Prot Warrior 8.1 Question

General Discussion
So with the new changes coming to warrior in 8.1 - I had a discussion with a guildee that was very disappointed with how Prot Warrior turned out in 8.0.

We both agreed that the changes will help Prot Warriors a TON - but we also agreed that they could benefit from the ability to generate more rage OR having their defensive abilities cost less rage.

His response was that they would be too OP at that point.

I asked him to assume that in ADDITION to the 8.1 changes - they also reduced Ignore Pain and Shield Block by 10 rage. Then I asked him to compare that Prot Warrior to the post-nerf'd Blood DK - would the Prot Warrior even come close?

He said "no way" - so then my question is: Then how would this make Prot Warriors OP?

Warriors seem to have the least amount of utility across all of the tanks. Some of their "niche" abilities don't really matter a whole lot, they don't have CC, and they don't kite very well compared to the other tanks.

So what would be the problem with having their "strength" be survivability over all the other tanks that can do all of the utility stuff mentioned above?
Answer: None at all, except for Blizzard's knee-jerk way of dealing with any class/specc, especially the ones the devs refuse to play. We can only hope they
calm down one of these days and just quit making un-needed changes. Failing that, we simply just have to go along and figure out how to work with it.

The current status? IMO, seems to be about right.
Prot warrior just plays terribly right now and will only be slightly better when ignore pain is off the GCD. With absolutely 0 self healing they are the weakest tank and will always be if they don't change that.
Blizz never does major changes to classes like that to prevent them from flipping to the OP or UP side. The nerfs/buffs are always fairly small and they keep them going in that direction until they're balance. Well....at least until they get bored with it and move on to other things.
At least prot warrior got a gcd out of the way! But they need more to beat other tanks, some self heals would be nice, like the lego wrist in legion but as a passive.
11/09/2018 07:05 AMPosted by Fleb
At least prot warrior got a gcd out of the way! But they need more to beat other tanks, some self heals would be nice, like the lego wrist in legion but as a passive.


For the record, I don't think Prot Warriors should beat other tanks - it would just be nice to, overall, have them on par with other tanks.
some self heals would be nice, like the lego wrist in legion but as a passive


Absolutely none of prots issues would be fixed by trickle-heals, even if it wasn’t generating 1/3 the rage it had in legion. The spec has poor utility, the talents are bad and ignore pain is undertuned.
11/09/2018 07:10 AMPosted by Thòrhammer
11/09/2018 07:05 AMPosted by Fleb
At least prot warrior got a gcd out of the way! But they need more to beat other tanks, some self heals would be nice, like the lego wrist in legion but as a passive.


For the record, I don't think Prot Warriors should beat other tanks - it would just be nice to, overall, have them on par with other tanks.

It would be fun to see prot warrior being the best tank for a tier, it's not like other tanks got that experience before.

11/09/2018 07:18 AMPosted by Caargon
some self heals would be nice, like the lego wrist in legion but as a passive


Absolutely none of prots issues would be fixed by trickle-heals, even if it wasn’t generating 1/3 the rage it had in legion. The spec has poor utility, the talents are bad and ignore pain is undertuned.

Ay now, the tickle heal would make prot more enjoyable in pvp and not slowly die with ignore pain up! Idk how they can fix prot without remaking big changes to them.
I think what Blizz needs to do here is go back to niche tanking. Remember back when you wanted a Warr or Druid tank for certain fights because they were heavy physical damage? And then maybe you wanted a Pally or DK for others because they had strong cd's against magic spells?

What I would like to see is raid fights where who tanks what matters a lot. This fight you want the Warrior to tank boss because of that pure physical skill, that fight you want DH/Monk to tank boss cuz kiting is needed, that fight you'd like a bear tank because there are a lot of melee adds.

We should incentivize diversifying tank classes within raids and swapping who is tanking boss vs off tanking. I know this still exists today to some degree, but I'd really like to see class specialization matter almost as much as it did in WOTLK.
11/09/2018 07:03 AMPosted by Flappydrood
Blizz never does major changes to classes like that to prevent them from flipping to the OP or UP side. The nerfs/buffs are always fairly small and they keep them going in that direction until they're balance. Well....at least until they get bored with it and move on to other things.


I feel like they've already made lots of major class changes to various classes - Feral Druids come to mind.
11/09/2018 07:00 AMPosted by Werbatim
Prot warrior just plays terribly right now and will only be slightly better when ignore pain is off the GCD. With absolutely 0 self healing they are the weakest tank and will always be if they don't change that.


Self-healing would be nice - but I think there's a LOT more utility we could use than just that.
11/09/2018 07:00 AMPosted by Werbatim
they are the weakest tank and will always be if they don't change that.


No it's not

11/09/2018 07:10 AMPosted by Thòrhammer
have them on par with other tanks


Depends on which tanks.

11/09/2018 07:38 AMPosted by Lindow
I think what Blizz needs to do here is go back to niche tanking. Remember back when you wanted a Warr or Druid tank for certain fights because they were heavy physical damage? And then maybe you wanted a Pally or DK for others because they had strong cd's against magic spells?


That's already a thing. Monks better at physical mitigation. Blood is good at helping healers in stressful fights. dh is high mobility. Warrrior does high damage. Pally has utility. Druid has their own, but they're weak enough to not matter atm.

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