Raider.IO is killing this game

General Discussion
11/13/2018 04:42 PMPosted by Fancypantsz
11/13/2018 04:39 PMPosted by Kalorea
If the api to make raider.io was disabled I really do wonder how the raider.io community would react.


They'd do the exact same thing they did before raider.io was a thing...alt-tab out and manually look up the applicant in the armory.

The end result is the same, it just takes longer.

No, checking Raider.io is a lot better than checking the Armory, unless I'm missing something the armory doesn't tell me if they have done even a +5 of the dungeon, so how would I know if they they have the experience to come to a +12 for example.

I can't get into pug groups at +10 or higher despite clearing tons of +15s last xpac and up to +11 this xpac. My ilvl of 382 and mythic raid experience means nothing.my score enough to get groups.

Well I mean this are totally different dungeons knowing Legion Dungeons doesn't mean you know the BFA ones, and about the Mythic Raiding experience well sure, that tells me you are probably a good or even great player, but you still need the experience, flip the tables, would you take a player that has completed every dungeon at +10 in time but has only done LFR to a Heroic Uldir run?, take into account that there are 20 or more players singing up that have Heroic experience most of them have AOTC.
11/13/2018 04:17 PMPosted by Azuremi
It's inaccurate about 80% of my runs don't even show up on there because I usually do +10s with my guild on sunday or monday being on a high pop server makes those runs not show up cause the leaderboard is full at that point. But if you look in game I have a 10 or 11 on everything.

I try to join a pug and its like dur hur you don't have raider io score.

I may be ok with it if it actually accurately showed the runs you done but it doesn't so its trash.

Why don't the people who make raider IO have a stand alone program that can scan your best runs while you have the game open like the live log programs do?


you understand its 2 people and they are not rich because of raider io, right?
The GD forums are killing this game, burn them with fire and then scatter the ashes!
Raider.IO is a horrible idea. It doesn't even record every score. How can people rely on something so inaccurate? You might as well see a fortune teller to figure out who to invite. The odds would be about the same.
I think blizzard has already addressed the leaderboard issue, all completed M+ runs are going to show on your armory from 8.1 (or possibly sooner), so raider.io will be able to pull data from that rather than from the leaderboard.
11/13/2018 05:31 PMPosted by Aewendil
I think blizzard has already addressed the leaderboard issue, all completed M+ runs are going to show on your armory from 8.1 (or possibly sooner), so raider.io will be able to pull data from that rather than from the leaderboard.


Where did they say this? Link?

If this is true, then it may finally work as advertised.
11/13/2018 05:34 PMPosted by Gulrum
11/13/2018 05:31 PMPosted by Aewendil
I think blizzard has already addressed the leaderboard issue, all completed M+ runs are going to show on your armory from 8.1 (or possibly sooner), so raider.io will be able to pull data from that rather than from the leaderboard.


Where did they say this? Link?

If this is true, then it may finally work as advertised.


https://www.mmo-champion.com/content/8138-World-of-Warcraft-Q-A-Panel
Mythic + Progression will be added to the armory panel in 8.1, showcasing your highest key for the week.
11/13/2018 05:34 PMPosted by Gulrum
...

Where did they say this? Link?

If this is true, then it may finally work as advertised.


https://www.mmo-champion.com/content/8138-World-of-Warcraft-Q-A-Panel
[quote]Mythic + Progression will be added to the armory panel in 8.1, showcasing your highest key for the week.


Hell yes! I can finally just play mythic+ without having to game the system!
11/13/2018 03:56 PMPosted by ßabak
Get rid of it.
It does nothing but add toxicity and elitism in the game.
Raider.io is good for the game, good for the people who use it, doesn't impact the people who don't since they are not people the people who do use it would group with anyway and they are both free to create their own groups as well as group with each other...

What's really creating havoc in the M+ environment right now though are the number of people who apparently feel entitled to force other people to group with them against their consent. That's real toxicity.

https://www.mmo-champion.com/content/8138-World-of-Warcraft-Q-A-Panel
Mythic + Progression will be added to the armory panel in 8.1, showcasing your highest key for the week.

This won't really fix a lot unless it also shows the rest of the dungeons you have run not just that week, but in previous weeks as your bests, what your success rates were, what your times were, and what affixes they were done with like we currently get out of the leaderboards.

Those things are important to know, should be available somewhere at a glance.

Basically, it'll be great if they replicate the functionality of raider.io into the armory, that would be absolutely fantastic. But unless they put the same information at everyone's fingertips without having to go to an outside site, people are going to continue using the outside site to help them vet who to bring, and make the M+ pug scene better.

But, if they do that, that would be wonderful. It'd be nice to have them create the raider.io system in game, allow us to have an internal game score, like ilvl did to replace gearscore, and give groups the ability to set minimum levels on the dungeon finder groups like we can currently do with ilvl.

That way, people who keep complaining about seeing groups that don't want them would just never see those groups to begin with, and a lot of the complaints would just go away. That'd be a vast improvement to the system, leave players feeling better, and be far more efficient than we currently have.

And I say that as someone who does currently and would continue to get filtered out of some groups.
Blizzard has a leader board for the mythic plus for the week which raider io website pulls the data from. On high pop servers it gets full quickly and unless you are doing a high run like 12+ usually its not going to show up on there.


I wondered when people would see this.

I have gulldies who hit this wall more than a few times....500 out of how many thousands of people?

"Raider.io measures your ability" - of 500 people.

Oops.

Raider.io is good for the game, good for the people who use it, doesn't impact the people who don't since they are not people the people who do use it would group with anyway and they are both free to create their own groups as well as group with each other...


Not when it caters to a tiny minority and doesnt take into account everyone ELSE.

No, checking Raider.io is a lot better than checking the Armory, unless I'm missing something the armory doesn't tell me if they have done even a +5 of the dungeon, so how would I know if they they have the experience to come to a +12 for example.


A lot of people have done +12 or more ..not their fault when io doesnt actually REGISTER their runs.
11/13/2018 05:54 PMPosted by Lorsaire
11/13/2018 03:56 PMPosted by ßabak
Get rid of it.
It does nothing but add toxicity and elitism in the game.
Raider.io is good for the game, good for the people who use it, doesn't impact the people who don't since they are not people the people who do use it would group with anyway and they are both free to create their own groups as well as group with each other...

What's really creating havoc in the M+ environment right now though are the number of people who apparently feel entitled to force other people to group with them against their consent. That's real toxicity.
heh. that really is toxicity.
11/13/2018 05:56 PMPosted by Aehl
Blizzard has a leader board for the mythic plus for the week which raider io website pulls the data from. On high pop servers it gets full quickly and unless you are doing a high run like 12+ usually its not going to show up on there.


I wondered when people would see this.

I have gulldies who hit this wall more than a few times....500 out of how many thousands of people?

"Raider.io measures your ability" - of 500 people.

Oops.
2500 people actually. per server.
11/13/2018 03:56 PMPosted by ßabak
It does nothing but add toxicity and elitism in the game.

It adds a superior metric to ilvl/achievements for determining whether or not someone is capable of holding their own in M+ content.

<span class="truncated">...</span>
Hrm? So how does the site actually work? I'm not sure what or when it reports things.


Blizzard has a leader board for the mythic plus for the week which raider io website pulls the data from. On high pop servers it gets full quickly and unless you are doing a high run like 12+ usually its not going to show up on there.

On Tuesday or Wednesday you are most likely good to record a +10 other days not so much. I usually don't do a run for the weekly chest till Monday cause its the last day to do it.

Funny, because my 10s have all registered even at 10am Tuesday morning. It is a problem, but not as large as people make it out to be. Also not a problem with the metric itself, but the availability of data.

11/13/2018 05:56 PMPosted by Aehl
A lot of people have done +12 or more ..not their fault when io doesnt actually REGISTER their runs.

Not buying it.


https://www.mmo-champion.com/content/8138-World-of-Warcraft-Q-A-Panel
...
This won't really fix a lot unless it also shows the rest of the dungeons you have run not just that week, but in previous weeks as your bests, what your success rates were, what your times were, and what affixes they were done with.

Basically, it'll be great if they replicate the functionality of raider.io into the armory, that would be absolutely fantastic. But unless they put the same information at everyone's fingertips without having to go to an outside site, people are going to continue using the outside site to help them vet who to bring, and make the M+ pug scene better.


I guess I assumed that's what it would do. If their intention is to only show the highest key completed in a given week... I agree that's pretty much useless information.
11/13/2018 05:56 PMPosted by Aehl
I have gulldies who hit this wall more than a few times....500 out of how many thousands of people?

"Raider.io measures your ability" - of 500 people.

Oops.

Its about 2500 because is for dungeon, anyway that limitation is imposed by Blizzard not Raider.io.

What Blizzard should do is either fully support Raider.io by providing information of all M+ runs, and/or implement the same functionality themselves (again, taking into account all runs).

11/13/2018 05:56 PMPosted by Aehl
A lot of people have done +12 or more ..not their fault when io doesnt actually REGISTER their runs.

Completed a +12 and didn't register?, maybe in a very highly populated realm (literally top3) and at the very end of the week, still, every run should count, but again that's up to blizzard.
11/13/2018 04:01 PMPosted by Kôringar
Gnomes are killing this game.
Get rid of them.
They do nothing but add toxicity and elitism in the game.


I was enjoying this forum, but then you had to ruin it.
11/13/2018 05:56 PMPosted by Aehl
I have gulldies who hit this wall more than a few times....500 out of how many thousands of people?

"Raider.io measures your ability" - of 500 people.

Oops.
This is a bit off on your end.

It shows the top 500 dungeon runs, per dungeon, per server, per week at any given time.

I'm not saying the system doesn't currently have problems, it does, because some runs fail to get recognized, and that's a fault that lies solely with Blizzard right now based on the inadequate amount of information they have in their leaderboards.

But it's not what you are saying.

First off, the run counts in raider.io if any member of the team gets on any servers leaderboard. So, if you are on say Tichondrius as the largest pop server, and your leaderboards have filled up, amd you bring a player from a low pop realm where their leaderboard isn't full, then you are still going to get raider.io to log it. So even high pop realms have a way to get it done (though I will say it's a poor way to have to work around the issue).

But the number of realms that are impacted by the problem is also limited, most realms do not run into this issue. Even mid-pop realms don't typically have any issue by end of week. And Most High pop realms as long as you run early to middle in the week you can get on board without issue. Right now, everything is open on every server. In a few days we might see the very highest pop servers no longer getting +2s or +3s logged. By the weekend you'll be looking at only the very highest pop servers missing +5s - 7s on some dungeons but not all. By end of weekend you'll have to probably be doing +9s up to get logged for some dungeons unless you bring a member from a lower or mid-pop server.

So yes, later in the week if you are on a high pop realm, running a low + dungeon you might get missed. That's a legitimate issue and one that should be addressed and fixed on Blizzard's end since they have complete control over it, if they just opened up the number from top 500 runs to top 2000 runs even, no realm would likely have an issue.

So the fix is something in Blizzard's control. And the amount of people impacted by the problem right now is limited.

Now, that some people are impacted means Blizzard should fix it, and I 100% support that. I don't think anyone should have to work around the issue, but to suggest its a massive problem is overstating what's happening.

You figure, 5 players per run, 10 dungeons, top 500 runs is at least 25,000 players potentially that can be accommodated right now, more since the top 500 changes over time and lower key M+ runners can be on the board and then in time replaced by higher level runs... and that's per server. The whole M+ system across all servers since you can get on other servers leaderboards by being grouped with someone from that server is at 246 US servers, over 6 million players that can be accomodated, which is almost certainly more than the current total number of players actually subscribed given some of the numbers we've seen. Now, some players do multiple keys so that can cut the number, but still... it's hardly what you are suggesting.

Again, some servers are having issues. But let's be realistic about how many people are being impacted, what the scope and scale of the problem is, and how easy the fix for it really would be. Blizzard could probably flip a number in their code somewhere from something like MAXLEADERBOARDREPORT = 500 defined to 2000 and no one would have the issue anymore. (I don't work for them or have their code in front of me, so it may not be that easy, and maybe I'm being a little flippant, but it could be very simple for them to fix).
11/13/2018 05:56 PMPosted by Aehl
Blizzard has a leader board for the mythic plus for the week which raider io website pulls the data from. On high pop servers it gets full quickly and unless you are doing a high run like 12+ usually its not going to show up on there.


I wondered when people would see this.

I have gulldies who hit this wall more than a few times....500 out of how many thousands of people?

"Raider.io measures your ability" - of 500 people.

Oops.

Raider.io is good for the game, good for the people who use it, doesn't impact the people who don't since they are not people the people who do use it would group with anyway and they are both free to create their own groups as well as group with each other...


Not when it caters to a tiny minority and doesnt take into account everyone ELSE.

No, checking Raider.io is a lot better than checking the Armory, unless I'm missing something the armory doesn't tell me if they have done even a +5 of the dungeon, so how would I know if they they have the experience to come to a +12 for example.


A lot of people have done +12 or more ..not their fault when io doesnt actually REGISTER their runs.


The ignorance in this post, where should I start.

First, it records the top 500 groups, which makes it 2500 people, per realm.

Second, it's not the FIRST 500 groups, but the TOP 500 groups. In other words, if the leadboards is full, all you have to beat is the 500th place for it to register.

Third, it'll register the score for you if the run ranked on the realm of ANY member in the group.

Last, very few servers will be full at 12 not on time. I'm on Proudmoore, which is fairly active. On Monday, the highest requirement to score was I believe 11 not on time on 3-4 of the dungeons.
11/13/2018 05:34 PMPosted by Gulrum
Where did they say this? Link?


it already works exactly as it says it does.
11/13/2018 05:56 PMPosted by Aehl
I have gulldies who hit this wall more than a few times....500 out of how many thousands of people?

"Raider.io measures your ability" - of 500 people.

Oops.


of the top 500 completions of each dungeon, updating every day so if you hit the leaderboard on any given day, it counts. you should really learn how it works before you talk about it so you dont look silly.

oops.

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