Quit Complaining.

Classic Discussion
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11/13/2018 10:01 PMPosted by Plewtoe
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Of that, there is no doubt.

But I am perfectly willing to have a reasonable, rational debate over the pros and cons of sharding. I'm trying to not just copy paste word for word everything I've said on the top in several different threads. I mean I could, but I'm pretty sure people would notice and just ignore it on account of laziness.

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If you think myself or other people aren't going to notice that sharding is in the game and the effect it will have, you are the one who is crazy. As I've stated before, if sharding is in the starting zones it'll never be taken out, and that ruins the community aspect of Classic.

On top of that it doesn't spread people out and you're going to have hundred of people descend on the 10-20 zones at roughly the same time, making everything laggy, hard to play, and cause a massive fight over resources. Blizz will just keep sharding zone after zone until the whole game is sharded.

If your answer is at 10-20, people can just suck it up and deal with the lag and the fight or resources, why do we need sharding in the starting zones?

If your answer is shard the 10-20 zones, where do you draw the line on sharding?

And lets be honest. If the server can't hand 400 people in a zone, the average number people per starting zone on a 2.5k server cap, what's going to happen when AQ opens. Using math I did earlier for simplicity. Say 70% of the people on the server at any given time are level 60 when AQ opens. That's 1750 people. Say half of those people go to the AQ event. That's 875 people in 1 zone. More then double the average people in the starting zones at launch.


It's not about how many people. It's about how many are standing in the same spot. Blizzard already said population isn't even a problem so I don't know why everyone is talking about it like they know what they're talking about. You know single servers 14 years ago held more than what you're talking about. Blizzard can hold 10k with 0 problems.


All those mini-starting zones that get you level 1-5 … those are all roughly the size of a shard. If you can't fit 400 people in that space … what is the situation where you have 875 people standing in front of the gates of AQ going to be like?
11/13/2018 09:25 PMPosted by Plewtoe
Why do people make such a big deal over sharding the STARTING zones for 2 weeks? You did get that right?. It doesn't seem like anyone understands anything, Also for the people saying that they don't care if there is server queues, They want no shards. How about you guys not play until the sharding is gone?

This is why sharding is needed. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-v2GRYLKys

Also the whole loot sharing.... Just master loot. Done


You do realize you're on the internet right?
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It's not about how many people. It's about how many are standing in the same spot. Blizzard already said population isn't even a problem so I don't know why everyone is talking about it like they know what they're talking about. You know single servers 14 years ago held more than what you're talking about. Blizzard can hold 10k with 0 problems.


All those mini-starting zones that get you level 1-5 … those are all roughly the size of a shard. If you can't fit 400 people in that space … what is the situation where you have 875 people standing in front of the gates of AQ going to be like?


Like it was in 2005, Unplayable. Silithus will probably be a shard since they're doing a world invasion ( Not saying I want that but that's my guess) . Didn't go so well last time. I'm sure blizzard had to stop selling copies of the game because how bad the servers were.
11/13/2018 09:34 PMPosted by Plewtoe
11/13/2018 09:30 PMPosted by Velossena
Sharding doesn't solve the problem it's supposed to fix. Yeah looking at your video, it's a !@#$ show. But guess what. When you shard all those people off and they all get their starting zone done. And they all end up in the next zone together. Back to that flood people that make doing anything difficult. What then? Shard the 10-20 zones? Or say just deal with it?

If your answer is just deal with it? Why shard the starting zones? Just get people to deal with it.

If you answer is to shard the 10-20 zones, where does the sharding stop?


Yes but spreading the masses out is what blizzard is trying to do with sharding because everyone will start in the same points on the map. Also I'm sure 1-10 isn't going to hurt your experience. I believe blizzard and I know blizzard understands what the classic community wants.. They also know how we feel on this. 2 weeks is noting. Not even considered change. To assume is something a liberal would do.


I notice that you didn't even try to answer the question.

I'm not surprised, though.
I think it's needed and I want classic as close to vanilla as possible. All these people kicking and screaming about sharding are going to be the ones kicking and screaming saying the games broken and dead when the servers are unplayable for two weeks. It's a lose lose for blizzard, they should just add sharding and ignore the doom and gloomers. They use emotions instead of their brains. They would make for great Hillary supporters.
11/13/2018 10:10 PMPosted by Plewtoe
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All those mini-starting zones that get you level 1-5 … those are all roughly the size of a shard. If you can't fit 400 people in that space … what is the situation where you have 875 people standing in front of the gates of AQ going to be like?

Like it was in 2005, Unplayable. Silithus will probably be a shard since they're doing a world invasion.


But that goes against what they said. Sharding would only be in the starting zones at launch. Even if that is all they did outside of the launch period, that goes against what they told us at Blizzcon. Are you admitting they can't be trusted at their word?
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Yes but spreading the masses out is what blizzard is trying to do with sharding because everyone will start in the same points on the map. Also I'm sure 1-10 isn't going to hurt your experience. I believe blizzard and I know blizzard understands what the classic community wants.. They also know how we feel on this. 2 weeks is noting. Not even considered change. To assume is something a liberal would do.


I notice that you didn't even try to answer the question.

I'm not surprised, though.


Actually I did answer it. In my first post when I said starting zones in big capitals. Awesome to see you're as bright as ever. What color are you in the box of crayons?
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Like it was in 2005, Unplayable. Silithus will probably be a shard since they're doing a world invasion.


But that goes against what they said. Sharding would only be in the starting zones at launch. Even if that is all they did outside of the launch period, that goes against what they told us at Blizzcon. Are you admitting they can't be trusted at their word?


We don't even know how many people on a server, We don't know how many will even be playing around that time. You're looking at 2020 and assuming. I wont be doing that. Talking about the gates of AQ when it's like 2 years or more away is just silly.
11/13/2018 10:01 PMPosted by Plewtoe
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Of that, there is no doubt.

But I am perfectly willing to have a reasonable, rational debate over the pros and cons of sharding. I'm trying to not just copy paste word for word everything I've said on the top in several different threads. I mean I could, but I'm pretty sure people would notice and just ignore it on account of laziness.

...

If you think myself or other people aren't going to notice that sharding is in the game and the effect it will have, you are the one who is crazy. As I've stated before, if sharding is in the starting zones it'll never be taken out, and that ruins the community aspect of Classic.

On top of that it doesn't spread people out and you're going to have hundred of people descend on the 10-20 zones at roughly the same time, making everything laggy, hard to play, and cause a massive fight over resources. Blizz will just keep sharding zone after zone until the whole game is sharded.

If your answer is at 10-20, people can just suck it up and deal with the lag and the fight or resources, why do we need sharding in the starting zones?

If your answer is shard the 10-20 zones, where do you draw the line on sharding?

And lets be honest. If the server can't hand 400 people in a zone, the average number people per starting zone on a 2.5k server cap, what's going to happen when AQ opens. Using math I did earlier for simplicity. Say 70% of the people on the server at any given time are level 60 when AQ opens. That's 1750 people. Say half of those people go to the AQ event. That's 875 people in 1 zone. More then double the average people in the starting zones at launch.


It's not about how many people. It's about how many are standing in the same spot. Blizzard already said population isn't even a problem so I don't know why everyone is talking about it like they know what they're talking about. You know single servers 14 years ago held more than what you're talking about. Blizzard can hold 10k with 0 problems.


Once again, you choose to ignore the point.

What happens when all those people are standing in the same spot in the secondary zones of Westfall, Darkshore, Loch Modan, Silverpine Forest or the Barrens? What happens when the "bottleneck" moves from the starting areas to the secondary zones?

Should Blizzard shard those secondary areas also to cater to those who have an instant gratification, convenience oriented mindset and who cannot handle competition?

If you say "yes, they should shard those secondary areas to alleviate competition and help ease, or clear, the new bottleneck", now you are extending the sharding beyond "only for a brief time and only in the starting areas" Where does the sharding stop?

If you say "no, let players learn to live with competition", then why do we need sharding in the starting areas? Shouldn't players be able to learn to live with competition in those areas, also?
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It's not about how many people. It's about how many are standing in the same spot. Blizzard already said population isn't even a problem so I don't know why everyone is talking about it like they know what they're talking about. You know single servers 14 years ago held more than what you're talking about. Blizzard can hold 10k with 0 problems.


Once again, you choose to ignore the point.

What happens when all those people are standing in the same spot in the secondary zones of Westfall, Darkshore, Loch Modan, Silverpine Forest or the Barrens? What happens when the "bottleneck" moves from the starting areas to the secondary zones?

Should Blizzard shard those secondary areas also to cater to those who have an instant gratification, convenience oriented mindset and who cannot handle competition?

If you say "yes, they should shard those secondary areas to alleviate competition and help ease, or clear, the new bottleneck", now you are extending the sharding beyond "only for a brief time and only in the starting areas" Where does the sharding stop?

If you say "no, let players learn to live with competition", then why do we need sharding in the starting areas? Shouldn't players be able to learn to live with competition in those areas, also?


No they shouldn't and they wont need too. They said at blizzcon it's the initial log in that's going to hurt them when millions are creating characters and spawning all in the same spot. ITS NOT ABOUT POPULATION. Get it through your thick skull m8
11/13/2018 10:10 PMPosted by Plewtoe
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All those mini-starting zones that get you level 1-5 … those are all roughly the size of a shard. If you can't fit 400 people in that space … what is the situation where you have 875 people standing in front of the gates of AQ going to be like?


Like it was in 2005, Unplayable. Silithus will probably be a shard since they're doing a world invasion ( Not saying I want that but that's my guess) . Didn't go so well last time. I'm sure blizzard had to stop selling copies of the game because how bad the servers were.


If Silithus is a shard, that takes it out of the starting areas. It's no longer "just the starting areas for two weeks" if Silithus is sharded, is it?
11/13/2018 09:27 PMPosted by Plewtoe
11/13/2018 09:27 PMPosted by Igotsoul
If you trust the devs to implement sharding just at the start you are naive.


Lets assume why don't we. You have no valid point.


The point is that everytime in the past when blizzard was supposed to implement temporary fixers they became permanent. There was never supposed to be 4 difficulties in the game but it happened step by step. The thing is they're doing this so people don't complain about not being able to tag mobs at launch for the starter quests, giving people a QoL change for complaining about part of vanilla sets a dangerous precedent. What if people start complaining that it takes too long to form groups for low level dungeons? Since the precedent has been set with sharding they could introduce dungeon finder and so on.
11/13/2018 10:14 PMPosted by Emicklenry
I think it's needed and I want classic as close to vanilla as possible. All these people kicking and screaming about sharding are going to be the ones kicking and screaming saying the games broken and dead when the servers are unplayable for two weeks. It's a lose lose for blizzard, they should just add sharding and ignore the doom and gloomers. They use emotions instead of their brains. They would make for great Hillary supporters.


Well said.
11/13/2018 10:16 PMPosted by Plewtoe
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I notice that you didn't even try to answer the question.

I'm not surprised, though.


Actually I did answer it. In my first post when I said starting zones in big capitals. Awesome to see you're as bright as ever. What color are you in the box of crayons?


The question was (I will paraphrase here) "what happens when all those players move from the starting zones into the secondary zones?".

You didn't answer that question.
11/13/2018 10:24 PMPosted by Drakoak
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Lets assume why don't we. You have no valid point.


The point is that everytime in the past when blizzard was supposed to implement temporary fixers they became permanent. There was never supposed to be 4 difficulties in the game but it happened step by step. The thing is they're doing this so people don't complain about not being able to tag mobs at launch for the starter quests, giving people a QoL change for complaining about part of vanilla sets a dangerous precedent. What if people start complaining that it takes too long to form groups for low level dungeons? Since the precedent has been set with sharding they could introduce dungeon finder and so on.


Point made. You said "What if people start complaining that it takes too long to form groups" This will happen without sharding because blizzard will need 250 servers per million people. Once the tourist leave you're left with a bunch of low pop server's. Wont be making a group then will you hahaa
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Actually I did answer it. In my first post when I said starting zones in big capitals. Awesome to see you're as bright as ever. What color are you in the box of crayons?


The question was (I will paraphrase here) "what happens when all those players move from the starting zones into the secondary zones?".

You didn't answer that question.


They wont be all spawning in the same spot, They may get held up on a quest item that spawns on the ground but if you compare the entire game logging on at once making toons the same you're just not ever going to get it. Sit back and enjoy the sharding, Because it's going to happen.
11/13/2018 10:30 PMPosted by Plewtoe
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The question was (I will paraphrase here) "what happens when all those players move from the starting zones into the secondary zones?".

You didn't answer that question.


They wont be all spawning in the same spot, They may get held up on a quest item that spawns on the ground but if you compare the entire game logging on at once making toons the same you're just not ever going to get it. Sit back and enjoy the sharding, Because it's going to happen.


400 people won't instantaneously log onto the game at the same time. Even if a full server all clicks log in at the same time, there is going to be difference in speed of how quickly they chose their class and customize their characters. So you will get 400 people trickling in 1 starting zone over the course 10-15 minutes.
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They wont be all spawning in the same spot, They may get held up on a quest item that spawns on the ground but if you compare the entire game logging on at once making toons the same you're just not ever going to get it. Sit back and enjoy the sharding, Because it's going to happen.


400 people won't instantaneously log onto the game at the same time. Even if a full server all clicks log in at the same time, there is going to be difference in speed of how quickly they chose their class and customize their characters. So you will get 400 people trickling in 1 starting zone over the course 10-15 minutes.


I bet 750 thousand at least log in at the same time haha. Probably millions. How did you even get those brainless numbers hahahaha, You kill me. I needed a good laugh.
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400 people won't instantaneously log onto the game at the same time. Even if a full server all clicks log in at the same time, there is going to be difference in speed of how quickly they chose their class and customize their characters. So you will get 400 people trickling in 1 starting zone over the course 10-15 minutes.


I bet 750 thousand at least log in at the same time haha. Probably millions.


You're not going to have 750 thousand people on 1 server. Vanilla was designed around a server population of 2500-3000 max. If they up that a little fine, but if you put too many players on a server, you're going to over crowd it, whether you shard the starting zones or not.
11/13/2018 10:10 PMPosted by Plewtoe
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All those mini-starting zones that get you level 1-5 … those are all roughly the size of a shard. If you can't fit 400 people in that space … what is the situation where you have 875 people standing in front of the gates of AQ going to be like?


Like it was in 2005, Unplayable. Silithus will probably be a shard since they're doing a world invasion ( Not saying I want that but that's my guess) . Didn't go so well last time. I'm sure blizzard had to stop selling copies of the game because how bad the servers were.


And that's the point right there. They say sharding at launch. Now you're saying that they are going to use it for aq as well.

That's exactly why were concerned. Remember those old days of southshore vs tarren mill? Sharded. Ain't happening.
Remember raiding cities or world bosses? Sharded.

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