Reverse Harm thoughts

Monk
Not that I've done any extensive testing yet, this being more a first impressions view. But does this seem a bit over the top broken to anyone else? Seems a bit like triple dipping, 8% spam able heal that copies as damage and generates chi. Does this effectively remove tiger palm off our bars? I'm having trouble seeing any reason you'd bother using TP with this talent.

Kind of shocked with all the Hybrid healing nerfs that have come out, that they'd bring a healing ability with this much bloat in. Could be entirely wrong, curious how others have considered it.

Fairly disappointed with the talents in general, with the exception of Wind Waker. I'd still rather have a 15-20sec Paralysis than these changes but its something I suppose.
it generates one chi and cost 40 energy, and it has a 5 yard range to repel the damage, so unless you want to use it twice and do about 12k damage to someone and be energy starved and only have 2 chi for one ability then i guarantee its not broken. But i agree para cd and and fof stun would be more prefferred than a insta cast heal, but this does help us.

Considering we flop in one stun without karma if we can port out and get one or two of these it might actually be somewhat viable, even though fort brew is required and disarm most of the time
Reverse harm problem. The damage can’t be directed towards a specific target. Against hunters and other pet classes this will be terrible because most likely the damage component will target the pet. Also in ptr this is bugged and not doing any damage.
The only thing any good to happen for monks in bfa. It will be used exactly how expel harm was used when you aren’t at max hp. But seeing as how it only generates 1 chi it will put you further behind so I see myself using it to generate enough chi for a FoF to get some energy back but who knows.

We had healing spheres in MoP, expel harm was similar to reverse harm but better, it had a short cooldown but generated 2 chi and healed you for a nice amount so it’s tough to say how good it will actually be, WWs already have a tough time landing kills so it’s impossible to trade tp for this reverse harm.

I even use traits that’s empower my tiger palm making my tigerpalm do more damage than blackout kick and I don’t even think any of the other traits are even any good for pvp so I believe this will be fine and the only thing WWs have to look forward too because frankly the other stuff they are giving us doesn’t sound that great.

Edit the sharpen blade stuff sounds cool too but kinda lame, if I wanted to play a warrior I woulda played one. I’ll take a heal over the warrior talents peronally
Reverse harm will neuter your damage at 50% chi.

It's clearly much better than our heal, which wouldnt take much. It's still NOTHING compared to other specs offhealing.

Enhance just had their mana regen nerfed and healing output reduced by 33% in pvp. They can still pump out a couple hundred thousand healing before oom for instant casts and the only offense they lose is purge I believe.

ret can still instantly heal for like 30k for free.

You're talking about WW dealing 12k damage and healing for maybe 24k health for ALL OF YOUR RESOURCES and then being spent for awhile. You couldnt even FoF afterward. You can rising sun kick for a whopping 10k damage if you crit.

You cant make it generate 2 chi or cost less without it replacing tiger palm. Unless they just put it on a short cooldown.

TBH if you slap a 6-10 second cooldown on this and make it generate 2 chi, you might be looking at a solid choice.

The other option is buffing the healing output. Otherwise it looks weak to me. Especially considering turbo fists and wind waker WILL BE MANDATORY for most matches.
Slapping a cooldown on it is the worse thing you can do. Don’t give bliz any bad ideas they come up with enough in their own. This won’t be a huge dps loss because it does as much damage as rising sun kick and generates 1 chi.

I am concerned about dampening since it’s damage is based off the amount it heals.
10/10/2018 09:05 PMPosted by Rßk
Not that I've done any extensive testing yet, this being more a first impressions view. But does this seem a bit over the top broken to anyone else? Seems a bit like triple dipping, 8% spam able heal that copies as damage and generates chi. Does this effectively remove tiger palm off our bars? I'm having trouble seeing any reason you'd bother using TP with this talent.

Kind of shocked with all the Hybrid healing nerfs that have come out, that they'd bring a healing ability with this much bloat in. Could be entirely wrong, curious how others have considered it.

Fairly disappointed with the talents in general, with the exception of Wind Waker. I'd still rather have a 15-20sec Paralysis than these changes but its something I suppose.

I'd still rather a shorter Incap and/or a fist stun over these as well, however im still glad that blizzard atleast is giving us some new stuff that could potentially help with our lack of utility.
Slightly dissapointed in the changes myself, but seeing as to how Expel Harm was my 3rd favorite ability that got pruned from us, im excited to see it come back.

Also, chances are if the damage is crazy on the new Reverse Harm they will just tone it accordingly to make it balanced. Seems like a good new honor talent overall that we could actually use consistantly in arena.
And someone already stated above, Tiger palm will still be more than worth using as it generates 2 Chi and Reverse Harm will only generate 1.
This with healing elixirs would be good, shame its a pvp talent and its a shame it replaces Vivify.

Its like a mix of it and healing spheres, but you can't heal allies? maybe they didn't think it all the way through but at least they are realizing they !@#$ed up.
I think they want to keep hybrid healing toned down, but ww kind of needs self heals cause we dont have much in the way of dmg mitigation.
I don't mind giving up the ability to off heal well if it means i can be little more self sustainable.

Im actually super jazzed about this ability. Expel harm was one of my favourite things about WW.
.....? It could literally do nothing, take 40 energy, and give 1 chi and I'd still consider taking it.

oh no, feared a half mile away, have full energy.
yay 1 more chi while i march back to my target
have full energy by the time i get there

what is this thread
Now that I saw the sharpen blade talent is on ToD only it’s so terrible. Reverse harm will be good if it heals alot and doesn’t require a target. But how in the instance would you heal your team mate if you needed too?
It feels like a spit in the face. It's like Expel Harm, except worse because we have to talent into it and only generates half the chi expel harm did. Blizzard could have just brought Expel Harm back as a baseline ability for WW and gave us healing spheres (from MoP) as a talent.

All in all, it's probably better than what we have now. However, that's not saying a lot because our kit has been gutted and neutered over the course of several xpacs.
10/13/2018 03:48 AMPosted by Omnipotentjc
Now that I saw the sharpen blade talent is on ToD only it’s so terrible. Reverse harm will be good if it heals alot and doesn’t require a target. But how in the instance would you heal your team mate if you needed too?


Just target them?

10/13/2018 03:48 AMPosted by Yangxiaolóng
It feels like a spit in the face. It's like Expel Harm, except worse because we have to talent into it and only generates half the chi expel harm did. Blizzard could have just brought Expel Harm back as a baseline ability for WW and gave us healing spheres (from MoP) as a talent.


Why do people keep saying "REE IT ONLY GENERATE ONE CHIII"

If it heals for the full value and does damage it hits 60% harder than weaving TP/BoK. You generate 1 chi, ok? You also spend 1 Chi when you BoK.

Obviously you need to use Tiger Palm because of Mastery but at a lower energy cost than Tiger Palm and more damage than a TP/BOK in a single global I'm a little lost on the statements like
10/11/2018 07:10 AMPosted by Ultrios
Reverse harm will neuter your damage at 50% chi.


and
10/11/2018 07:10 AMPosted by Ultrios
It's still NOTHING compared to other specs offhealing.


You could heal for 8% of your health every 4 seconds (or heal a teammate) even if you continually starved yourself for energy. As long as your not cc'd , silenced, or out of the 40 yard range, this is actually wrong.
So you will beable to heal your team mates with this? That’s pretty good. But it also requires an enemy target? That’s not so good. You need to be able to cast this without a target or else what’s even the point? You still need to beable to get out of danger and heal. Like port behind a pillar and heal up. I don’t care if it deals damage or not why are you trading being able to heal for a combat damage ability? Why would it be a bad thing for it to not require a target like expel harm did? Sounds like it does a lot of damage so you would be missing out on that but you still need to be able to heal. Or just make it so you don’t have to trade vivify for it atleast.

They really like taking things away without giving anything in return but they really don’t want to just give you anything without losing something, pretty garbage if you ask me.
Also it doesn’t even contribute to combo strike? Lul oh so good...
It's a heal that does damage if someone is nearby. That's all.

  • If you want to heal yourself press the button.
  • If you want to heal your teammate, target them, press the button.
  • If you want it to do damage then make sure someone is within 5 yards for it trigger the damage effect.
  • If the heal crits, the damage crits.
  • Are you just on the infinite complain train or something. Vivify with CTM did nothing but heal you once on an instant cast every 5 - 10 seconds and they are adding a better version of the ability. Now you are complaining they're taking away something you never had to begin with.

    10/13/2018 05:51 AMPosted by Omnipotentjc
    Also it doesn’t even contribute to combo strike? Lul oh so good...


    Did vivify? I really don't understand your outlook on the changes. They're very narrow sighted.

    10/13/2018 05:36 AMPosted by Omnipotentjc
    They really like taking things away without giving anything in return but they really don’t want to just give you anything without losing something, pretty garbage if you ask me.


    What are you losing?
    So just to make it clear. You can heal without a target. If not you are losing the ability to heal out of danger.
    10/13/2018 06:02 AMPosted by Omnipotentjc
    So just to make it clear. You can heal without a target. If not you are losing the ability to heal out of danger.


    https://i.imgur.com/zo0gHmK.jpg

    Yes. You don't need a target to cast reverse harm.

    It'll heal your target if you have one or it'll auto target you if no target is selected
    If it works like any other healing spell if you have an enemy targetted and you use it, it'll just heal yourself.

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