M+ meta is too tight

General Discussion
Today was the last straw. I decided to uninstall wow after being declined to multiple +10 pugs in lfg. My ilvl is 380, io is 900 and I play one of the highest simming specs, survival. However, because im not a rouge, frost mage, blood dk or strong range dps I get declined to every group. I cant believe how little has been done to address the imbalance in m+. Tuning in regards to numbers will never fix this when other classes design is just flat out better. The fault does not only lie with blizzard. Yes, 90% of the tuning is small numbers and not kit changes but the community is SOOO picky they are partly to blame as well. In conclusion the main reason I decided to quit is that class' are not balanced (kit not dps numbers) and that has created a m+ meta too small to be acceptable. I don't think blizzard is doing enough to fix this and for what its worth the whole expansion is just a legion reskin if im being brutal about it. cya in 8.1 becuz I never actually quit forever.

edit: just want to make it clear. I am aware that if im 900 io I should get declined to 1k io groups. that's not what this is about.

Id like the thank all the elitists for declining me, without you I never could have quit on my own!
1) Many 10+ pugs ask for 1k+ io, yours is not 1k+.

2) io shows your highest run of the dungeon you apply for, so if your experience in that dungeon is less than your overall, they will know and potentially decline because of it.
Raider IO is toxic. I regularly did +15s every week last expansion but it's like cutting teeth to try to get into a +10 this expansion if I don't run with guildies or make my own group.
I know this is a crazy thought, but hear me out:

Make your own group.

I know, it's nuts, but give it a shot.
People really don't want to progress on their own key? That's one of the best ways to get +10's and such done without relying on the community.

The community is not really toxic imo, it's just that there's lots of new players to Mythic+ that are just looking for carries, and/or are tired of their keys being messed up by inexperienced players.

No offense, I'm sure you're a great player, but I took a chance on a low IO shammy in my +9 SotS the other night....and his io was super low...but you know what? why not give him a chance right? Yeah he cost us the run multiple times...didn't understand the affix, wasn't situationally and environmentally aware, pulled lots of extras etc...Was not based on his SKILL, more or less his experience in mythic+...which is why I am a huge supporter of io requirements for keys +10 and higher.

He made up for it by assisting in 4 manning the last boss though so all is forgiven <3
Today was the last straw. I decided to uninstall wow after being declined to multiple +10 pugs in lfg. My ilvl is 380, io is 900 and I play one of the highest simming specs, survival. However, because im not a rouge, frost mage, blood dk or strong range dps I get declined to every group. I cant believe how little has been done to address the imbalance in m+. Tuning in regards to numbers will never fix this when other classes design is just flat out better. The fault does not only lie with blizzard. Yes, 90% of the tuning is small numbers and not kit changes but the community is SOOO picky they are partly to blame as well. In conclusion the main reason I decided to quit is that class' are not balanced (kit not dps numbers) and that has created a m+ meta too small to be acceptable. I don't think blizzard is doing enough to fix this and for what its worth the whole expansion is just a legion reskin if im being brutal about it. cya in 8.1 becuz I never actually quit forever.

Id like the thank all the elitists for declining me, without you I never could have quit on my own!
Found your problem! 1. You can't spell rogue and 2. You are uninstalling a game you will shortly be returning to

Here's some advice and do like me and just cancel your subscription but keep the game installed just in case they manage to fix this shįtshow of an expansion.
10/28/2018 11:54 AMPosted by Infernastorm
I know this is a crazy thought, but hear me out:

Make your own group.

I know, it's nuts, but give it a shot.


Works great if you can tank or heal but if you are a class with no tank/heal spec your group will sit in the group finder forever waiting to fill. People won't join up with a group with one person in it who is a dps.
10/28/2018 11:56 AMPosted by Kalorea
Works great if you can tank or heal but if you are a class with no tank/heal spec your group will sit in the group finder forever waiting to fill. People won't join up with a group with one person in it who is a dps.


Yeah, they will. Happens every day.
10/28/2018 11:57 AMPosted by Infernastorm
10/28/2018 11:56 AMPosted by Kalorea
Works great if you can tank or heal but if you are a class with no tank/heal spec your group will sit in the group finder forever waiting to fill. People won't join up with a group with one person in it who is a dps.


Yeah, they will. Happens every day.


Not when I try it.
It's gotten pretty bad. Try being a shaman. I'm 370-371 with aotc and can't even get into a +4 pug.

That being said I honestly wouldn't care if this was just some auxiliary side thing for fun. ( I find m+'s unfun and misreable anyway) but they've made these dumb things a pivital point in gearing for pve. And they offer no reliable alternatives. Bring back vendors and marks IMO. More ways to gear is better, not worse.
I mean if there are people applying with higher ilvl and higher rating, why should I take you?
Honestly, I'd rather have a Survival Hunter than a Boomkin.

That said, Survival is pretty mediocre in M+ if I recall correctly. Not bad, but when you have access to Beat Mastery, which has a lot more versatility due to having a better variety of pets, why would anyone choose to play Survival.
10/28/2018 11:46 AMPosted by Calabreezy
Today was the last straw. I decided to uninstall wow after being declined to multiple +10 pugs in lfg. My ilvl is 380, io is 900 and I play one of the highest simming specs, survival. However, because im not a rouge, frost mage, blood dk or strong range dps I get declined to every group. I cant believe how little has been done to address the imbalance in m+. Tuning in regards to numbers will never fix this when other classes design is just flat out better. The fault does not only lie with blizzard. Yes, 90% of the tuning is small numbers and not kit changes but the community is SOOO picky they are partly to blame as well. In conclusion the main reason I decided to quit is that class' are not balanced (kit not dps numbers) and that has created a m+ meta too small to be acceptable. I don't think blizzard is doing enough to fix this and for what its worth the whole expansion is just a legion reskin if im being brutal about it. cya in 8.1 becuz I never actually quit forever.

Id like the thank all the elitists for declining me, without you I never could have quit on my own!


Class balance is horrible right now, really the worst its ever been in the game. I view this as inexcusable as they pulled abilities, turned off the GCD, did away with tier, etc.

Moreover, the sources of the imbalance - Gorefiend's Grasp, frost mage's slows, rogue's cloak - aren't going to be balanced anytime soon.
10/28/2018 11:46 AMPosted by Calabreezy
Id like the thank all the elitists for declining me, without you I never could have quit on my own!
Join a guild and stop playing with random 15 year olds. You’ll be able to run as many keys as you want and not even care about raider.io score.
It's pretty clear that a lot of the modifiers were literally not playtested at all for many dungeons given that we have literally had this scenario play out 2-3 times now:

1. Modifer makes specific dungeons unwinnable or incredibly unbalanced
2. People are just starting to complain but nothing gets done
3. Hotfixes get applied fixing it
4. After checking the history for Ion's toon, it turns out the hotfix was applied like 1-2 hours after Ion ran the specific key with his guild

laffo
You people ask for RPG and dehomogenization, sorry if Rogues and Blood DK's entire toolkit is just better than yours.
Make your own group, find a Guild to run with, or simply try the community feature to look for a M+ group. Pugging anything is really something you put onto yourself and the groups you ask for invites to, get 20 other DPS with much higher Raider.io.

The community is toxic, but it's their key, you are in a line with other people who have a much higher Raider.io score and even possibly a spec/class that they are looking for to their m+ comp.

I used to be annoyed at it all but after understanding how it works, you can't approach it as if they ''should'' give you a shot 'cause of your item level. M+ wasn't ever meant to be pugged to begin with. And raider.io is the best tool that people have currently to screen people.
10/28/2018 11:53 AMPosted by Kalorea
Raider IO is toxic. I regularly did +15s every week last expansion but it's like cutting teeth to try to get into a +10 this expansion if I don't run with guildies or make my own group.


How is content from a previous expac relevant in the present one? You make no sense with that argument.

Sure, maybe that means you're a little more aware, but everyone else in that list I'm inviting has actual experience in currency. So why should I invite you? Charity?

The current woes have nothing to do raider.io or not as much as people claim. I recently leveled a new toon. A paladin tank. Had trouble finding healer and dps for m0s. Why? Warfronts probably. (PVP's pretty generous on loot too)

So after these guys get their welfare gear and are 350+ they don't wanna do +4s and below because the gear isn't relevant. But players forming groups above that, don't see .io scores on these ding dongs. See what's happening?

Now... don't deny that the playerbase has been shrinking after the first month. If anyone knows anyone outside of their guilds... people are quitting. It's not just some inside forum joke. When your capitals were packed throughout the day and resemble a ghost town now... that says something.

It's a variety of factors.

Even as a gearing tank at 339 doing +4s-6, you get overzealous dps thinking they know everything, bum rush packs which you weren't trying to pull, and dying to boss mechanics. It's pretty stressful to tank with idiots.

Long story short, you ding dongs want shortcuts. Progression of raider.io score has been more 'rewarding' than the game itself.

I'm still waiting for someone who's 1.4k score or above with a full history of pugs and not regular groups for dungeons done to advocate for the closure of raider.io. Until then, it's just professional passengers making a stink and bad game design.
10/28/2018 11:46 AMPosted by Calabreezy
I play one of the highest simming specs, survival.
10/28/2018 11:46 AMPosted by Calabreezy
other classes design is just flat out better.
These statements seem to be at odds.

10/28/2018 11:46 AMPosted by Calabreezy
I decided to uninstall wow after being declined to multiple +10 pugs in lfg
How many? I am curious. What was your threshold to uninstall?

Look, dps are a dime a dozen. Part of the problem for you is just that. You might have been applying to groups that already had hunters and some of the things your class can bring to the group. Group class composition actually matters for M+. And Hunters make up the highest overall class % when you look on realmpop, so you have more competition than any other class.

I'm not saying raider.io wasn't part of your issue. You don't have everything at +10 yet (neither do I), but you have plenty of score to actually get +10 invites after you wad through some of the declines. I know because I can get invites and have slightly less score than you.

Raider IO is toxic. I regularly did +15s every week last expansion.
You know we had raider.io last xpack, right?

Beyond which, all raider.io is doing is just keeping an easy to see log of your M+ experience in one place, based on the data on your character that Blizzard owns and has full rights to which they happily publish publicly on the leaderboards.

How is giving people information with which to make informed decisions when they are trying to create groups in any way shape or form "toxic"?
Asking for 1000 Io for +10 is imo just ludicrous... if u +1 a 10 you get 100 io score... there are 10 dungeons. and to even upgrade a 10 with a pug is not the easiest thing.

Join the Conversation

Return to Forum