Why was it "easy" for Nost, but hard for Bliz

Classic Discussion
During Blizzcon we were told how challenging (at least that's how it came off) it was for Blizzard to create a working version of Classic... but Nostalrius, with no ties to Blizzard, was able to make a relatively bug free version of Vanilla? When I say "bug free" I know there was "a lot" of issues, but nothing an entire team at Blizzard couldn't fix. Wouldn't it be less work?
Because Blizz

1. Had to go back and find the original source code.
and
2. Rather then fixing the exploits and bugs in 1.12 and adapting the coding to use the modern Blizz infrastructure, they decided to start at 7.3.5 and work backwards.
Doing stuff the right way probably takes longer. Blizzard won't cut any corners and accept mediocre results.
11/13/2018 05:31 PMPosted by Savax
Doing stuff the right way probably takes longer. Blizzard won't cut any corners and accept mediocre results.


Lets wait and see.
A little bit of research and you'd be able to find the answer on your own pretty quickly.

But we're here so I'll answer. Basically it boils down to Blizzard taking a different approach because they didn't want to use the 1.12 client and server setup. They wanted to be able to create something that was more maintainable and manageable. They also wanted it to be free of various bugs and exploits both client and server side; things that will always exist on private servers. And of course, they wanted the game to be on the battle.net client.

Nostalrius and other private servers do not have access to the source code. All they have to go on is what was available from datamining and the 1.12 wow client binaries that one would have on their PC. Basically what that means is that they were much more limited with what they could do.

Despite all the complaints about potential sharding and loot trading, at the end of the day what Blizzard comes up with will be a better experience and will be more true to what vanilla was. It's going to be worth it.
No. You admit

11/13/2018 05:25 PMPosted by Goró
I know there was "a lot" of issues


The reason Blizzard is putting so much work into it is to make a game without those issues. The 16 year old data wasn't meant to run on what they have now. They've replaced the hardware and completely and totally changed battle.net.

Could they put up a semi-functional server like a bunch pirates did in minimal time? Sure!

Would it probably be better than theirs? Almost certainly.

Would it be professional quality and meet a minimum bar of acceptability? Almost certainly not.

So their professionals in running online games decided the most cost effective measure for stability and security was to make the game in the modern client, which takes time to port in and make sure it is accurate to classic.

Lets focus more on getting them to take back or fix their terrible loot trading system instead of asking silly questions.
excuses are like half of business practice for game companies, they can get away with anything when everybody believes it's impossible to do anything
11/13/2018 05:31 PMPosted by Savax
Doing stuff the right way probably takes longer. Blizzard won't cut any corners and accept mediocre results.


BFA
11/13/2018 05:35 PMPosted by Coniferous
11/13/2018 05:31 PMPosted by Savax
Doing stuff the right way probably takes longer. Blizzard won't cut any corners and accept mediocre results.


BFA


The issues with BFA are conceptual. We already know what classic is.
11/13/2018 05:31 PMPosted by Savax
Doing stuff the right way probably takes longer. Blizzard won't cut any corners and accept mediocre results.


But ironically the community that demanded Vanilla (the ones they're catering to) want that mediocre version.
11/13/2018 05:35 PMPosted by Coniferous
11/13/2018 05:31 PMPosted by Savax
Doing stuff the right way probably takes longer. Blizzard won't cut any corners and accept mediocre results.


BFA


I really don't understand why there is so much hate for BFA honestly.. Yea, it's modern WoW and I prefer Classic but it's definitely one of the better expansions. It's a billion times better than WoD but people are acting like it's the worst thing Blizzard ever created. It's not perfect but geez...
11/13/2018 05:38 PMPosted by Goró
11/13/2018 05:31 PMPosted by Savax
Doing stuff the right way probably takes longer. Blizzard won't cut any corners and accept mediocre results.


But ironically the community that demanded Vanilla (the ones they're catering to) want that mediocre version.


If by mediocre you mean the original game, then absolutely.

Kind of stupid to request the ORIGINAL game back, but then ask for it not to be the ORIGINAL game.
11/13/2018 05:25 PMPosted by Goró
During Blizzcon we were told how challenging (at least that's how it came off) it was for Blizzard to create a working version of Classic... but Nostalrius, with no ties to Blizzard, was able to make a relatively bug free version of Vanilla?


Please quit pretending that Nostalrius created their server. The code used for Nostalrius has been developed over YEARS by many people. The devs at Nostalrius started with code that already worked and then tailored it for their needs and fixed more bugs.
You're comparing a professional software company to a bunch of hack jobs?
Because nost did have used a emulator that have ten years old, developed for run a only version of the game without any exploit fix or any big update on backend tecnology.

And more, nost did had issues as down time and long queues that for a free private server is acceptable, but don't for a sub requires original blizz server.
11/13/2018 05:40 PMPosted by Savax
11/13/2018 05:35 PMPosted by Coniferous
...

BFA


I really don't understand why there is so much hate for BFA honestly.. Yea, it's modern WoW and I prefer Classic but it's definitely one of the better expansions. It's a billion times better than WoD but people are acting like it's the worst thing Blizzard ever created. It's not perfect but geez...


BFA is experiencing a number of critical flaws from some of the worst balance, in part due to m+, the game has seen and azerite gear being pretty bad to the point I don't think there is a way to salvage it and would like to see it scrapped completely.
Nost was using the information that 1.12 kept on your computer and guessed at values that were stored server side. They then told the client to connect to their servers and tricked the client into thinking it was connecting to blizzard servers. This gave a relatively true 1.12 experience with very little work.

Blizzard decided at the beginning of this project that if they couldn't get 1.12 to somehow work with the modern client then they wouldn't do it. Thus, they figured out how to make it work on the modern WoW client; additionally, they are also adding bnet integration and all the things that come with that. Running with all this modern stuff means that pretty much everything needs to be reverted to 1.12 values though, and many other "artifacts" of modern WoW need to be removed.

On top of all that, Blizzard explicitly demonstrated some of the types of bugs that were cropping up because of the back porting. The lanterns in Westfall are what I remember off the top of my head. They were white in vanilla, but it turns out that was the default texture for a missing texture. They showed up as purple in the modern client because the default missing texture is flat purple instead of white, so they had to go back and change that. Then, they found that some lanterns in Westfall that looked the same were actually using a different texture, but that it was missing as well, so they had to change that one too. There are likely hundreds of small things like this that need to be fixed because of the modern client.

Bottom line, if Blizzard had just wanted to get this out the door and put no effort into it at all, we likely could have been playing classic a year ago. However, we are getting to see a bit of the old Blizzard that we all fell in love with so many years ago, and they are making this project take longer because they are determined to do it right. Hopefully, they are able to get the project done the way they want instead of how the suits up top likely want it to be done.
In truth, we don’t know many details yet which would properly explain why it is so much work.

At Blizzcon, they said there would be 4 stages to Classic. Fair enough, but what does that tell us? Is everything going to go through 4 stages? In other words, could Blizzard allow us to experience original pet specs only to normalize (nerf) them in a different stage? I have heard stated time and again that private servers have “gated content”. Just how much effort is Blizzard putting into this to truly showcase the fact that there is really only one WoW?

Only so much information can come from data mining. Blizzard has the source code. None of it is HARD for Blizzard, but it does take time to do it right.
11/13/2018 05:48 PMPosted by Tastymanwich
Nost was using the information that 1.12 kept on your computer and guessed at values that were stored server side. They then told the client to connect to their servers and tricked the client into thinking it was connecting to blizzard servers. This gave a relatively true 1.12 experience with very little work.

Blizzard decided at the beginning of this project that if they couldn't get 1.12 to somehow work with the modern client then they wouldn't do it. Thus, they figured out how to make it work on the modern WoW client; additionally, they are also adding bnet integration and all the things that come with that. Running with all this modern stuff means that pretty much everything needs to be reverted to 1.12 values though, and many other "artifacts" of modern WoW need to be removed.

On top of all that, Blizzard explicitly demonstrated some of the types of bugs that were cropping up because of the back porting. The lanterns in Westfall are what I remember off the top of my head. They were white in vanilla, but it turns out that was the default texture for a missing texture. They showed up as purple in the modern client because the default missing texture is flat purple instead of white, so they had to go back and change that. Then, they found that some lanterns in Westfall that looked the same were actually using a different texture, but that it was missing as well, so they had to change that one too. There are likely hundreds of small things like this that need to be fixed because of the modern client.

Bottom line, if Blizzard had just wanted to get this out the door and put no effort into it at all, we likely could have been playing classic a year ago. However, we are getting to see a bit of the old Blizzard that we all fell in love with so many years ago, and they are making this project take longer because they are determined to do it right. Hopefully, they are able to get the project done the way they want instead of how the suits up top likely want it to be done.


Everything is dictated by the suits and money.

If the suits thought that by adding in sharding, transmog, dual spec, and flying to Classic, they could double the profit from Wow, you bet that Classic will have those things.

Blizzard isn't doing this only because they love the game.

Them re-mastering WC3 and making it even easier because they felt it was not accessible enough made me vomit.

If they truly were doing all this for the love of their games, they wouldn't touch any of them.

The only reason why Starcraft:Remastered was untouched was because there was still a huge contingent in Korea playing it. At one point it was the #2 sport there.
took nost like 4-5 years to do it, sounds easy,lol

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