doing pitiful damage
b) position yourself so your ae ability hits mob x but not mobs y & z beside/behind them so as not to break the CC

The correct answer is clear and obvious...


Depends on what the mobs are capable of in the first scenario. Depends on if the tank is capable of tanking all those mobs. Depends on if the healer is capable of healing the tank and other group members. There's a lot of factors.

But casting a few abilities and pulling mobs back is not *harder*. It may take some time to set up a pull but there isn't anything difficult about it.
11/14/2018 01:35 PMPosted by Ellilaine
...

Which is harder:

a) position yourself wherever because the area your ability hits is meaningless as all the mobs will clump on you and stay there doing pitiful damage
b) position yourself so your ae ability hits mob x but not mobs y & z beside/behind them so as not to break the CC

The correct answer is clear and obvious...

Don't forget to add
"make sure that you do not accidentally pull extra mobs".


Because you don't have to worry about that in retail, right? K.
11/14/2018 01:35 PMPosted by Ellilaine
...

Which is harder:

a) position yourself wherever because the area your ability hits is meaningless as all the mobs will clump on you and stay there doing pitiful damage
b) position yourself so your ae ability hits mob x but not mobs y & z beside/behind them so as not to break the CC

The correct answer is clear and obvious...


Depends on what the mobs are capable of in the first scenario. Depends on if the tank is capable of tanking all those mobs. Depends on if the healer is capable of healing the tank and other group members. There's a lot of factors.

But casting a few abilities and pulling mobs back is not *harder*. It may take some time to set up a pull but there isn't anything difficult about it.


Is it, or is it not, more difficult than LEERRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYY!!!!! charging?

Obviously it is, thus the point stands. I don't see anyone saying either retail or vanilla is particularly hard in an absolute sense because they aren't. However, it is a fact that vanilla dungeons were much more difficult than retail dungeons until you start talking about mythic+ levels which are required for pretty much nothing beyond ilvl inflation/e-peen stroking).
...
Don't forget to add
"make sure that you do not accidentally pull extra mobs".


Because you don't have to worry about that in retail, right? K.


Well no because you pull the entire room and aoe them down.
Try that in vanilla and all 5 of you are dead.
Actually M+ is required if you are into min/maxing and arguably as important or moreso than raids until the mythic level.

The way secondaries function currently and the removal of tier sets, raids offer only a handful of upgrades. You are more or less required to farm M+ for the majority of your optimal upgrades. I'm not arguing it's good/bad design, but it's still required content for the most optimal gear for raiders.
11/14/2018 01:57 PMPosted by Brockthorn
...

Because you don't have to worry about that in retail, right? K.


Well no because you pull the entire room and aoe them down.
Try that in vanilla and all 5 of you are dead.


Prot paladin says "kek" in strat/scholo once geared
11/14/2018 01:57 PMPosted by Brockthorn
...

Because you don't have to worry about that in retail, right? K.


Well no because you pull the entire room and aoe them down.
Try that in vanilla and all 5 of you are dead.


Try that now and all 5 of you are dead.
I've seen a lot of people on here saying, 'yes, mythic+ is difficult, but that doesn't count really'.

Why exactly does mythic + not matter? It's some of the most played content in the game right now.

It seems disregarded by a lot of people defending vanilla wow as being more difficult because it challenges their beliefs.

And yes, in a lot of progression mythic + groups, pulling more than one group is a death sentence. This was even the case before mythic + came out this expansion.

All I'm trying to say is that neither retail nor vanilla wow is terribly difficult. Both require a little forethought and planning, depending on what you're doing.

Vanilla is NOT more difficult than retail, each as its own unique challenges. Simple as that.

Stop trying to make everything fit your narrative.

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