If LFR helps WoW, why are subs at an all time low?

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I would say it is more like Mythic raiding and Mythic dungeons. Blizzard should go back to LFR, Normal and Heroic levels and get rid of all the bloat content. People who run mythics never seem happy and complain all the time about everything.
I sometimes wonder if people actually believe what they write, or if these threads are just a collection of trolls trolling each other.

* The 1.7M sub figure is Fake News,
* LFR has nothing to do with people quitting. Probably doesn't have anything to do with them subbing, either, but there has to be a way to handle storylines for casual players. Either don't put storylines in raid content, or give the masses LFR. They chose the latter. That is literally all it's there for.
* I've LFR'ed in some expansions, not in others. I'm not LFR'ing in BfA. But it has had no effect one way or another on how often I raid.

Predictably, now we have people griping about mythic content (in a thread about LFR no less). Stick to one troll at a time, please.
11/09/2018 12:10 AMPosted by Kaath
I would say it is more like Mythic raiding and Mythic dungeons. Blizzard should go back to LFR, Normal and Heroic levels and get rid of all the bloat content. People who run mythics never seem happy and complain all the time about everything.


I'd rather they condense the raiding scene to Normal and Heroic.
11/08/2018 10:52 PMPosted by Grimwulf
...
And how many people are actually involved in trying to get world firsts?

.001% of the player base?

Not the point. Getting the game out in the public and with the amount of views that it got speaks for itself. The same goes for the MDI and the Arena tournament.

Just because players aren't looking to be top tier doesn't mean that they're not interested in watching top players play at the highest level. And Method decided to stream getting World First which got tons of views on Twitch.

[Citation needed]
11/08/2018 10:17 PMPosted by Magnemyte
The LFR gameplay is dissatisfying to the spirit, people react better to the carrot than the stick.

You realise you are advocating for the removal of the carrot and heavy application of the stick, right?
11/09/2018 12:21 AMPosted by Shaftogar
11/08/2018 10:17 PMPosted by Magnemyte
The LFR gameplay is dissatisfying to the spirit, people react better to the carrot than the stick.

You realise you are advocating for the removal of the carrot and heavy application of the stick, right?
I like that analogy.
Lol
1.7 million subs


Supposition and not confirmed fact.
[If LFR helps WoW, why are subs at an all time low?]


Because people like you suck at verified math.

Why make a thread at all if you're gonna lead it off with a number that has been confirmed false?
11/09/2018 12:28 AMPosted by Aehl
1.7 million subs


Supposition and not confirmed fact.

Some pretty fat-headed supposition at that. One that worked because the person who figured it out so to speak assumed literally every player used their add-on.
11/09/2018 12:07 AMPosted by Anufenrir
next raid is likely in January with Crucibal in spring, then mid summer for Azshara. 7.3 raid will probably be next January. The 6 month figure seems off.


it is. aug2018-january 2019. yup 5 months ., opps so only 5 months that acceptable.
11/08/2018 10:19 PMPosted by Ohgodmyeyes
11/08/2018 10:17 PMPosted by Magnemyte
1.7 million subs is NOT a good number for the game.

Nor is it likely to be an accurate one.

I've seen some posts that reach pretty hard for the removal of LFR in their reasoning, but this one's pretty extreme.


So far when you search the sub number everything points towards that figure. Try the add on Census, it allows you to take a snapshot of your server group whenever you wish at whatever time you are on, you compile that data to their website and it lists how many unique accounts there are.

Some days on my server GROUP we have less than 400 at peak times on a weekday. Let's say 300 servers with 500 players each on average, some servers have less and some have more, some are for new players so they should be quite empty and not loging in as much as us nerds who live here.

So average, estimate, 500 X 300 = not much on a weekday. Let's boost it to 2000 per server just for sakes of an argument, that is 1 million logging in on a weekday at peak times.

There are day time groups, weekends are busier, numbers flucuate, 1.7 million though looks about right to me.

Back to the topic at hand, LFR is crap, you join a group, go AFK on a 3 button rotation, someone else will carry G'huun Orbs and you win. You can get gear, WF, TF, Sanguicell, BoE. Why would some players who are not hardcore go any other route than the laziest one there is? You go AFK in half the stuff you do ion this game, as long as you do something, put some numbers on the board, move a little, follow the crowd, than you have no issues of being kicked.

And the lazier the players get the lazier everyone gets to the point if Blizzard was to keep LFR they need to nerf it everytime a raid comes out, than players get lazy, players follow the laziness, Blizzard nerfs. It is this snowball effect that I hate because Blizzard should be putting time into making more content rather than modifying it to be less.
How many do lfr regularly? How many are former raiders who choose not to do more difficult levels anymore?

I've only done LFR since Legion as all my friends have quit. There are two of us left, and given the frequent toxic nature of some guild chats we observed, we choose to remain isolated.

I also used to run lots of M+ too, I think I've done one this expansion.
Because LFR isn't a defining factor in this game? One of the biggest turn offs in this game currently is achievement/rep locking/time gating QoL perks and fun stuff like new races. They keep pushing that business model and people keep dropping like flies. /shrug
Let's be honest here.
Majority of you guys don't even touch LFR.
Why are you guys complaining about it?
I don't even touch it.
You aren't touching it either.
It is just there in the background like queuing up for Brawl or pet battle.
11/08/2018 10:17 PMPosted by Magnemyte
1.7 million subs is NOT a good number for the game... If WoW had more of a community + more RPG gameplay maybe more people would play? The LFR gameplay is dissatisfying to the spirit, people react better to the carrot than the stick.


You are way way too early for Sunday.
11/08/2018 10:19 PMPosted by Ohgodmyeyes
Nor is it likely to be an accurate one.


I don't think this would be to far from the truth.

11/08/2018 10:43 PMPosted by Ohgodfleas
Subs in Cata started to drop before LFR was introduced, remember that.


That's cause it was deemed to hard by the masses, also 10/25 man had an impact on guilds/players. Also Witcher 2, Skyrim, Dark Souls , Swtor released mid cata. 2011/12 was a good year for ARPG's.

People always forget this stuff and think no one actually plays other games.
You assume LFR is bad for Wow. You assume subs are at an all time low. And then you ask a nonsensical question.

While the latter assumption may or may not be true, the first one is false.

For the sake of argument, let's say you're right on both counts.
Your question is nonsensical.
Balancing is an ever-going process that will never end. Period.
Including quality of life mechanics is nice.

But there are two major things that need to happen.
1. Improved questing experience for leveling and beyond.
2. Update the outdated Assets for Characters and evnironment.

Point 1
When I say an improved questing experience I am not saying the improve the amount of experience a player earns from an area.
I am saying that the story and questing content in old zones should be of higher quality, Blizz has come a long way and it would be great to see more engaging story content for the leveling experience AND it should be more up to date with world events.
WoW is too static right now. It has been a little over 8 years since Cataclysm. The world events and questing in older zones should be more up to date. Esspecially with new allied races joining the fight and experienceing the world.

Point 2
People are generally in agreement that the improved player models were a nice improvement and many of them would probably not want to go back to the models the game had.
The same rule should apply to the environments. Update the old zones to be on par with the quality of the new areas.
A facelift every couple - few years would be great. Trees, buildings, water, lighting, etc.
But more importantly using it as an oppotunity to change the environment with new storylines and quests. How have the lands faired since the cataclysm 8 years ago?

This two major points are notonly for bringing interest from new players, but also making it feel like a living world for the Veteran players that have stuck through it all this time.
11/08/2018 11:38 PMPosted by Walkerbo
...Is there a source for this number?


There was some dumb tweet by the guy behind weakauras that claimed that number. So everyone has latched onto it because they refuse to accept that we don't know.
Ahh, so an imaginary number.

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