Turrets aren't Fun!!!

Battle for Azeroth Items and Classes
10/31/2018 07:16 AMPosted by Sybille
I think the best turret design in the game was the old Marksman hunter Patient Sniper passive. After the player stood still for three seconds they got a damage boost. If they moved the buff would drop after six seconds. This allowed the player to adjust position in fights as mechanics demanded and not lose DPS (as long as they limited movement to under three seconds). If the player moved constantly when it wasn’t needed they then suffered. I think it was a 5% buff.

The design was ok, but they put it on a class that was known for kiting.
PvE has movement downtime - PvP doesn't.
10/30/2018 05:22 PMPosted by Kaloran
10/30/2018 04:07 AMPosted by Airese
Remember the days when range were more mobile and able to cast on the move more?

It created the issue of range dominating PvP and PvE?

So, how do you propose to solve the balance issue?


Giving melee more mobility?

Oh wait, they did that already


Hello, im a ret paladin, i have one mobility spell with 45 sec cd that lasts for 3 seconds. Do i fit in, on the "they gave melee more mobility group"?
Typically, casters deal the most damage because their drawback is that they cannot move while casting. So they make up for it by dealing heavy damage.

If they make casters be able to move, defeats the purpose of casters. What they should do is buff casters in general. So the damage actually makes up for not being able to move
Some specs and spells that could be changed to cast while moving and not really break much:

Warlock:
Demo- shadow bolt
Destro- incinerate

Shaman
Ele- lightning bolt

Priest
Shadow- mind flay

Mages have shimmer and a decent amount of instant damage so I think we are ok. I know fire has scorch and arcane has the talent where you can move and cast arcane missiles with clearcasting procs.

Affliction doesn’t need any cast while move.

Not sure about balance Druid but I think they are ok.

Mm hunters could use a cd or something that makes aim shot castable while moving for a short time.
11/01/2018 08:17 PMPosted by Azulla
Mm hunters could use a cd or something that makes aim shot castable while moving for a short time.


All that MM needs is chimera shot and kill shot and they're set forever.
While balancing is definitely a large part of the issue, the title of my post remains my biggest problem. It isn't fun to have no ability to do anything when you have to move. The fun of playing your character is using your tools to respond to different situations. When your toolkit is empty, it just takes a lot of the fun out of the game.

Current encounter design makes movement a part of pretty much every boss, and quite often trash as well. It isn't fun to just run away from things, and have no way to do damage (or healing for that matter) until you stop running.

It isn't fun. Period.
10/31/2018 03:13 PMPosted by Kyarïna
Hello, im a ret paladin, i have one mobility spell with 45 sec cd that lasts for 3 seconds. Do i fit in, on the "they gave melee more mobility group"?


Yes. Unless you can't use abilities while moving and moving resets your autoattack swing timer. Otherwise sit down.
10/31/2018 03:13 PMPosted by Kyarïna
10/30/2018 05:22 PMPosted by Kaloran
...

Giving melee more mobility?

Oh wait, they did that already


Hello, im a ret paladin, i have one mobility spell with 45 sec cd that lasts for 3 seconds. Do i fit in, on the "they gave melee more mobility group"?
You also have...

Freedom
A talent that adds another charge of DS.

Yes you do.
As a shadow priest there is nothing more anjoyable than channeling mind flay, the only slow we have. Which is working wonderfully as slow applies only while channeling, giving us huge window to line up pops before enemy gets to us. Pvp wise.

Sarcasm.
Turreting (is that a word?) USED to be fun as affliction "back in the day".
With soul link, and several dots that would heal us and our pet, both,
and powerful AOE and single target drains, my main warlock could "stand in the fire" all day long and still pump out decent dps, and I always snickered at healers yelling at me but my health never dropped to zero and I was always back up at full by encounter end.

I was HAPPY to have less dps than mages - I think that's as it SHOULD be -
and EXCITED as the payoff was massive survivability.

I'd pick one spot and rarely move (unless insta-wipe mechanic of course)
and do just fine.

Loved it. Would do almost anything to have that level of survivability
and drain tanking back again <sigh>.
classes designed to do best when standing still are !@#$ing stupid and archaic, nix this design idea indefinitely
Imagine being a turret (ELE) and doing less dps and having lower survibility than a purely mobile spec (BM).
10/31/2018 02:59 PMPosted by Runsinshadow
10/31/2018 07:16 AMPosted by Sybille
I think the best turret design in the game was the old Marksman hunter Patient Sniper passive. After the player stood still for three seconds they got a damage boost. If they moved the buff would drop after six seconds. This allowed the player to adjust position in fights as mechanics demanded and not lose DPS (as long as they limited movement to under three seconds). If the player moved constantly when it wasn’t needed they then suffered. I think it was a 5% buff.

The design was ok, but they put it on a class that was known for kiting.
PvE has movement downtime - PvP doesn't.


If you used your tools properly, you could keep a good uptime of the buff while kiting. It was a skill-based mastery.

11/01/2018 09:49 PMPosted by Beefköw
11/01/2018 08:17 PMPosted by Azulla
Mm hunters could use a cd or something that makes aim shot castable while moving for a short time.


All that MM needs is chimera shot and kill shot and they're set forever.


Aspect of the fox wouldn't break us either
11/08/2018 04:33 PMPosted by Rakruwah
classes designed to do best when standing still are !@#$ing stupid and archaic, nix this design idea indefinitely
Only 1 problem though.

They want warlocks to be 'immobile', because somehow that's the 'best' way to make warlocks different from mages.

If being a warlock means being a special kind of design to be stuck as a turret, that's fine.

Just care to explain how does a fragile and immobile turret is suppose to function?
There's too much focus on movement and other twitch "mechanics", because combat itself was gutted (no threat, no resource/consumable management to speak of, no real burn phases, etc). This is their way of making fights challenging now, and casters that actually cast, hardly work there.

There's nothing wrong with low mobility, it's good to have differently designed classes instead of everyone spazzing around, but such classes don't fit inside of the one-dimensional combat design of today.
The turret class design works when the entire game is built with that in Mind. Take the Sniper from Star Wars, they are the definition of a turret. However, they are one of the most functional and complete classes in the game.

When they turret, the activate it, and or use their mobility skill which ends with them crouched and in their turret formation so to speak. While there, they cannot be charged, pulled, or interrupted. It also grants them a passive buff that allows them to see through stealth, that grows stronger the longer they are standing still.

Their main CD makes them immune to all CC, while hunkered down. It also allows them when used creatively to skip/ignore some raid mechanics in the game and keep DPS.

Sadly none of the classes in WoW use anything like this. Ultimately the design for WoWs turrets is rather broken. As in WoW for a turret to function and be useful they would either need to have the highest burst damage, or sustain damage in the entire game. Sadly I don't see that happening.

WoW Devs really need to rethink what it means to be a turret at this point and there is often very little reward for choosing that spec or class at this point.
10/30/2018 04:07 AMPosted by Airese
Remember the days when range were more mobile and able to cast on the move more?

It created the issue of range dominating PvP and PvE?

So, how do you propose to solve the balance issue?


make melee do more damage to make up for them having to run out for mechanics?
I'm sorry but nobody likes being a turret that is only useful on select fights. MOP had the best ranged class design.
11/08/2018 07:02 PMPosted by Fairyland
11/08/2018 04:33 PMPosted by Rakruwah
classes designed to do best when standing still are !@#$ing stupid and archaic, nix this design idea indefinitely
Only 1 problem though.

They want warlocks to be 'immobile', because somehow that's the 'best' way to make warlocks different from mages.

If being a warlock means being a special kind of design to be stuck as a turret, that's fine.

Just care to explain how does a fragile and immobile turret is suppose to function?
Exactly. They nerfed our survivability too much in bfa. My demon armor does almost nothing now. Drain life doesn't heal us much and also as a channel is mostly useless.

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