Blizzard lfr is a que so why not m0?

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11/11/2018 12:49 PMPosted by Viviala
11/11/2018 12:10 PMPosted by Umbrasnout
There is no reason for Mythic 0 to not be on Group Finder. Mythic dungeons =/= Mythic raiding.
There are many reasons for more difficult content to NOT be queuable. See the beginning of Cataclysm. Seriously, go look up Ghostcrawler's response to all the complaints about those dungeons called "Dungeons are Hard!"

https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/news/2053469/wow-dungeons-are-hard. There are almost 400 pages of replies to that "thread" alone.

Cata dungeons required a small amount of coordination and crowd control. Just like M0. When I healed Cata dungeons with my guild, they weren't necessarily a cakewalk, but they were relatively painless. When I did them with LFG groups they were horrible and took much longer than they should. I remember being in Grim Batol the first week of the expansion and spending over two hours in there. I also remember zoning into Stonecore and the tank immediately leaving. And then the next four tanks proceeded to do the same. People will clamor for nerfs, just like they did back in Cataclysm.

Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it. - George Santayana


Did you do WOTLK heroics? On many occasions I have read players comparing those to today’s M0s. That was queueable. I did everyone one of those on all 12 classes to get the badges for the armor.

Yes it required coordination. That was easy as tank marked and we all knew our jobs and kill order. Rarely was anything ever said.

It can be done. Players can and will adjust. The bads will continue to complain as they stand in fire, die, get removed from group and then complain on the forums.

Please don’t compare casuals to bads. Though many bads may be casual. They are not equal.
11/10/2018 12:47 PMPosted by Kelgar
let players advance more by making m0 a que.the only place to go to advance is warfronts and lfr.a lot of players would like to run mythic dungeons.since lfr is a que why not m0?
it’s not that hard omg put some effort just type “LF dps and tank healer for m0”. It’s not rocket science.
11/10/2018 01:38 PMPosted by Actasanc
At some point they have to take the training wheels off and the creation of Mythic dungeons was partly to create that line in the sand.

Yep. They drew a line in the sand, only it was a wall intended to gate people out, lots of whom had a bad experience with the group finder and decided that it wasn't worth it.
11/11/2018 01:28 PMPosted by Spellchaser
11/10/2018 01:38 PMPosted by Actasanc
At some point they have to take the training wheels off and the creation of Mythic dungeons was partly to create that line in the sand.

Yep. They drew a line in the sand, only it was a wall intended to gate people out, lots of whom had a bad experience with the group finder and decided that it wasn't worth it.


I've had bad experiences with people that I've met through queue'ing dungeons and LFR. Let's not pretend players outside of group finder are saints
This whole argument for queable m0s doesn't make any sense at all.

Here's how you do m0's, stress free:
1). Start group in LFG (if this is whats stopping you, you simply don't get to do m0's, nuff said. Eventually, in life and games and everything, you have to put forth a tiny, little shred of effort if you want rewards. Expecting someone or some company to do that for you gets you what you have now.)

2). Include in description "Nice easy casual run for completion/quest/whatever"

3). Go do emissaries while your group is filling.

4). Invite players, and apparently there is enough of you (judging by this thread) that'd be willing to join with a description like this one has.

5). Run dungeon.

Btw "elitests" don't pug m0s. If they want to gear up a toon fast, they stack the group with high ilvl friends that share the same armor/weapon types and do it w/o pugs.

You all are severely overestimating m0s, and underestimating yourselves. If you run into a jerk? Do the exact same thing you do in LFR or whatever: Kick and/or ignore.

It's not difficult at all. If you want to do something, just gather your courage (for a video game... >.>) and @#$&ing do it for crying out loud. Take the "leap" and find out exactly what all of us already know about running m0's: you're making it into a big deal for no reason.
11/10/2018 12:55 PMPosted by Kolgait
Pretty much anything has mechanics that can kill you if you don't pay attention.


You can stand in lfr mechanics and barely be scratched.
The only way I can see M0s in queue is if they did it like heroics, need a certain Ilvl to do it. This Ilvl would have to be high enough that mechanics are more a nuisance then actual threat. This might mean it is patch 8.x or 8.x.5 before M0s are queueable but after a certain point casuals, not bads, sbould be able to do content without eating up their time.

11/11/2018 01:36 PMPosted by Dubknight
Btw "elitests" don't pug m0s. If they want to gear up a toon fast, they stack the group with high ilvl friends that share the same armor/weapon types and do it w/o pugs.


Actually, the elite don't, elitists do PuG. The difference here is attitude: Elite=eh, I have my content, they have theirs and what they do does not bother me or effect me unless I join them from time to time. Elitist="whaaaaaa I want to lord it over others how good I am, no one should be able to get the gear I do unless they are like me."
The purpose of M0 is to be a middle point between Heroic and M+. I think it's supposed to be an introduction to the idea of using premade groups instead of the random queue, without being overly difficult. So if players do decide to move on to more difficult M+ content, it's not as much of a leap.

Having three levels of dungeons that are all queue-able (Normal, Heroic, Mythic) would be kind of redundant.
OP you obviously weren't around when what they did to try and keep the bad players out of content was make Proving Grounds mandatory, if you couldn't get Silver, you weren't even allowed in heroics from memory. It was a flawed system, because some people just couldn't do the Proving Grounds, but could easily defeat bosses.
11/10/2018 12:53 PMPosted by Sinelus
Because Mythic has mechanics that will kill you if you don't pay attention. Casuals ignore these mechanics and would wipe you. Heroic to Mythic is a huge step up and needs teamwork to some extent.
So like heroics used to be?
11/11/2018 01:25 PMPosted by Dirge
Did you do WOTLK heroics? On many occasions I have read players comparing those to today’s M0s.
I did. And they weren't. They were all pretty faceroll, unless you count HoR, PoS, and Fos. Cata heroics are closer to what M0 is today. Which is my point.
11/11/2018 01:22 PMPosted by Haruhi
You can do M0 at any gear level, and it is even easier since a lot of people are willing to carry in M0 and do world tour for all plate/cloth/leather/mail to help out their friend.
Of course it's easier with overgeared players. Everything is. If M0 ever goes to queued content, then there is no guarantee you'll get any players that out-gear it. I remember the first week mythics came out that my group was asking for a minimum of 325 i-level. Those dungeons were by no means a pushover at that item level and some mechanics can and did one-shot you.

Random groups will likely have issues if all party members queued at the minimum i-level, unless Blizzard makes the i-level requirement ridiculously high. That's kind of the crux of the problem - Blizzard needs to make LFG content so it can reasonably be completed by a group of strangers with minimal communication that are all at the minimum i-level. Because if they don't... well then history has proven that complaints on the forums will ensue and we should all be prepared to endure Cataclysm Part II - The Return of the Gripers.
M0 is where the line was drawn, simple as that.

No LFG, no catering to LFG/
11/11/2018 01:38 PMPosted by Zirà
11/10/2018 12:55 PMPosted by Kolgait
Pretty much anything has mechanics that can kill you if you don't pay attention.


You can stand in lfr mechanics and barely be scratched.
Then how do LFR wipes happen? Because they do. This is exactly why - "It's only LFR!" That's why people wipe.

I'm not saying LFR is hard or requires nearly as much thought/effort as N, just that yes, mechanics and fire can absolutely kill you in LFR. ToT in MoP was a blast. Ah, Durumu. Edit; inless you want recent examples, then Zul and G'huun are swimming in the corpses of groups that have wiped.
11/11/2018 02:56 PMPosted by Vertigineux
Then how do LFR wipes happen? Because they do. This is exactly why - "It's only LFR!" That's why people wipe.
And those people that wipe in LFR are the same ones that will be queueing for M0. Queueable content has to be able to be completed by the lowest possible denominator.
11/11/2018 02:56 PMPosted by Vertigineux
I'm not saying LFR is hard or requires nearly as much thought/effort as N, just that yes, mechanics and fire can absolutely kill you in LFR. ToT in MoP was a blast. Ah, Durumu. Edit; inless you want recent examples, then Zul and G'huun are swimming in the corpses of groups that have wiped.
Think of LFG M0's as being the General Nazgrim of LFR Siege of Orgrimmar. https://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/search?q=lfr+nazgrim&forum=984270 - 150 pages of complaints about that one LFR boss. https://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/search?q=lfr+durumu&forum=984270 same with Durumu.
11/11/2018 02:56 PMPosted by Vertigineux
ToT in MoP was a blast. Ah, Durumu.

Remember LFR Garalon before it got nerfed beyond recognition? I honestly don't think I've ever laughed harder in this game.
Mythic 0 isn't any harder than Heroic. It just takes longer to kill things. I'd rather not have 30 minutes of spamming for groups piled on top of that drudgery.

Oh well, I don't. I got better things to do than Mythic.
Mythic 0 is a joke. It should be.
11/10/2018 12:47 PMPosted by Kelgar
let players advance more by making m0 a que.the only place to go to advance is warfronts and lfr.a lot of players would like to run mythic dungeons.since lfr is a que why not m0?


There are two difficulties you can queue for (normal and heroic) and two you have to make a group for (M0 and M+). Why upset that balance when M0 dungeons are still difficult content for some people? Eventually there has to be a line, and unless they nerf M0 (and the gear they give) the line is in the right place.
11/11/2018 11:50 AMPosted by Setheus
M0 has a once per week each dungeon too. Not the best situation for queues. That would have to go.


Well technically you can only do each wing of the LRF raid once a week as well. It would have to just filter out the instances you already have an active lock on is all.
11/10/2018 12:53 PMPosted by Sinelus
Because Mythic has mechanics that will kill you if you don't pay attention. Casuals ignore these mechanics and would wipe you. Heroic to Mythic is a huge step up and needs teamwork to some extent.


So does Cata timewalking and that's queueable.

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