Re: Level Squish Feedback

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11/04/2018 07:20 AMPosted by Peapöd
I dont think the number of levels are the problem


It actually is because they keep removing baseline abilities and passives.

I'll say it again, my 120 WW Monk has a total of 29 abilities in his spell book. My 120 Havoc DH has 22. 1 of those is Glide.

29 abilities spread across 60 levels instead of 120 is a much better character progression while leveling through level scaled zones with item level scaled mobs.

Hypothetical next expansion with a level crunch where the new maximum level is 65 or 70 gives 1 talent every ten levels with a new talent at new max and potential new ability at new max as well, while getting 1 new spell or passive every 2 to 3 levels.

Remember, we went 110-120 with absolutely nothing except HoA and Azerite gear all boring passive traits!

The last talent came at 100!
It would make more sense if they ended the current timeline and transferred all of their best assets to a fresh WoW universe, then they can do whatever the heck they want. Timeline starts at the end of Warcraft 3 but the story unfolds differently.
11/03/2018 11:53 PMPosted by Fursine
Helllllllllllllllll no!

I'm not having days of BC, WotLK, Cata and MoP be just three levels. Gtfoh.


It wouldn't be any different outside of how you perceive it. Gameplay wise though you would spend the same time in each expansion.
11/04/2018 06:54 AMPosted by Sarcasmic
I know no one wants to hear this, but Guild Wars 2 has been doing this for time immemorial and it's never been a problem for them. I'd be perfectly fine with them leveling squishing to 60 and that's where everyone stays.

When I started playing WOW in 2003-2004 the old addage was "Just level and then the real game starts". Implying that leveling is just a means to an end. And that's precisely what it's become, a means to an end no one wants to wait to get to.

11/04/2018 06:11 AMPosted by Metrohaha
Ya I'll put my vote down for just no more leveling period after bfa. We got almost nothing from actually doing it this time, and there are so many ways to circumvent it it just seems like an afterthough.

A level squish would be nice but people can't get past what they "feel" with current systems compared to the facts, so no clue how leveling squishes could ever be received well.

People will just act like it takes longer no matter what they do.

I don't really see any benefit to it at this point, but I totally agree that leveling is getting pointless at the high end.
Sarcasmic is actually pointing out something that is actually working for an MMO. I also play GW2 and have all lvl 80 toons (which is the max level in the game). What Arenanet did was just add more competitive content based around that current level without making the combat ridiculous. They also added new maps with new stories and combined different types of "enhancements" that have added new options for players.

"Continue to evolve and customize your level-80 character with a new elite specialization for each profession. With a new variety of playstyles, weapon choices, and traits to choose from, there are more options than ever to play your way."

This idea is part of Elite Specializations, which happens to be tied to each class, but gives each class one new specialization that helps the player customize their character and play style more. Bliz seems to have removed this type of customization from all the classes which has made it more difficult for folks to play their classes without penalty. Currently I can't really do much with my alt Shaman elemental spec because its so broken. So I've got her parked in Boralus collecting dust.
11/04/2018 06:50 AMPosted by Valynx
3) how do we give a sustainable illusion of eternal growth and progression without the sheer weight of history bogging characters down (painlessly pruning numbers and ability collections down to what's significant)


You had me until that particular phrase right there.

Abilities have already been pruned past the brink of sanity, and we already can go for massive spans while leveling all to the tune of absolutely nothing. For two expansions now, we've gotten no new talents or abilities at max level (and no, artifact weapons don't count, those were temporary and slated to die before we even got ahold of them) making even reaching the "finish line" a disappointment. If anything, we need more abilities, not less.

These could take the form of upgraded replacement versions of earlier abilities so as not to result in the terrifying, horrifying, mortifying "button bloat" the devs are so obsessed over, but we absolutely do NOT need fewer abilities at this point.


My point is that the distribution of new abilities is inevitably a part of the whole discussion of leveling.

If there exists an optimal number of abilities for basic play through advanced play then eventually we reach a threshold where we have reached that optimum. And then, as more expansions are added, either we can never add new abilities, our optimal rotation emerges out of an ever-increasing collection of obsolete junk or else we reach a point where every time a new ability is added, an old one needs to be removed.

(I'm not advocating an opinion on whether the current size of spellbooks is optimal or not)
Real problem? "Raid, M+, or die" that keeps driving higher difficulties, class changes, and talents. Not playable MMO game world content. The tail, wags the dog. What they're doing is a token nod at "leveling", mostly to eke the sparse outer gameworld content out longer. While at the same time, wanting to push us quickly into raids/M+...so starter epics rain from the sky, rather than a standard gearing/power progression via grinding dungeons, questing, crafting, etc. End result, is that few are happy. Not the casuals such as myself, and not the people here to raid/M+ as their preferred playstyle.
Squish it. Squish it all back down to 60.

Lvl 120 and current gear levels is just stupid.

By next xpac we will be right back to ilvl 800-900.
A level squish sounds like a good idea, but can you even imagine how much stuff that would break in the game?

The stat squish broke a lot by itself. A level squish would be an entirely different beast.
11/04/2018 08:33 AMPosted by Tattalia
11/04/2018 08:33 AMPosted by Shyeer
...

It looks more like they were muted than deleted, because it seems they are being restored now.

Dislikes are also back around the three hundred thousand mark.


The dislikes were never brought back, some of those dislikes are new dislikes.


I don't believe dislikes can be restored. I do know there were some reports of live people having to go back and re-dislike the original video after the 100k vanished.
I think a divide by 2 right before the next xpac hits would be perfect, get everyone back down to 60. I would also love to see the zones scale enough to that I can level up to the current expansion in Kalmindor and Eastern kingdoms
I support level squish.
11/04/2018 08:43 AMPosted by Byniri
A level squish sounds like a good idea, but can you even imagine how much stuff that would break in the game?


You mean kind of like how doing heavy redesigns of 36 specs every 2 years causes issues?

You mean like how the old, neglected, outdated content has bugs that haven't been fixed in 5 to 10 years already?

Yeah, bugs are going to happen regardless but a level squish would improve character progression and the leveling experience a lot and be much less daunting for new and returning players.
Raise the floor instead of lowering the ceiling?
Here's my feedback on level squish.

Not just NO

But Hell NO

Next you'll ask me if i have a phone.
I say start each xpac at level 1, and make all old content optional, but still have it so you can level to max level doing old content with incentives/rewards for doing so.
If you don't want a level squish, what do you propose?
Thank you for your feedback, everyone.

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