Blizzard lfr is a que so why not m0?

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11/12/2018 12:41 AMPosted by Dubknight
11/11/2018 11:02 PMPosted by Aewendil
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People managed to learn these things just fine when all dungeon content was queueable.


No. It's literally impossible for a player to purposefully build a 5 man comp in que-able content when...

Oh I see. You're trolling. Ok. I'm done here.


So you're saying that you can't see the advantage of having a snare or at least one ranged class in your group, unless you put that group together yourself?

You can't see the advantage of casting bloodlust unless you put the group together yourself?

Seems like these things are pretty obvious no matter how the group was constructed.
11/12/2018 12:18 AMPosted by Sevaryn
11/11/2018 11:47 PMPosted by Aewendil
I encourage anyone who can't think of any better advice than "form your own group" to get on a low ilvl alt and try creating their own M0 group to see how it actually works out in the real world. I think a lot of them don't actually realise that it's not nearly as good a solution as they think it is.


I've literally been doing this for the last few days on my warlock. It's not that hard. Seriously. It's just...not.

You put up a listing, you go do your emissary for the day, and you listen for the chime when someone applies. That's it.


And still not a single extra group was formed that day, and dozens of people gave up on doing M0 while you were doing that because they felt their chances of getting into a group were hopeless.

But again, the fact that the LFG system turns many people off doing the content at all is a feature for you guys, rather than a bug.
I don't see why not, m0 should become queue about a month or two after the xpac is released / new dungeon = new release schedule.
11/12/2018 12:47 AMPosted by Aewendil
So you're saying that you can't see the advantage of having a snare or at least one ranged class in your group, unless you put that group together yourself?

You can't see the advantage of casting bloodlust unless you put the group together yourself?

Seems like these things are pretty obvious no matter how the group was constructed.


You queue for the random group and get assigned three arms warriors. Enjoy all those snares, lusts, and battle rezzes that come from all the planned composition you don't have.

11/12/2018 12:51 AMPosted by Aewendil
And still not a single extra group was formed that day, and dozens of people gave up on doing M0 while you were doing that because they felt their chances of getting into a group were hopeless.


Not a single extra group...except the ones I was forming myself with like 310 ilvl asked. If you honestly can't work up the courage to apply for that, you don't need a queue. You need a therapist.
11/12/2018 12:51 AMPosted by Sevaryn
You queue for the random group and get three arms warriors. Enjoy all those snares, lusts, and battle rezzes you weren't able to organize yourself.


The random queue system selects balanced groups. That's why there's a wait time even when roles are relatively balanced. Anyone who used it in the last 6-7 years would know that.

It's extremely rare to get an all melee group, if it's even possible at all. I can't say for sure if it will always put a heroism-capable class in your group, but it will always put at least 1 ranged class in the group, in my experience.
11/12/2018 12:53 AMPosted by Sevaryn

Not a single extra group...except the ones I was forming myself with like 310 ilvl asked. If you honestly can't work up the courage to apply for that, you don't need a queue. You need a therapist.


Except those weren't extra groups. You still only formed as many groups as there were tanks wanting to do that content. You starting a group did not cause any extra groups to form. The tank in your group would have just joined a different group if you didn't start one.
queue for LFR and queue for normal dungeons are about the same difficulty so it doesn't shock me that mythic isn't on the group finder
11/12/2018 12:55 AMPosted by Aewendil
Except those weren't extra groups. You still only formed as many groups as there were tanks wanting to do that content. You starting a group did not cause any extra groups to form. The tank in your group would have just joined a different group if you didn't start one.


lol. Just how many 310-320 tanks do you think are joining all those other big bad elitist groups that are clearly just excluding everyone because they're terrible people who hate casuals so much? Either I'm making more runs happen and it's easier than you're making it out to be, or your premise that a problem exists at all is horrendously exaggerated to begin with.

Hell, why are tank-capable casuals refusing to open their own groups as tanks? Because they think they'll be rejected by all those totally elite low-ilvl people they let in themselves when they type "chill run" into the description?

This entire discussion is so myopic. The effort we're asking is literally to open a premade listing and go get a sandwich. But the excuses just keep flowing.

11/12/2018 12:53 AMPosted by Aewendil
The random queue system selects balanced groups. That's why there's a wait time even when roles are relatively balanced. Anyone who used it in the last 6-7 years would know that.


I've had that queue spit out rogue/warrior/lock, as well as multiple arms. It tries, but it's not perfect and doesn't select for utility.
11/12/2018 12:45 AMPosted by Aewendil
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I really feel bad for players like you. Starting or joining a mythic 0 group is one of the simplest things to do in the game. How do you function in the real world?


Goes to show the mentality of many elitist players that they can't post a single thing on the subject without being passive-aggressive or patronising.


Literal carbon copy type response. Answer the question, how do you function in the real world when you can't host a group with 4 anonymous players for 20-30 minutes on a video game? I am genuinely curious. You are the elitist prick implying you know my intent. I can have social anxiety and still complete and enjoy such a simple task. I am wondering how those who cannot even complete that survive.
11/11/2018 10:58 PMPosted by Aewendil
11/11/2018 10:53 PMPosted by Cyouskin

Form your own group.

Can't learn to swim if you never get wet.


Forming your own group doesn't solve the problem, and this has been discussed many times already in the thread.

I realise you think you're really smart but the solution you and other elitist knobs continually propose actually isn't a solution at all, since the amount of groups doesn't change.


Forming your own group is the solution for m0. Forming your own group for a ten is a lot harder because you need to actually get the key. Reminder that you are the elitist calling people dumb and elitist and acting "in a matter of fact" way.
11/10/2018 12:53 PMPosted by Sinelus
Because Mythic has mechanics that will kill you if you don't pay attention. Casuals ignore these mechanics and would wipe you. Heroic to Mythic is a huge step up and needs teamwork to some extent.


Have you been in LFR?

Literally all of the mechanics kill you if you don't pay attention.
11/10/2018 01:38 PMPosted by Actasanc
At some point they have to take the training wheels off and the creation of Mythic dungeons was partly to create that line in the sand.


Basically this.

At some point players need to make that transition into forming a group, and not being spoon fed a 15% random group buff.

Mythic 0 is casual friendly.

The entire group finder system, and making your own group, is casual friendly.

If you want the gear, if you want to progress your character, put in the effort to join, or form a group.

People who cannot manage to do this, don't deserve the gear it drops as a reward.
11/11/2018 05:24 PMPosted by Xecks
11/11/2018 05:23 PMPosted by Yusegoo
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it's funny because arguing against a queue system can also be called entitled
its funny cause its not actually.

i do bet that sounded right in your head though.

It makes a lot of sense to me. No doubt it sounds wrong to you, since "entitled" is just a random slur used against people you don't know but you're sure if you did that you'd disagree with them.
11/12/2018 02:17 AMPosted by Revlol
11/10/2018 01:38 PMPosted by Actasanc
At some point they have to take the training wheels off and the creation of Mythic dungeons was partly to create that line in the sand.

Basically this.

At some point players need to make that transition into forming a group, and not being spoon fed a 15% random group buff.

Mythic 0 is casual friendly.

The entire group finder system, and making your own group, is casual friendly.

If you want the gear, if you want to progress your character, put in the effort to join, or form a group.

People who cannot manage to do this, don't deserve the gear it drops as a reward.

LOL.
11/12/2018 02:25 AMPosted by Jelybeantoes
11/12/2018 02:17 AMPosted by Revlol
...
Basically this.

At some point players need to make that transition into forming a group, and not being spoon fed a 15% random group buff.

Mythic 0 is casual friendly.

The entire group finder system, and making your own group, is casual friendly.

If you want the gear, if you want to progress your character, put in the effort to join, or form a group.

People who cannot manage to do this, don't deserve the gear it drops as a reward.

LOL.


Nice contribution.
There is nothing wrong with more options. Stop dramatizing it.

FFXIV has queable raids and I have yet to be in one where people failed to the point everyone quit in rage.
11/11/2018 05:15 PMPosted by Yusegoo
The arguments against it are so lame.

Argument 1) It would be too hard.
Counter 1) Heroics were the old hardmode and were queue-able when they were--people still did them.

Argument 2)
People would wipe over and over and it would just be painful to do,
Counter 2) Then don't do them. Others will. Feel free to continue to PuG using your own means.


Several pages of post and no one has countered this.
11/12/2018 03:42 AMPosted by Yusegoo
11/11/2018 05:15 PMPosted by Yusegoo
The arguments against it are so lame.

Argument 1) It would be too hard.
Counter 1) Heroics were the old hardmode and were queue-able when they were--people still did them.

Argument 2)
People would wipe over and over and it would just be painful to do,
Counter 2) Then don't do them. Others will. Feel free to continue to PuG using your own means.


Several pages of post and no one has countered this.


Remember at the end of legion when people were kicking and screaming about the jerk players coming into heroic dungeons and ruining their fun because they were there to get essences? How often do people complain about getting kicked and having a debuff?

You don't want to toss everyone together randomly like that, trust me. People will take the path of least resistance (meaning no one will bother to check the group creation tool to make groups like now) but they aren't going to waste time with people who aren't on their level either, or give a person a chance to stop and figure out why that trash mob that was so easy in heroic can now kill them and everyone is going to be mad at everyone else so the next logical step would be...

To nerf M0. Which not only takes away even more challenge in the game, but feeds even more gear to people which sounds good on paper, sure, but it's erroding the point of games in my opinion.

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