AV is not even close to even sorry

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11/09/2018 02:35 PMPosted by Kády
I am always so baffled when I see people that constantly post how horrible this game is and how incredibly unfair it is and a completely miserable experience continue to pay to play this game that brings them so much misery. I am not talking about people that come here to express their complaints here and there, I am referring to habitual complainers, those seemingly so unhinged and miserable that they continually post the same dribble year after year... it's fascinating and disturbing at the same time. I mean if I was truly hating something and believed it was so fundamentally unfair and that the creators of said thing were willfully misleading me, lying to me, etc., I would not willfully participate in and most certainly would not continue to pay them so that I can subject myself to something that makes me feel that way.
You sound like a rational person...how did you make it this far into this thread?
Just throwing it out there but maybe the 29 twink with 70k honor kills.............is bad at the game? So when they play max level content they struggle and have bad win rates.
11/09/2018 02:08 PMPosted by Gehlmar
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Wrong. The entrance to the Frostwolf keep is much thinner.

As for the ways around, (1) they were closed off, and (2) if you do manage to drop into the ledge outside the wall, from say west Frostwolf tower, there's now an invisible wall that keeps you from going in by the waterfall gate. Blizzard has worked hard to close off the legitimate entrances to Frostwolf keep while leaving the ones to Dun Baldar open.

You can still jump the gates on the east and west sides using the hills. And you can still use the mountain around the guard tower area to literally skip half the keep. Haven't tried waterfall in a long time. If its fixed , good. So there goes points 1 and 2.

You are confusing the gate to Frostwolf Village with the gate to Frostwolf Keep. Yes, we can jump the wall around Frostwolf Village, but the Frostwolf Village gate has never been a significant defensive point. Complaining about that is like Alliance complaining about Horde being able to ride through the valley under the bridge and come at the Stormpike Graveyard from behind.

I still think the bridge is way more broken than the hordes tiny hill and gate that do little to nothing from stopping people from entering. Sorry we disagree on that one. People die to that bridge every game. I cant remember the last time i saw an alliance player randomly drop dead from getting knocked back when walking past the gate in the horde keep.

That's because Alliance actually defends at Dun sometimes, whereas the Horde defends at Iceblood, not Frostwolf. On the rare occasions when Horde turtle within the keep the keep entrance becomes an impenetrable kill zone. You can't claim that's not a good choke point just because Horde have an even better chokepoint elsewhere.
11/09/2018 03:25 PMPosted by Fotmtrash
Just throwing it out there but maybe the 29 twink with 70k honor kills.............is bad at the game? So when they play max level content they struggle and have bad win rates.


he's specifically meaning AV, which really is pretty BS at this point in time
11/09/2018 03:33 PMPosted by Shadow
11/09/2018 03:25 PMPosted by Fotmtrash
Just throwing it out there but maybe the 29 twink with 70k honor kills.............is bad at the game? So when they play max level content they struggle and have bad win rates.


he's specifically meaning AV, which really is pretty BS at this point in time


Yea. Horde had their moment of losing tons of AV at one point, and it was also a L2P time for them. Instead of playing better, they called it an Alliance favored map so a ton of players just blacklisted it.
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You can still jump the gates on the east and west sides using the hills. And you can still use the mountain around the guard tower area to literally skip half the keep. Haven't tried waterfall in a long time. If its fixed , good. So there goes points 1 and 2.

You are confusing the gate to Frostwolf Village with the gate to Frostwolf Keep. Yes, we can jump the wall around Frostwolf Village, but the Frostwolf Village gate has never been a significant defensive point. Complaining about that is like Alliance complaining about Horde being able to ride through the valley under the bridge and come at the Stormpike Graveyard from behind.

I still think the bridge is way more broken than the hordes tiny hill and gate that do little to nothing from stopping people from entering. Sorry we disagree on that one. People die to that bridge every game. I cant remember the last time i saw an alliance player randomly drop dead from getting knocked back when walking past the gate in the horde keep.

That's because Alliance actually defends at Dun sometimes, whereas the Horde defends at Iceblood, not Frostwolf. On the rare occasions when Horde turtle within the keep the keep entrance becomes an impenetrable kill zone. You can't claim that's not a good choke point just because Horde have an even better chokepoint elsewhere.


You seem to have totally forgotten what this thread was about. OP is complaining about AV imbalance in favor of the horde. I am here pointing out the alliance has just as many advantages as the horde does if not more.

The alliance chokes ARE better. You have more , they're longer and they're much easier to defend. Im not saying the horde doesn't have good chokes at all period anywhere on the map.

You talk about how alliance defends at dun balder when the horde doesn't defend often at frostwolf. Why do you think that is? Its because the dun balder choke is amazing while the frostwolf "choke" ( i would argue it isn't one at all) is awful.

And thank you for agreeing with me in that we have multiple ways into our keep. Just because theyre not always super useful doesn't demean my point. And in many of my games there is a choke fight at frostwolf village there during a horde turtle. And being able to jump those gates really does help alliance sneak tower caps. An option alliance gets that horde doesn't.

As i said before. Both factions have their advantages so stop playing victim. My point was to show that alliance have their fair share of advantages that horde doesn't have. But its pretty obvious this thread is full of angry alliance players wanting an outlet so this falls on deaf ears anyway.

Like the person above said. Horde had this issue a while back also. Instead we starting playing into our advantages and adapted over time. It wasn't map/racial imbalances fault then and it isn't now.
Title is true for the 120 bracket. The other brackets, I have no idea. I do know alliance wins a good amount in the 111-119 bracket because horde are dumber there for some reason.
11/09/2018 05:03 PMPosted by Utterly
Title is true for the 120 bracket. The other brackets, I have no idea. I do know alliance wins a good amount in the 111-119 bracket because horde are dumber there for some reason.


Yea just like Alliance are dumber in the 120 AVs
11/09/2018 05:09 PMPosted by Jugajr
11/09/2018 05:03 PMPosted by Utterly
Title is true for the 120 bracket. The other brackets, I have no idea. I do know alliance wins a good amount in the 111-119 bracket because horde are dumber there for some reason.


Yea just like Alliance are dumber in the 120 AVs


Hah, yeah they are.. Even when you try to explain strat to them they don't seem to care. Lotta defeatism too, even when it is still winnable. I just AFK out of the ones where people aren't trying or do really stupid things at the start.
11/09/2018 05:56 PMPosted by Utterly
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Yea just like Alliance are dumber in the 120 AVs


Hah, yeah they are.. Even when you try to explain strat to them they don't seem to care. Lotta defeatism too, even when it is still winnable. I just AFK out of the ones where people aren't trying or do really stupid things at the start.


I actually did afk out of one. We were doing well, up on the kills and backcapping well. Then a HUGE horde force overran IBGY and instead of people in IBT coming to help, we wiped they took GY and IBT. Not playing with players like that and Blizzard can't stop that kind of behavior. Cry all you guys want on the forums, but it's not going to change until players themselves change. Was the same with Horde in AV for years when it was like 20/80. And for all I know, that team is still playing and could have turned it around but it wasn't looking good so I took the 15 minutes.
11/09/2018 03:25 PMPosted by Fotmtrash
Just throwing it out there but maybe the 29 twink with 70k honor kills.............is bad at the game? So when they play max level content they struggle and have bad win rates.


Whats that have to do with 40 man AVs where 1 person has little to no effect on the outcome? Use your tiny Orc brain for a second
11/09/2018 06:02 PMPosted by Igyfarmyou
11/09/2018 03:25 PMPosted by Fotmtrash
Just throwing it out there but maybe the 29 twink with 70k honor kills.............is bad at the game? So when they play max level content they struggle and have bad win rates.


Whats that have to do with 40 man AVs where 1 person has little to no effect on the outcome? Use your tiny Orc brain for a second


What do you want them to do to fix av? Said the same thing to Horde for years. Stop playing crappy and we could see decent games and winratios
11/09/2018 01:49 PMPosted by Igyfarmyou
11/09/2018 01:39 PMPosted by Erelir
Just post in the existing thread, pal. Your fresh new take on this topic isn’t interesting enough to warrant a new one.

I’ve already spent about as much cognitive effort as I’m willing to on the subject.

Edit: Also, I have to ask: Why did you put quotation marks around Ion’s name? Do you think that’s an alias or something?


I just looked at your armory, you are 350 item lvl and have never broken 1550 in either Arena or RBGs.

I just want to point out these are the people disagreeing with me when I have far more pvp knowledge and understanding than them.

Maybe you should use your "cognitive effort" to break 1550 and actually learn about PVP before you try to tell me my experiences and thousands of other Alliance players in AV are wrong.


Post on your main if you are going to call out people already liek geezuz christ you brag so much show off your main bet you wont !
11/09/2018 02:03 PMPosted by Igyfarmyou
Yea I knew what Ion was saying was BS the moment I saw that other thread. I would take the claim that "everything's fine in AV, Alliance win just as much as the Horde" with a grain of salt... it just doesn't "add up" with the experiences shared by so many Ally players regarding AV specifically.

The dead giveaway was the part where he said something about "Alliance does a bit better in AV and Isle of Conquest"... just LOL, right away I KNEW something didn't sound right as soon as I read that tidbit.

Most of the time on my Alliance toon when AV pops, it's a loss.

Most of the time on my Horde toon when AV pops, it's a win.

Not sure why people are in denial about ^ this/white-knighting, they are basically calling their fellow Alliance players liars. What's interesting is that Ion comes from a lawyer background supposedly, and lying/lawyer-speak is pretty much second nature to people in that profession. So you also have to take that into consideration.


Good points here. Trusting a lawyer to tell you the honest truth and not use lawyer speak is silly.

I'm glad you caught that about Jugs too. Heres the thing, shes not a fellow Alliance player shes actually a Horde fangirl. Thats her Alliance alt, she admitted her Horde character is higher item lvl as i figured.

Shes actually mained Horde for years and been one of the most outspoked fangirls of Horde and AGAINST Alliance racials ever being buffed to even things out with Horde.

My guess is it stems from her being a lower skilled player so she needs the advantage for pvp she does on Horde. Either way its incredibly dishonest for her to post on an Alliance alt then time and time again argue that Alliance racials don't need to be changed when 90% of Mythic guilds are Horde or Horde winning 60+% of bgs and having 55+% of the playerbase.

Those statistics show a serious imbalance yet she has the gall to post on an alliance alt over and over claiming otherwise? Shes a serious disinformation troll, don't take anything she says seriously.


Oof!
...

Hah, yeah they are.. Even when you try to explain strat to them they don't seem to care. Lotta defeatism too, even when it is still winnable. I just AFK out of the ones where people aren't trying or do really stupid things at the start.


I actually did afk out of one. We were doing well, up on the kills and backcapping well. Then a HUGE horde force overran IBGY and instead of people in IBT coming to help, we wiped they took GY and IBT. Not playing with players like that and Blizzard can't stop that kind of behavior. Cry all you guys want on the forums, but it's not going to change until players themselves change. Was the same with Horde in AV for years when it was like 20/80. And for all I know, that team is still playing and could have turned it around but it wasn't looking good so I took the 15 minutes.


I was in that game with you. At the start someone had called for SHB defense, and that's what I figured people wanted to do. Yes, we were doing fine with IBGY too until too many from there went to IBT and the GY was lost. Then it turned into a pure SHB defense map, and it is so so difficult to win that way - so I took the 15 too. :) Have no idea if they managed to pull it off but I did get a salty whisper several minutes later. IDC as I was just posting on the forum, lol.

Anyway, you are right it is the players. I am seeing stupidity on horde side too now. I am generally OK having the AFK option though. I would love if a PvP MMO like Camelot Unchained actually happened the way I envision it could but I can't count on that. So it's just WoW for now until I get super bored/tired of it.
11/09/2018 06:10 PMPosted by Arthurdayne
Oof!


Seriously. Imagine having no argument, so you fall back on "she has no skill" while posting on a 29 lol
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I actually did afk out of one. We were doing well, up on the kills and backcapping well. Then a HUGE horde force overran IBGY and instead of people in IBT coming to help, we wiped they took GY and IBT. Not playing with players like that and Blizzard can't stop that kind of behavior. Cry all you guys want on the forums, but it's not going to change until players themselves change. Was the same with Horde in AV for years when it was like 20/80. And for all I know, that team is still playing and could have turned it around but it wasn't looking good so I took the 15 minutes.


I was in that game with you. At the start someone had called for SHB defense, and that's what I figured people wanted to do. Yes, we were doing fine with IBGY too until too many from there went to IBT and the GY was lost. Then it turned into a pure SHB defense map, and it is so so difficult to win that way - so I took the 15 too. :) Have no idea if they managed to pull it off but I did get a salty whisper several minutes later. IDC as I was just posting on the forum, lol.

Anyway, you are right it is the players. I am seeing stupidity on horde side too now. I am generally OK having the AFK option though. I would love if a PvP MMO like Camelot Unchained actually happened the way I envision it could but I can't count on that. So it's just WoW for now until I get super bored/tired of it.


Heh, yea. I tried doing the epics again to see if Blizzard somehow did mysteriously give Horde some kind of advantage. but nah, it's still the players in there. I'll stick to 10/15 mans and IF I'm behind on points do a quick yolo or two. I will say I could win 50% as Horde, in past expansions, just by defending a tower and getting a few with me. Haven't figured out what I can do as Alliance to turn the tide. Tried being a shgy protector so they don't screw up our defense team by sending us to SPGY, but that never really worked.
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I was in that game with you. At the start someone had called for SHB defense, and that's what I figured people wanted to do. Yes, we were doing fine with IBGY too until too many from there went to IBT and the GY was lost. Then it turned into a pure SHB defense map, and it is so so difficult to win that way - so I took the 15 too. :) Have no idea if they managed to pull it off but I did get a salty whisper several minutes later. IDC as I was just posting on the forum, lol.

Anyway, you are right it is the players. I am seeing stupidity on horde side too now. I am generally OK having the AFK option though. I would love if a PvP MMO like Camelot Unchained actually happened the way I envision it could but I can't count on that. So it's just WoW for now until I get super bored/tired of it.


Heh, yea. I tried doing the epics again to see if Blizzard somehow did mysteriously give Horde some kind of advantage. but nah, it's still the players in there. I'll stick to 10/15 mans and IF I'm behind on points do a quick yolo or two.


It is luck. Once in a while i'll play an AV with a truly amazing alliance core that essentially carries the rest if they just listen and follow the strat. Those golden moments are why I still play epics. *IF* there are forum alliance who love AV strat as much as I do (Yarrow?, not sure who else? lol) I'd be up for grouping for some casual epic enjoyment. (Still a good chance of losing on alliance side but we could at least try to make it better.)
11/09/2018 06:20 PMPosted by Utterly
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Heh, yea. I tried doing the epics again to see if Blizzard somehow did mysteriously give Horde some kind of advantage. but nah, it's still the players in there. I'll stick to 10/15 mans and IF I'm behind on points do a quick yolo or two.


It is luck. Once in a while i'll play an AV with a truly amazing alliance core that essentially carries the rest if they just listen and follow the strat. Those golden moments are why I still play epics. *IF* there are forum alliance who love AV strat as much as I do (Yarrow?, not sure who else? lol) I'd be up for grouping for some casual epic enjoyment. (Still a good chance of losing on alliance side but we could at least try to make it better.)


That's the attitude to have, not this booohooo Blizzard hates us :)

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