Chose sides in 8.1 will destroy the Horde

Story Forum
That may be the point.

Make the Horde so putrid and unplayable, it may effect the Player Balance.

If the Horde becomes the vile, vomitous band of honorless defilers it appears to be - it may effect a player balance for the more congenial folk.
11/12/2018 11:30 AMPosted by Cursewords
That may be the point.

Make the Horde so putrid and unplayable, it may effect the Player Balance.

If the Horde becomes the vile, vomitous band of honorless defilers it appears to be - it may effect a player balance for the more congenial folk.


But we won't play Alliance. We'll just stop playing.
11/11/2018 07:34 PMPosted by Akhinos
This is the oath that every member of the Horde makes upon entering the faction.
I don't recall ever doing that, and wouldn't consider it binding if I did.
People make a big deal over story choices in WoW, but it ultimately won't be as big a deal as they're making it unless the narrative is entirely contained to the individual - like SWTOR's individual class storylines. WoW doesn't lend itself to story choices like that.
11/11/2018 08:48 PMPosted by Darethy
11/11/2018 08:45 PMPosted by Kisin
To be honest, the Warchief position is in dire need of a means of deposing a violent dictator that doesn't involve one on one combat to the death.

That isn't even a good system of governance for a small tribe, let alone a world superpower.


At least it isn't hereditary.
say what you want, but our leaders dont go insane like your warchief
11/12/2018 11:57 AMPosted by Withpuppys
11/11/2018 08:48 PMPosted by Darethy
...

At least it isn't hereditary.
say what you want, but our leaders dont go insane like your warchief


Nah, Genn Greymane alone shows how faulty hereditary rulers can be. Whatever amends he makes now, there's little doubt that Genn was a terrible ruler, and in general perhaps just a terrible person throughout much of his life.
11/11/2018 07:34 PMPosted by Akhinos
"Lok'tar ogar! Victory or death - it is these words that bind me to the Horde. For they are the most sacred and fundamental of truths to any warrior of the Horde.

I give my flesh and blood freely to the Warchief. I am the instrument of my Warchief's desire. I am a weapon of my Warchief's command.

From this moment until the end of days I live and die - For the Horde!"

This is the oath that every member of the Horde makes upon entering the faction. From the point of view of honor and loyalty Blizzard is exposing me to an impossible choice. If I choose Sylvannas I will lose my honor, since she fights in an abject way. If I remain on the side of Saurfang, I will betray my sacred oath, and I will also lose my honor and be an outcast unable to keep a sacred oath.

The only way this quest makes sense is if Blizzard let us the opportunity to have a chainquest where we can challenge Sylvannas to mak'gora.

Even if I were defeated and probably would be, this would be the only way in accordance with the Horde code of my character to preserve some honor. I do not want to pratice a plot, I do not want to be a pawn in the hands of Anduin, I want as an orc to make a decision that makes me worthy to use the Horde banner. I'm not in a game of Game of Thrones, where the narrative is to arm state coups 4 times a day, I'm in warcraft, and honor is everything in the life of an orc, without it no matter if I'm on the wrong side or right. Even because if I could have chosen before my character would have died long ago with Nazgrim in MOP.


you say all of that as though it were a bad thing of the horde were gone...
i do not understand this!
To be fair, I reckon the Alliance could potentially get a cool choice between siding with the Night elves (Tyrande) on how they should rebel the Horde vs the Humans (Anduin) way of doing it.[quote]

I wouldn't mind being given a real choice like that, rather than between and "evil" Horde and a "subservient" Horde. I would even prefer the Alliance got such choice and we just weren't made evil.

[quote] Only difference is, it would be way more interesting than this rehash MOP exp the horde is getting at the moment. That being said, it's still kinda obvious Sylvanas will be replaced from being a warchief by the end of BFA regardless of the choice.


Yeah, it is Garrosh 2.0. You know, the plot we kept saying we didn't want?
11/12/2018 12:05 PMPosted by Darethy
11/12/2018 11:57 AMPosted by Withpuppys
...say what you want, but our leaders dont go insane like your warchief


Nah, Genn Greymane alone shows how faulty hereditary rulers can be. Whatever amends he makes now, there's little doubt that Genn was a terrible ruler, and in general perhaps just a terrible person throughout much of his life.


If you are looking at flaws in hereditary rule, look at Arthas.
11/12/2018 07:29 AMPosted by Losimar
You have no idea what I'd kill for the chance to make choices on the alliance side. Be freaking happy Hordies you actually have an option

11/12/2018 07:31 AMPosted by Solythn
Ah, yes. Being forced to choose between two utterly terrible options that are both basically the end of the faction.

Love that sweet, sweet bias.

This is how I feel about the entire faction bias debate. One side wants what the other doesn't.

Give the alliance the civil war and choice between genn and anduin. Give the horde the blind unity to someone they have no reason to support.
So sick of being forced to turn on horde heroes because they got handed the villain ball.
As long as i can chose the beach option i'm fine, me old orc, me tired.
If I could do a scenario with Saurfand and kill Sylvanias I would faction change all my character immediately just to kill her. Such a terrible horrible Mary Sue Character with such immense amounts of plot armor it makes me sick.
Not even Sylvanas fans want this stupid choice. The dialogue is ‘I will not betray my warchief’, when that is a very narrow reason for not supporting Saurfang compared to the wide and diverse rationales I have seen on this forum alone.

Sylvanas deserves better. The Horde deserves better. The players and player characters deserve better. Having a choice is no blessing when both options are awful.
It probably won’t come to that. Sylvanas will betray us first.
11/12/2018 11:24 AMPosted by Tannaril
11/12/2018 07:29 AMPosted by Losimar
You have no idea what I'd kill for the chance to make choices on the alliance side. Be freaking happy Hordies you actually have an option


You know, if this expansion had been about making Jaina an evil villain, having a choice to oppose her would not have done much to stem the outrage.


That stems from around 6 years of Blizzard writing themselves into a corner by carefully sanding down anything seen as a sharp edge in our faction leadership. At this point, anything other than goody goodness or, at worst, righteous vengeance after being harmed coming from our established names is just out of character.

I'd love for Matthias Shaw to do the "rogue secret agency" thing and become a major villain.

Imagine reversing the order of the capital cities by having Shaw severely overreact to some skirmishing over azerite: He ahs the players detonate plague reserves and drown undercity. And he strikes first.

BAM! Justified War of Thorns, sylvanas angry and the horde happy about it, Alliance get to have an action man, the villain isn't just a genocidal maniac, and the new need for reinforcements and action can still drive us to Kul Tiras/Zandalar.
11/12/2018 07:31 AMPosted by Dalfurane
Alliance plays a MMO.

Horde plays a MMORPG. Be thankful for those story choices.


No.

I cannot be any clearer about this: I would rather have one reasonably competently told story that two terrible ones.
11/11/2018 07:34 PMPosted by Akhinos
"Lok'tar ogar! Victory or death - it is these words that bind me to the Horde. For they are the most sacred and fundamental of truths to any warrior of the Horde.

I give my flesh and blood freely to the Warchief. I am the instrument of my Warchief's desire. I am a weapon of my Warchief's command.

From this moment until the end of days I live and die - For the Horde!"
This oath has literally never once, literally not one single time, ever been sworn to Sylvanas "I hate the Horde" Windrunner.
Well, of course not. It's a terrible oath. Orcs are not good writers.
Imagine if the lesson they take from all this is that they will never give players a choice ever again.
11/12/2018 07:15 PMPosted by Xoroth
Imagine if the lesson they take from all this is that they will never give players a choice ever again.
I'd be game. I don't trust us.

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