"Stopping to Drink Way Too Often"...

Classic Discussion
"We found ourselves stopping to drink way too often" was a sentenced uttered during the presentation for WoW Classic at Blizzcon. I had assumed as others had that the faster regeneration of health and mana in the demo (if it was indeed the case) was because they wanted us to be able to do as much as possible before our time limit ran out. However, this quote from the developers has me wondering if they actually intentionally want to make this change for WoW Classic.

Downtime was a very important element of the vanilla experience. It created social experiences just as much as many of the other elements of the game. It slowed down the experience to give people more time in the world leveling, which meant more opportunities to meet people doing the same. It also provided another opportunity for players to optimize their gameplay, learning how to reduce their downtime to level faster.

During the presentation, it was stated that the number one goal was authenticity, and the number two goal was a high priority on the integrity of social dynamics, with anything undermining social dynamics needing to be addressed. Changing downtime to increased regeneration to where you have to drink less often is definitely a threat to authenticity and the integrity of social dynamics.

I know there are many, many unfinished aspects of the restoration of WoW Classic, and the development team seems to be doing a great job so far. I'm looking forward to seeing all the crucial inconsistencies slowly restored over time, and I'm hoping that downtime, regen, and the need to drink often will be seen as crucial and restored to its original state.
Contrary to popular belief, you didnt have to drink after EVERY pull in vanilla. What he was reffering to when he said "stopping to drink too often" was the very very first proof-of-concept build they had running internally.

We didnt see more than a few seconds of gameplay fro that build, so for all we know, he went oom half way through every single pull.

TL;DR: Dont think about it too much.
I can't speak for everyone, but I leveled as a mage in Vanilla not once, not twice, but three times. I'm used to drinking. The water never truly caught up to my mana pool. I actually found it fun to try to maximize my mana spent. Things like not using Fireblast, using nova to get shatter crits so I could reduce the amount of frostbolts, etc.

On my priest I tried to max the time spent not casting with spirit tap on. So I'd do things like pull the next mob by just wanding until spirit tap fell. Trying to figure out the optimal rotation of mindflays and dots so that my mana spent would equal mana regen while maintaining a decent kill rate.

I hope they don't make it brainless.
11/04/2018 10:11 AMPosted by Lagspike
Contrary to popular belief, you didnt have to drink after EVERY pull in vanilla.
Well, sorta. It depends a lot on resists, type of mob, and if you have adds. Sometimes if you got unlucky with resists, you'd have to drink after one pull, cause the mobs were high health (ogres for example) and you simply didn't have the mana for a second. Other times you'd be trucking along fine and do 3-5.
I believe he's right, depending on the class you are playing and the fact they gave us half low greens and half whites at level 15. It reminded me of my first days and I had to get creative. Someone was complaining about playing as a priest and being oom after one spell. I remember having to put shadow word pain, then wand to death. Wand spec for spriests was a thing until you got shadowform lol.

You know what class was OP during the demo? Yep... shammies :) I never went oom, and I didn't hurt for health too much either. lol
I'm not presuming to know what the state of the game was that caused him to say it. I'm just saying that, if it happens to be that they know the correct vanilla values for regeneration, mana consumption, and damage to health per pull and decided that the experience felt bad and like there was too much downtime, I would urge them to reconsider in that case.
11/04/2018 10:08 AMPosted by Vivftw
During the presentation, it was stated that the number one goal was authenticity, and the number two goal was a high priority on the integrity of social dynamics, with anything undermining social dynamics needing to be addressed. Changing downtime to increased regeneration to where you have to drink less often is definitely a threat to authenticity and the integrity of social dynamics.


I don't think they are changing it. We know they said they are using all the numbers from 1.12 exactly as they are. They aren't all plugged in yet either, it takes some time to do it. They are doing it though, don't worry. He specifically mentioned Rogue Energy Regen and how they are working on that to ensure it works properly, they would also do the same for Mana.

11/04/2018 10:11 AMPosted by Lagspike
Contrary to popular belief, you didnt have to drink after EVERY pull in vanilla. What he was reffering to when he said "stopping to drink too often" was the very very first proof-of-concept build they had running internally.


Also this. It wasn't even the same build we see right now.
11/04/2018 10:11 AMPosted by Lagspike
Contrary to popular belief, you didnt have to drink after EVERY pull in vanilla.


Maybe if you were my hunter. When I tried to level a mage it generally did.
11/04/2018 10:20 AMPosted by Xukon
Maybe if you were my hunter. When I tried to level a mage it generally did.


That's the reason Spell ranks existed. If you used all the big damaging spells they cost more. Mana resource management was a thing in Classic. I know some who got good at it could go 5 pulls without stopping to drink, while some did every other pull.

It's a different skill to learn.
11/04/2018 10:22 AMPosted by Pärker
11/04/2018 10:20 AMPosted by Xukon
Maybe if you were my hunter. When I tried to level a mage it generally did.


That's the reason Spell ranks existed. If you used all the big damaging spells they cost more. Mana resource management was a thing in Classic. I know some who got good at it could go 5 pulls without stopping to drink, while some did every other pull.

It's a different skill to learn.


This is precisely the type of thing I'm talking about when I say it gave you more opportunity to optimize your gameplay to level faster.
I'm not sure how accurate pservers are in regards to this, but I made a short video of my mage on Elysium to show some friends who were curious about it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k2nA8Lk3Dy4

As long as its not as braindead as BfA was for me, I'm down.
I've always been a Priest, what's drinking? :D
when i heard that part i /facepalmed
it might be the exact reason why the regen in demo was so messed up
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I don't think they are changing it. We know they said they are using all the numbers from 1.12 exactly as they are. They aren't all plugged in yet either, it takes some time to do it. They are doing it though, don't worry. He specifically mentioned Rogue Energy Regen and how they are working on that to ensure it works properly, they would also do the same for Mana.


They said at first rogues were regenerating energy constantly like on live, and they fixed it to regenerate in blocks. they didn't say if they would still fix the wrong values that it's regenerating.
If done correctly you're not supposed to remember it.. :P

+1 to OP
https://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/topic/20769608739

I made a thread about it. Goes into a bit of specifics.
11/04/2018 11:06 AMPosted by Cyberreturns
https://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/topic/20769608739

I made a thread about it. Goes into a bit of specifics.


Cool, I did a forum search before posting but somehow missed that. This post is a good companion post for more information about the issue.
Important aspect, agreed.

I assume that the comment came from it being more often then it was during Vanilla, if not we could be in trouble :)
I made a mage for the demo. I literally drank after every mob. I couldn't take on killing 2 mobs and going for a 3rd without drinking / eating. If I tried to take on two ( polymorph one, kill the other ) I was oom before I could kill the second. I had to drink/eat a lot.
In a feedback post on the demo on here, someone did regen testing. Its the same as it was back then.
The health and mana regen were definitely too high but that's probably a remnant of the legion code. Something that definitely needs fixed.

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