Why "No Changes" isn't enough.

Classic Discussion
11/13/2018 05:00 PMPosted by Proxy
11/13/2018 10:21 AMPosted by Brockthorn
Vanilla had 3 AH's. Each was separate until patch 1.9 when they got linked.


I keep reading this, but I played from open beta to the end of BC and I honest to god do not remember there being separate auction houses in the other capitols. I remember there being a booty bay auction house that was a waste of time. And I remember them putting the undercity auctioneers in. Just kinda jammed in a spot that doesn't really look auction-y at all. But I swear they never had auctioneers in the undercity until they introduced "linked" auction houses as a way to try and keep Org/IF from being congested lag-fests.


Gadgetzan had a separate auction house, but that's all I'm aware of.
11/13/2018 05:05 PMPosted by Vøøðøø
Gadgetzan had a separate auction house, but that's all I'm aware of.


I feel like I'm witnessing this weird thing where people who never experienced a thing have taken an incorrect assumption and made it 'fact' when it's actually not true at all...

In fact, with some savvy google-fu:

from https://www.engadget.com/2011/08/16/wow-archivist-patch-1-9-the-gates-of-ahnqiraj-part-2/

"For a little over a year after the game's launch, World of Warcraft didn't have linked auction houses. The Horde's auction house was found in Orgrimmar, and the Alliance's auction house sat in Ironforge. You couldn't do your shopping in Undercity or Stormwind or any other location. You were tethered to the unofficial capital cities of your faction."

See, I'm not crazy.
these were powerful words
11/13/2018 05:16 PMPosted by Proxy
11/13/2018 05:05 PMPosted by Vøøðøø
Gadgetzan had a separate auction house, but that's all I'm aware of.


I feel like I'm witnessing this weird thing where people who never experienced a thing have taken an incorrect assumption and made it 'fact' when it's actually not true at all...

In fact, with some savvy google-fu:

from https://www.engadget.com/2011/08/16/wow-archivist-patch-1-9-the-gates-of-ahnqiraj-part-2/

"For a little over a year after the game's launch, World of Warcraft didn't have linked auction houses. The Horde's auction house was found in Orgrimmar, and the Alliance's auction house sat in Ironforge. You couldn't do your shopping in Undercity or Stormwind or any other location. You were tethered to the unofficial capital cities of your faction."

See, I'm not crazy.

except they are using 1.12 so that is already fixed.
11/13/2018 05:16 PMPosted by Proxy
11/13/2018 05:05 PMPosted by Vøøðøø
Gadgetzan had a separate auction house, but that's all I'm aware of.


I feel like I'm witnessing this weird thing where people who never experienced a thing have taken an incorrect assumption and made it 'fact' when it's actually not true at all...

In fact, with some savvy google-fu:

from https://www.engadget.com/2011/08/16/wow-archivist-patch-1-9-the-gates-of-ahnqiraj-part-2/

"For a little over a year after the game's launch, World of Warcraft didn't have linked auction houses. The Horde's auction house was found in Orgrimmar, and the Alliance's auction house sat in Ironforge. You couldn't do your shopping in Undercity or Stormwind or any other location. You were tethered to the unofficial capital cities of your faction."

See, I'm not crazy.


1.9 patch notes..they didn't add them..they linked them.
Trade chat also got linked between the cities.
Up until 1.9 they were separate.
We're starting with 1.12 ..all the changes are in there.

http://wowwiki.wikia.com/wiki/Patch_1.9.0
Players will now be able to buy and sell goods with greater effectiveness using the Linked Auction House system. Auction Houses in Orgrimmar, Undercity, and Thunder Bluff will now share the same pool of Horde player-created auctions, and Alliance players will find the same to be true when visiting Ironforge, Stormwind City, and Darnassus Auction Houses. This system has been expanded to support the neutral Auction Houses as well. Tanaris, Everlook, and Booty Bay will all be linked for players of both factions to access.
11/13/2018 05:23 PMPosted by Brockthorn
11/13/2018 05:16 PMPosted by Proxy
...

I feel like I'm witnessing this weird thing where people who never experienced a thing have taken an incorrect assumption and made it 'fact' when it's actually not true at all...

In fact, with some savvy google-fu:

from https://www.engadget.com/2011/08/16/wow-archivist-patch-1-9-the-gates-of-ahnqiraj-part-2/

"For a little over a year after the game's launch, World of Warcraft didn't have linked auction houses. The Horde's auction house was found in Orgrimmar, and the Alliance's auction house sat in Ironforge. You couldn't do your shopping in Undercity or Stormwind or any other location. You were tethered to the unofficial capital cities of your faction."

See, I'm not crazy.


1.9 patch notes..they didn't add them..they linked them.
Trade chat also got linked between the cities.
Up until 1.9 they were separate.
We're starting with 1.12 ..all the changes are in there.

http://wowwiki.wikia.com/wiki/Patch_1.9.0
Players will now be able to buy and sell goods with greater effectiveness using the Linked Auction House system. Auction Houses in Orgrimmar, Undercity, and Thunder Bluff will now share the same pool of Horde player-created auctions, and Alliance players will find the same to be true when visiting Ironforge, Stormwind City, and Darnassus Auction Houses. This system has been expanded to support the neutral Auction Houses as well. Tanaris, Everlook, and Booty Bay will all be linked for players of both factions to access.


Dude... Did you not read the sourced info I quoted and linked? They added auction houses to Stormwind, Darnassus, Thunder Bluff, and Undercity AND linked them to their respective factions current auction houses in Ironforge and Orgrimmar.

I was there. I remember this. I remember there suddenly being auctioneers on those platforms in the hallway between the center and quarters of the undercity and thinking "That's a dumb place put 'em."
11/13/2018 05:53 PMPosted by Proxy
11/13/2018 05:23 PMPosted by Brockthorn
...

1.9 patch notes..they didn't add them..they linked them.
Trade chat also got linked between the cities.
Up until 1.9 they were separate.
We're starting with 1.12 ..all the changes are in there.

http://wowwiki.wikia.com/wiki/Patch_1.9.0
Players will now be able to buy and sell goods with greater effectiveness using the Linked Auction House system. Auction Houses in Orgrimmar, Undercity, and Thunder Bluff will now share the same pool of Horde player-created auctions, and Alliance players will find the same to be true when visiting Ironforge, Stormwind City, and Darnassus Auction Houses. This system has been expanded to support the neutral Auction Houses as well. Tanaris, Everlook, and Booty Bay will all be linked for players of both factions to access.


Dude... Did you not read the sourced info I quoted and linked? They added auction houses to Stormwind, Darnassus, Thunder Bluff, and Undercity AND linked them to their respective factions current auction houses in Ironforge and Orgrimmar.

I was there. I remember this. I remember there suddenly being auctioneers on those platforms in the hallway between the center and quarters of the undercity and thinking "That's a dumb place put 'em."

Dude did you not read what I posted? They are using 1.12 so this is a complete non issue no matter who is right.
11/13/2018 05:54 PMPosted by Lorissa
Dude did you not read what I posted? They are using 1.12 so this is a complete non issue no matter who is right.


If you find it irrelevant, then why interject? just don't read it. I care that I'm right. It matters a little to me.
Also the idea that two people can be opposed on something that happened in classic like whether or not all cities had auction houses at launch does give an example of how hard it will be to accurately recreate vanilla wow even from a strictly "no changes" mindset, which is the subject of the thread
Devil's advocate here, but if you don't want pigeonholed gameplay, you probably don't want to raid. I get what you're saying, you want freedom with your talents, but you are still basically required to play a specific spec if you want to do much endgame with any particular class.
11/13/2018 06:07 PMPosted by Proxy
11/13/2018 05:54 PMPosted by Lorissa
Dude did you not read what I posted? They are using 1.12 so this is a complete non issue no matter who is right.


If you find it irrelevant, then why interject? just don't read it. I care that I'm right. It matters a little to me.
Also the idea that two people can be opposed on something that happened in classic like whether or not all cities had auction houses at launch does give an example of how hard it will be to accurately recreate vanilla wow even from a strictly "no changes" mindset, which is the subject of the thread

You missed the point completely...they are not trying to recreate vanilla wow. They are trying to get close to 1.12 as they have a backup and data set from 1.12 to go by. That is why they will be able to get as close as the feel like. They have already said they are going to back out some of the changes and raids like zg until the 1st update.
There will be no base vanilla period!

Also the official patch notes for 1.9
"Linked Auction Houses
Players will now be able to buy and sell goods with greater effectiveness using the Linked Auction House system. Auction Houses in Orgrimmar, Undercity, and Thunder Bluff will now share the same pool of Horde player-created auctions, and Alliance players will find the same to be true when visiting Ironforge, Stormwind City, and Darnassus Auction Houses. This system has been expanded to support the neutral Auction Houses as well. Tanaris, Everlook, and Booty Bay will all be linked for players of both factions to access. In addition, the "Looking for Group" and "Trade" channels have been unified among the corresponding cities, meaning, for example, that you can trade your goods or look for groups in Ironforge while in Stormwind."
11/13/2018 06:09 PMPosted by Dreadsteer
Devil's advocate here, but if you don't want pigeonholed gameplay, you probably don't want to raid. I get what you're saying, you want freedom with your talents, but you are still basically required to play a specific spec if you want to do much endgame with any particular class.


He might not want to raid. I think the idea that "if you're not working on/toward 'endgame content' then you're not really playing the game and if you're not optimally spec'ed then you're not able to adequately push 'endgame content' ipso facto you must spec optimally or not even bother" is exactly the thing OP is talking about. The culture of warcraft is one of hardcore optimization now where all the answers have been found and made available, and not the culture of wanderlust it was in 2004-2006.
11/13/2018 06:16 PMPosted by Lorissa
You missed the point completely...they are not trying to recreate vanilla wow. They are trying to get close to 1.12 as they have a backup and data set from 1.12 to go by. That is why they will be able to get as close as the feel like. They have already said they are going to back out some of the changes and raids like zg until the 1st update.
There will be no base vanilla period!

I know they are going from 1.12 making this particular issue irrelevant to WoW classic. This thread is about how even if they recreate 1.12 perfectly they will never be able to recapture the feel of original warcraft. I was pointing at to you that two people being very convinced about something happening differently speaks to the fact that 'feel' is amorphous and impossible to capture which; while not relevant to the state of the game in patch 1.12, is relevant to the subject of the thread in my opinion.

11/13/2018 06:16 PMPosted by Lorissa
Also the official patch notes for 1.9
"Linked Auction Houses
Players will now be able to buy and sell goods with greater effectiveness using the Linked Auction House system. Auction Houses in Orgrimmar, Undercity, and Thunder Bluff will now share the same pool of Horde player-created auctions, and Alliance players will find the same to be true when visiting Ironforge, Stormwind City, and Darnassus Auction Houses. This system has been expanded to support the neutral Auction Houses as well. Tanaris, Everlook, and Booty Bay will all be linked for players of both factions to access. In addition, the "Looking for Group" and "Trade" channels have been unified among the corresponding cities, meaning, for example, that you can trade your goods or look for groups in Ironforge while in Stormwind."


I've seen that line from the patch notes quoted like 1000 times. Only IF/Org auction houses existed pre-1.9 they added the others and linked them in 1.9. there were other auction houses in the beta, but those were taken out in beta patch 0.9.

https://www.reddit.com/r/classicwow/comments/7z646z/am_i_the_only_one_who_doesnt_want_linked_auction/dulr0us/

From the 0.9 patch notes via http://wowwiki.wikia.com/wiki/Patch_0.9

Auction House Changes:
Several improvements to the interface have been made.
Auction houses/Auctioneers will now exist only in Ironforge, Orgrimmar, and Booty Bay.

Also corroborating patch notes for 0.9 with explanation on https://www.engadget.com/2011/03/29/wow-archivist-world-of-warcraft-beta-patch-0-9/

"Auction house changes

Last week when we looked at patch 0.8, many of you were confused. "What the heck!" you exclaimed. "They had auction houses in places other than Ironforge and Orgrimmar way back then? Why did they change it, only to add them back later?"

Yes, patch 0.8 added auction houses to every capital city, but none of them were linked. Items you put on the Orgrimmar auction house would not appear on the Undercity auction house or the Thunder Bluff auction house. The same applied for Ironforge, Stormwind, and Darnassus -- all separate. That was extremely confusing and diluted the market. If you wanted to buy Iron Bars and you were in Darnassus, that auction house might not have any, but Ironforge or Stormwind might. You couldn't check without going to each city.

That's why, in patch 0.9, Blizzard removed all but three auction houses. It kept one in Orgrimmar, one in Ironforge, and a neutral auction house in Booty Bay. That's the way it would remain until linked auction houses were added in patch 1.9, nearly two years later in March 2006."

I rest my case.
11/13/2018 05:53 PMPosted by Proxy

Dude... Did you not read the sourced info I quoted and linked? They added auction houses to Stormwind, Darnassus, Thunder Bluff, and Undercity AND linked them to their respective factions current auction houses in Ironforge and Orgrimmar.

I was there. I remember this. I remember there suddenly being auctioneers on those platforms in the hallway between the center and quarters of the undercity and thinking "That's a dumb place put 'em."


Ok..let's back up a bit.
This all started with one poster saying he didn't want to be in Teldrasil because the only AH was in IF.

Classic is starting at 1.12 with all 3 and linked.
Hence my reply that there were 3 AH's.
11/13/2018 08:54 AMPosted by Colburn


We don't just want the features of vanilla, we want the mindset that the world is vast, filled with the unknown, that anything goes, and that any Gnome, Troll, or Tauren can seek his/her fortune and glory if they have but the will to take it.


The only way it will be that huge unexplored world again, if players some how forgot everything they knew and all online resources disappear.
Otherwise it is really not going to be 100% as it was. So, all you have is about 75% nostalgia.
The only other way it works is by finding another new game that would by pure chance turn out to be as good as WoW was. That chance is pretty slim however.
11/13/2018 10:13 AMPosted by Lãrrel
The reason for no change is because no one trusts Blizzard can accomplish a good game any more.


So much this. I used to look forward to new Blizzard games. Now...not so much.

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