Chain Heal changes in the PTR

Battle for Azeroth Items and Classes
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10/26/2018 09:55 AMPosted by Twisp
cbt, just to see how it'd perform with ul/ht and if I felt it'd be better than dp/hst. I'm not really sure it would still.

ch>hw>cbt or rt mostly, my RT usage is usually !@#$. As much as I can advise folks on proper play, execution is a whole other matter :P I recently changed up my WA for RT on live to help with that because I know its an area of improvement I need to fix :P


I'd advise putting it on an easy mouseover bind like right click; then you can just simply right click someone on frames in raid and riptide. Makes it really convenient to use.
Hitting the literal button isn't the struggle. It's currently bound to to one of the mmo mouse buttons in a MO macro.

Throwing a sound on RT was a good change though, going back to what I did. I'm probably gonna end up scrapping my current WA setup and build a new one at some point when I'm not lazy...I'll have to do something for 8.1 to work with the HT change though.

This is all getting off topic though. If people want to comment on my personal play, they can @ me on Discord :P
Alright, so, with the math being worked on right now...As things are currently are on PTR...sharing just some of the main points from AG's splashystats spreadsheet.

If you're spending mana on par with boss health, you'll be getting a set of HT's about every 25s on a 3m fight, and closer to 35s on a 8 minute fight. This includes potion, but not outside mana from a priest or druid, or something like fangs.

If you were to WS on CD instead, for the same fight lengths...it works out that WS would be more mana efficient (and better for mana on longer fights), while HT will be more HPS (with that value decreasing, but WS would not become even for hps until you hit a 36 minute fight which isn't a thing you'll ever see happen).

That said, both would be close enough in value to take whatever feels like is best for the fight (like WS on vectis for how it lines up with contagion), or personal preference. These are also ideal situations, so real world usage will vary, because healing is so rarely done under ideal situations.
These changes seem misguided and still make us extremely weak on spread fights and only mediocre on stacked encounters. We had the tools in legion to be competitive on spread fights but for some arbitrary reason they were stripped. CBT feels very lackluster now even with two charges. Change the fact that it removes HST at the very least.

These changes do nothing to resto viability. Any spread fight I can play MW or Disc alts and be a greater benefit to my raid..
10/31/2018 03:48 PMPosted by Kateey
These changes seem misguided and still make us extremely weak on spread fights and only mediocre on stacked encounters. We had the tools in legion to be competitive on spread fights but for some arbitrary reason they were stripped. CBT feels very lackluster now even with two charges. Change the fact that it removes HST at the very least.

These changes do nothing to resto viability. Any spread fight I can play MW or Disc alts and be a greater benefit to my raid..


I'm going to chalk up the High Tide changes to being pretty much a wash and not much of anything since it doesn't increase chain heal jump range to help us on fights like M Fetid, doesn't add any extra targets to be healed by chain heal, nothing. All it is now is basically a clunky talent that is far more annoying and inconvenient to use then wellspring is and hardly even adds any HPS; its gain seems basically moot.. Not worth the annoyance. Also factor in the risk potential on spread fights of not actually having it hit 4 total targets. Depends largely on boss design for next raid tier though and I haven't been able to take a look at many of the fights so far.

Basically, all it feels like we're getting with 8.1 is the base chain heal spell power buff. I mean, I guess I'll take it. I don't see high tide changes as impactful enough to warrant paying much attention to.

Aside from some further QoL tweaks to High tide, I'd personally also like to see a big buff to the base healing rain radius so its more practical to use in raids and M+. Currently it just feels tiny, especially taking into account the rather lengthy cast time the radius is seriously underwhelming. Healing rain needed a serious overhaul after we had a lot of our healing tools from legion stripped away, and its yet to get anything aside from a very mediocre azerite trait.
At this point is praying they unveil a lot of good stuff in Blizzcon. Either that or pray they resume some activity afterwards.
I'm still pretty concerned if the only change you are going to make is to make the mana cost activation go to 40,000 for a paltry 10 second increase in the buff duration.

The mana cost for activation is so incredibly high and the activation itself feels so incredibly foreign to anything in the game right now. Again, it really should not activate like this and should work off something like number of casted heals like undulation, IMO.

And if the prohibitive mana cost activation does stay, a 25 second duration basically is meaningless. Buff needs to last 1 minute or something close to it to have any meaningful impact.

Right now even at 25 seconds, there are just so many times I won't optimally be able to utilize the buff. Chain heal already is a 2.5 second cast. Bursts of damage on certain fights just won't line up in essentially a 20 second window.

You're already fighting two battles here. One is tracking the mana cost which I've said before, but no one will realistically do on any fight because its too cumbersome to do efficiently on an actual mythic fight. You will essentially just stick with easy to go wellspring or niche ascendance. The second battle will be that you are making the buff duration a second issue. So I have to worry about, "will I have this buff up in time and can I spend it in time?" This is just not good design and at least one of the issues should be addressed.

And both of these issues are separate from the mana cost issue. At 30,000 mana, based on my own logs of fights, I saw this talent be usable in fights akin to mythic zul or mythic mother where you expend a metric ton of mana on a short duration fight where there is high damage throughout most of it so you are guaranteed to have the buff up most of the time.

But 40,000? You are getting close to taking away the one possible niche this talent has over wellspring.

If it stays like this, I most likely will stick with wellspring or ascendance where even if wellspring won't work out mathematically better, you can still occasionally bug it out if the scenario is right and pull off massive 500k wellsprings.
So they kinda played around with High Tide and Chain Heal, and that's all we get? Sounds about right for this expansion so far.

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