Feral Druid changes (Sugestions) (PvP)

Druid
Make Sabertooth baseline passive.

and

Add a 1% hp heal for shapeshifting (it will compesate the nerf of resto affinity, and will not make us healer for another ones, thats why the nerfs are requirid.)

or

Give us barkskin.

or

Give us some passive evasion. (thats completely fine since we are fast fighting cats)

Last talent tier needs a rearrangement, since bloodtalons are the only talent usable for arenas atm.
Reduce the cooldown of Feral Frenzy, and buff Moment of clarity.
SbT baseline would be ideal. Just the Rip refresher because of how energy starved Feral is.
Barkskin would be alright but we already have dmg reduction. Instincts is good. Barkskin would be mostly useless I think. Maybe it would allow you to go toe to toe more often in melee.
Clone would be insane. Bash, Maim, and clone would be too strong. Maybe if clone had a CD like 30 sec or something.
I don't have that much trouble surviving as feral. Yes I can get bursted down, but so can every class.
10/10/2018 10:10 AMPosted by Silia
I don't have that much trouble surviving as feral.


It gets harder when you climb the ladder and enemies become semi-coordinated.

We need:

1. Cyclone made baseline for all specs
2. Ashmane's protection for Feral only
I dont think that feral fits with the playstyle of cyclone.

Feral is based on pressure with bleeds, not in control.

Cyclone may be in, with a cooldown, but thats not what the cat is made for.

We need a rearrangement for the last tier, with buffs on other talents. Bloodtalons can't be the only possible way to go here...

and please Blizzard, don't make us chose betwen Sabertoooth or Lunar insp, it will kill the cats in pvp.
I think they need to have our Earthen Grasp talent cause Roots to either:

1) affect all targets, including ranged (which Blizzard won't do, since they've already removed it), or
2) not break on our bleeds. It's dumb that our role is constant multi-DoT pressure in Arena, but our own bleeds break our CC.

It's already on a 10-second CD, so it's not some spammable CC like Cyclone or Poly.

Edit: I meant 'affect all targets' as in useful against ranged or melee, not as in Mass Entanglement.
rip refresher is a lame mechanic. I wish it would just be removed. You should have to make a decision on what finisher to use based on the situation not just do the same rotation every time.

As for the last tree, I feel like feral frenzy should be buffed to be the top talent and it should give 5 combopoints immediately with no delay. Don't think blood talons is fun to play at all. It's clunky and feels really cheesy spamming moonfire for combo points.

Either way feral will always be boring without cyclone. That's what we really need.
10/10/2018 03:44 PMPosted by Feríssimo
I dont think that feral fits with the playstyle of cyclone.

Feral is based on pressure with bleeds, not in control.

Cyclone may be in, with a cooldown, but thats not what the cat is made for.



Disagree vehemently. Cyclone is absolutely a Druid-centric ability that needs to return. The complexity that cyclone adds with skill potential, the counterplay it offers, the opportunity cost in using it is exactly what this game needs more of.

It's an iconic druid ability and It should be available for all specs. The already made changes like allowing MD to get to remove it for the sake of balance.

10/10/2018 03:44 PMPosted by Feríssimo
We need a rearrangement for the last tier, with buffs on other talents. Bloodtalons can't be the only possible way to go here...


Apparently they were doing a BT rework

10/10/2018 03:44 PMPosted by Feríssimo
don't make us chose betwen Sabertoooth or Lunar insp, it will kill the cats in pvp.


The only thing I agree with.

10/10/2018 07:14 PMPosted by Minotauros
2) not break on our bleeds. It's dumb that our role is constant multi-DoT pressure in Arena, but our own bleeds break our CC.


We had this and they nerfed it.

10/10/2018 10:37 PMPosted by Kdfsajhikeqw
Either way feral will always be boring without cyclone


This guy gets it.
sabertooth baseline would be too op and ruin the feeling of the class for me. If you dont want to baby sit bleeds this isnt the class for you. What they should make baseline is savage roar and make BT not tied to regrowth.
Why not just delete Rip and have FB put a bleed on the target? Sabertooth baseline is a terrible idea. Please stop.
10/11/2018 07:36 PMPosted by Ryecoke
delete Rip and have FB put a bleed on the target?


10/11/2018 07:36 PMPosted by Ryecoke
is a terrible idea.


10/11/2018 07:36 PMPosted by Ryecoke
Please stop.


Fixed that for ya.
Sabertooth baseline is horrible for class maintanance, it takes away any form of thinking in my opinion, you move from having to maintain rip and choose to snapshot it to the max, to just putting it up once and forgetting and just biting the rest of the encounter.
Currently having lunar and sbt on the same row, I hope that lunar does more damage, and it leaves an option to get another dot on the target for more damage, and have SBT as another qol option for those who do not want to maintain bleeds, but lose damage in the process.

Currently having lunar and sbt on the same row, I hope that lunar does more damage.


And this is terrible for pvp, but I suppose if pve is fixed that's all that matters?
I made a forum post but I guess this is where the conversation is at so ima copy paste my stuff here :P tell me if im crazy.

Feral druid has been repeatedly abused since legion and has not been in an acceptable place as far as play style and balance in a long time. I made this forum to discuss the main things I think need changed and what other ferals might think.

Personal Thoughts.
Needed Play style Changes :

Complete removal of blood talons: This wretched talent forces a melee dps spec to use a healing ability in its rotation and makes the dps rotation extremely punishing and hard to learn for new ferals.... It quite frankly adds no flavor (all muscle memory) and in 7.3 blizzard even changed the talent tree stating that it was bad for the rotation.

Single Target buff: Feral druid has been forced in arena and pve to spread rips and rakes across multiple targets and play a rot play style like some sort of caster for years now. I really believe that we are far too bleed dependent and as melee dps we should never be forced to spread dots to do somewhat efficient damage.

Energy Buff: Even if it costs the spec some nerfs to ability damage feral has needed an energy buff for years and the fix is as simple as a energy regeneration % buff.

Needed Balance Changes :

Survivability: Since the beginning of legion feral has easily been one of if not the squishiest melee spec(s). We lost HoTW, ability to cast in form, Cyclone, ability to run Renewal, our heals became significantly weaker, quick shifting, ability to stack versatility gear, MoTW, Frenzied Regeneration, etc. Current feral has 2 walls both on a 2 minute CD with a duration of 6 seconds. 6 seconds is far too short, 2 minutes is far too long, bear form is extremely boring, bear form also completely stops all damage. Something like barkskin and wall duration increase &/or overall damage reduction is a LONG overdue change.
10/14/2018 07:02 PMPosted by Leadbelly

And this is terrible for pvp, but I suppose if pve is fixed that's all that matters?

Im purely talking pve because SBT baseline in pve will ruin it, but not for pvp. they need to make some work around or take a step back on this movement so pvp doesnt take as big of a hit, but they cant make sabertooth baseline for pve, id even be on board with it being a pvp talent and make other passives for pvp or something, aslong as sabertooth is not a pve baseline mechanic.
10/14/2018 08:35 PMPosted by Hoofhartd
10/14/2018 07:02 PMPosted by Leadbelly

And this is terrible for pvp, but I suppose if pve is fixed that's all that matters?

Im purely talking pve because SBT baseline in pve will ruin it, but not for pvp. they need to make some work around or take a step back on this movement so pvp doesnt take as big of a hit, but they cant make sabertooth baseline for pve, id even be on board with it being a pvp talent and make other passives for pvp or something, aslong as sabertooth is not a pve baseline mechanic.


Make LI baseline, I don't really care as long as pvp doesn't lose the ability have both. Now they're gimping pvp for the sake of pve - which is what they always do anyway.

They would need to give us a good pvp talent as baseline if ST gets made into a pvp talent, for e.g. Savage Momentum, Thorns, Malorne's swiftness (heck this should be baseline).
I agree that having sbt baseline would make the spec a lot more dull.

There has been plenty of arena play for ferals where they did not take sbt, like the first year of legion when it was in the same tier as JW because a filly buffed rip actually wrecked people. Through rip, JW, BT nerfs as well as losing energy regeneration traits rip is a poor version of what it used to be in pvp resulting in the more FB centric style of play that can't afford to have to maintain rip every other finisher or so.

The biggest reason why it feels like we need sbt now is due to rips poor damage in pvp as well as lower access to proper energy regeneration. Fix those 2 issues and not having sabertooth won't be a big deal at all.
Being able to potentially get out 3 fully buffed rips in 1 gcd could be crazy pressure if rip damage becomes anywhere near decent. Otherwise brutal slash will be there as a low energy cost occasional replacement for shred that also cleaves, which is a way bigger bonus than ever having to use shred. So there is some type of bonus coming toward pvp with the talent rearrangement. I would personally like 2 distinct builds to emerge. One very bleed and dot centric and one very direct damage fb centric. With a possibility of a third mixing the two a bit

Historically however, blizzard hasn't been able to maintain both playstyles without gutting the other and making it unplayable in comparison.

I'm not entirely sure how they can go about fixing the main issue. More gear will help as the expansion goes along but doesnt do anything to help solve the issues now. Hopefully the changes are not yet finished and we still get to see some interesting changes to BT. Potentially changing it to not rely on pred swiftness procs could be huge due to no longer having to fish for 5 combo points before you rip to do maximum damage per tick. I'm both excited and extremely nervous for a BT change as I don't mind it's current iteration at all, but can easily understand people's frustrations with it.
10/14/2018 10:35 PMPosted by Pidooma
Historically however, blizzard hasn't been able to maintain both playstyles without gutting the other and making it unplayable in comparison.


This is Blizzards apathy towards Feral, plain and simple. We have pvp talents. As we have seen they're able to do modifiers for pvp only. They can balance us if they actually care to.
Well we had pvp stats and everything in legion as well, but when 7.3 came out they basically destroyed the bleed build and turned it into a shred and FB spam bot instead. Same thing happened in WoD. I think them making mastery scale finishing moves is a step in the right direction and an indication they want both play styles to be valid and possibly even at the same time.

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