Conflicted, to support Sylvanas in 8.1?

Story Forum
11/13/2018 11:57 PMPosted by Verlius
I don't think I've ever heard a horde fan say that they wanted or liked what happened with Voljin. It seems to be universally hated that voljin got killed so pointlessly, which may be why he is starting to return.


I don't see him returning though, he's nothing more than Terenas Menethil really. Terenas Menethil told us the story of Frostmore, I feel Vol'jin will tell us about how evil Sylvanas is and or some other great evil.
11/14/2018 12:02 AMPosted by Arazlok
11/13/2018 11:57 PMPosted by Verlius
I don't think I've ever heard a horde fan say that they wanted or liked what happened with Voljin. It seems to be universally hated that voljin got killed so pointlessly, which may be why he is starting to return.


I don't see him returning though, he's nothing more than Terenas Menethil really. Terenas Menethil told us the story of Frostmore, I feel Vol'jin will tell us about how evil Sylvanas is and or some other great evil.


The comments implying he has become something greater give me hope for him, although I understand your concern.
11/12/2018 06:40 PMPosted by Mustakraken
Just popping my head in here to say I love that nearly half of this thread was occupied by philosophical ranting from Legacy of Kain earlier in the day.

Although I have no idea how Treng thinks Saurfang could compare to the titular Kain and that somehow be a good thing.
I don't.
11/11/2018 04:51 PMPosted by Grimdy
In the upcoming patch, 8.1, I'm not sure what to do about Sylvanas, and I'm sharing it here for reflection.

I've played all 14 years of WoW and most of it on Alliance, but I switched to Horde for the first time in earnest after I saw the video where Sylvanas and Lordaeron were attacked. In the context of that video her words spoke to me when she observed we've forgotten what it means to be strong. I felt ashamed at the war monger Greymane and the insecure boy-king. unjustly marching on the dark lady (my dwarf has had a crush on her since forever).

I changed sides.

I parked my Alliance characters and leveled a Highmountain Tauren. Then I learned Teldrassil was burned by the Horde, and I felt they must have a good reason, or maybe there was an azerite-like accident. When I played the initial scenario for BFA I chose not to spray Horde soldiers as I was also Horde. I saw the full video where Sylvanas tweaks out and decides to try and crush the hopes of the Night Elves by burning the tree down in addition to cutting off their seafaring logistics. And I empathized with Saurfang, always have ever since raiding ICC and fighting his son.

Soon I have a difficult choice to make. I must choose which version of the Horde I want to see. And that's the problem, I want Saurfang's vision of the Horde under Sylvanas' leadership.

She has always been the one to make somewhat subtle moves, a chess player rather than a battering ram. Her boldness with the Warchief title does fit. I've heard what she's done in books and I realize my perspective on what defines her is not reflected in all of her actions.

I truly don't know who to back. I want redemption for Sylvanas but being asked to vote before I'm sure she can be redeemed makes me worry that choosing to support her will be siding with her moral values which I also cannot do.


My issue with Sylvanas MIGHT have something to do with the fact she's you know...murdering her own troops for convenience?

That she kinda wants to kill everyone and turn them into undead? And I'm not in a mood to help the season 2 of the Walking Scourge, we had enough of that on Warcraft 3
Woooo, welcome to BfA where nobody knows what they want and nothing knows what it wants to be.
I main Alliance but I also play Horde since I like to appreciate both sides of the story/conflict (if you wanna even call it that).

That being said, even though I don't like Saurfang being the one to represent the second "rebellion" against Sylvannas, he is the lesser of two evils for me, so I will pick him. Sylvannas is a good character and her personality and ruthless tactics fit in perfectly with her undead status. So when she says that when you're dead, nothing matters anymore but getting what you want and need, I'm inclined to believe her even if I begrudge the more unsavory things she does. However, I do no appreciate her and her Horde treating me as a pawn and not as an equal. I'm supposed to be the hero, the one they rely on to fight off apocalyptic events and the writer's expect me to bow to the whims of a creature that does not even respect me enough to not lie to me and thinks me a complete idiot. She can do whatever she wants to the Horde but I'm not going to allow myself to be her mewling pet.

I'm nobody's pawn.
11/11/2018 08:17 PMPosted by Zamari
11/11/2018 05:39 PMPosted by Darethy


Victrix causa deis placuit sed Victa Catoni


"Vitrix causa Sylvanas, placuit sed Victa Elune."

"Though Sylvanas favored the victorious side, the vanquished are favored by Elune."

Sums up the War of the Thorns nicely.


people are actually speaking Latin...

Tony Stark would be proud XD

11/11/2018 08:30 PMPosted by Xisa


And most importantly, if you're Alliance (especially if you're a Night Elf player), go kill yourself, because you don't matter, and you have no place in this story.


bad idea we'd just get rezzed O.O
11/14/2018 06:19 AMPosted by Calixto
Woooo, welcome to BfA where nobody knows what they want and nothing knows what it wants to be.
I main Alliance but I also play Horde since I like to appreciate both sides of the story/conflict (if you wanna even call it that).

That being said, even though I don't like Saurfang being the one to represent the second "rebellion" against Sylvannas, he is the lesser of two evils for me, so I will pick him. Sylvannas is a good character and her personality and ruthless tactics fit in perfectly with her undead status. So when she says that when you're dead, nothing matters anymore but getting what you want and need, I'm inclined to believe her even if I begrudge the more unsavory things she does. However, I do no appreciate her and her Horde treating me as a pawn and not as an equal. I'm supposed to be the hero, the one they rely on to fight off apocalyptic events and the writer's expect me to bow to the whims of a creature that does not even respect me enough to not lie to me and thinks me a complete idiot. She can do whatever she wants to the Horde but I'm not going to allow myself to be her mewling pet.

I'm nobody's pawn.
Another thing to think about is Legion elevated the players to the leaders of their own class halls that consist of members of both factions. Why would i fight other members of the Earthen Ring because Sylvanas ordered me to? I shouldn't have to take orders from her anymore, much less be a pawn. The transition to this faction war following Legion was so abrupt and nonsensical.

Don't get me wrong, though. I hated being the leader of my Order Hall. I preferred the days when player characters were more or less anonymous adventurers and not major political and/or military powers.
Unfortunately, you switched while Blizzard was pretending they weren't go to make Sylvanas a villain.

The bottom line is that it is clear that Teldrassil is how Blizzard is not defining Sylvanas. If you are ready for more of that, then she is fine. Though it will mean you have play through putting up with the other side of the righteous vengeance plot Blizzard is giving to the Alliance.

You also empathize with Saurfang, that would have to playing through the "noble heart of the Horde", though you will have to put up with Mary Sue Andiun being behind it all and the implicit assumption that the Alliance has never done anything wrong.
11/11/2018 05:37 PMPosted by Bargrand
That this is even up for debate disturbs me. Any redeeming qualities Sylvanas had died after Wrath.


Well, it comes down to the idea that Blizzard didn't see making Sylvanas burn Teldrassil as making her evil. They have her a rationale (we didn't get Malfurion, so she needed another way to sap Alliance will to fight), apparently they felt we would play through patch 8.0 enjoying it all. And it is not like they have been willing to make Jaina a noble hero after trying to do exactly what Sylvanas did.

The bottom line is that some players are simply going along with the plot and motivations that Blizzard intended for them.
There are many reasons one might pick Sylvanas. Sheer spite toward the story direction seems common. But you need to think of how these votes, without context of the person behind them, mean to Blizzard


I have thought about supporting Sylvanas for reasons I couldn't name. This is it! And you are right that Blizzard will just see it as validation.
11/13/2018 10:10 PMPosted by Hahahahahaha
Vol'jin was never allowed to be a proper Warchief.
Hey, he showed up that ONE time to say "nice boats". As his single accomplishment as Warchief, he was correct that they were nice boats. So he has a 100% win rate.


In the end, if he had remained warchief, Blizzard would have had to make him evil. After all, its the only plot they have for the Horde.

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