The "You're not entitled" myth...

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11/06/2018 09:35 AMPosted by Nawat
With that being said it is still in blizzards best interest to listen to absolutely every opinion. If they can make an unhappy customer happy without completely wrecking someone else's time they earn an extra buck.


They don't have the manpower to make every customer happy.

Customers demand things that take MAN-MONTHS to create. It is impossible for Blizzard to create them all, or even most of them.
11/06/2018 09:09 AMPosted by Onorlus
11/06/2018 09:00 AMPosted by Båkkag
OP you're going to have a really rough time out in the real world... /facepalm

#thecustomerisalmostneverright


I am fortunate, and sometimes cursed, to be running my own small business... a bowling alley.

I am able to use an oil pattern that can make it easier or harder for people to bowl higher scores. My choice.

Years ago, people practiced to be a better bowler. Now, they want to walk in, bowl high scores, and leave. No one wants to practice anymore.

Years ago, I had a tougher oil pattern than almost every other bowling alley in the area. I was a firm believer that you should PRACTICE if you want to be better. And more practicing meant more revenue for my business.

My customers disagreed and started to go elsewhere to bowl. I had 2 choices: Make my oil pattern easier or continue to lose customers and close my doors.

I'm still in business. So who needs who?
I really like your comment as I too used to run a bowling alley, for my local college. I also feel that same way as you that they should practice to get better. Since there were classes being held every other day, i intentionally altered the oil pattern so it was different every class... not to be mean, but to challange them and see how suited they were to adapting.
11/06/2018 08:21 AMPosted by Onorlus
I'm seeing many people comment that a big problem with the Blizzard/player relationship is that the players feel "entitled".

I believe a majority of them do....And they should.

WE pay Blizzard. They work for us. They are autonomous but their income comes from the players. And in any relationship there will be some discord from time to time. The parties should be able to work through it for the relationship to continue.

However, both parties should be aware of their role....of their place.

Blizzard needs its players. Otherwise, they fold. Revenue plummets, stock values drop, investors bail.

The players do not need Blizzard. They have an abundance of options for their entertainment needs.

And because of that dynamic, the players are entitled.


The vast majority of players are ambivalent to the "train spotter" issues that the obsessed players screech about. The tone of those players is disgusting.
You also pay coke, disney, and many other companies, that does not mean they work for you. Blizzard, like all other businesses, has a product. Buying that product does not mean they are indentured to you. You may put forth your feedback, and opinions, but you are in no way entitled to anything more than they are selling. No one stops to think for every person complaining on the forums about something, there are thousands more enjoying what said person has a problem with.

If the servers crash every time someone kills a boss, people are entitled to a fix. If someone doesn't like a feature, they are entitled to a place to vent (here), and they are free to walk away from the product. It's not a coincidence you don't see many people talking about how they enjoy this game, because there is no need for input when things go well, or they are met with callous fury from the vocal MINORITY, because theirs is the only correct opinion.

Just because someone doesn't like something, doesn't give them the right to take it away from others that do. Hey, I like baseball, WoW should definitely be a sports game, because that's what I want, and who cares about people that enjoy raiding and PvP. Blacksmithing is now fence making, leather workers only make gloves, tailors are making the uniforms, yeah, it will work.
We have to learn to see the middle ground. Of course the customer is not always right. However if you dismiss the opinions of too many customers you loose your revenue base.

The customer may not always be right but they need to be listened too. Cause they are out to make money not to spend it on a passion project for themselves alone.

We are kind of like miro-invester's alone we don't matter but when we start to group up....you have to listen.
11/06/2018 08:28 AMPosted by Tinúviel
This post reeks of the "customer is always right" mentality that, having worked in customer service, I loathe. You are not entitled to your own personal wishlist being granted to you from this company. You are entitled to what they promise you. If they say "We will release an expansion on August 14th" and they release it after August 14th, you have been wronged. The community is not a collective voice, and individuals disagree. Only when those opinions are made known and tracked as a whole can a company actually act on them.

11/06/2018 08:21 AMPosted by Onorlus
WE pay Blizzard. They work for us.

No. No they don't. The customer is not always right. You have absolutely no creative control over Blizzard content, that's what they pay game developers for. Your role is to play the games and offer feedback, and if they don't make their games to your liking, you stop paying for them.

The customer isn't always right, but when the forums and sub numbers say that they aren't happy with what you are doing it wouldn't be a bad idea to consider that they might be right.
I'm more offended at Blizzard employees insulting groups of players with sarcastic remarks then shift blame on the people that were offended. That's like someone calling me a racial slur then I get blamed for being offended because it was a "joke". Then you get those boot lickers that defend the bad actions of the blizzard employee because they're not part of the targeted group. I would like to believe they get paid or a free gift or something for doing that because if they do it for free then yikes.
11/06/2018 09:46 AMPosted by Ziziana
The customer isn't always right, but when the forums and sub numbers say that they aren't happy with what you are doing it wouldn't be a bad idea to consider that they might be right.

If only 'the customer' wasn't a schizophrenic with literally 3 million voices in their head all in disagreement.
11/06/2018 09:36 AMPosted by Zeropointt
WoW is a special case because I pre-purchased 6 months of subscription time and can barely find a reason to log into the game anymore.

Don’t worry, 19 more days and you will be rid of me.

Mark your calendar: 11/25 at 2:25 pm.

Ah, you can't find reasons to log into the game, but you can find reasons to log into the forums.
Don't worry, calendar marked. I really can't wait.
Assuming they want to stay in business, Blizzard is obligated to produce products that will appeal to the majority of its consumer base. Should they fail to do so and lose enough income/support, those who sat there willing to blindly buy anything that they put out will also lose out in the future.
11/06/2018 09:38 AMPosted by Qri
11/06/2018 09:35 AMPosted by Nawat
With that being said it is still in blizzards best interest to listen to absolutely every opinion. If they can make an unhappy customer happy without completely wrecking someone else's time they earn an extra buck.


They don't have the manpower to make every customer happy.

Customers demand things that take MAN-MONTHS to create. It is impossible for Blizzard to create them all, or even most of them.


You're 100% right!! Still... It's in their best interest to try!
11/06/2018 09:46 AMPosted by Snowfox
11/06/2018 09:46 AMPosted by Ziziana
The customer isn't always right, but when the forums and sub numbers say that they aren't happy with what you are doing it wouldn't be a bad idea to consider that they might be right.

If only 'the customer' wasn't a schizophrenic with literally 3 million voices in their head all in disagreement.

Azerite is garbage is pretty universal.
Character progression feels bad is pretty universal.
Terrible specs not getting buffs and good specs only getting nerfs feels bad is pretty universal.
11/06/2018 09:46 AMPosted by Ziziana
The customer isn't always right, but when the forums and sub numbers say that they aren't happy with what you are doing it wouldn't be a bad idea to consider that they might be right.

Forums have always been a cesspool of unending complaints. People don't come here to say "I love the game, I'm really satisfied with my new race/class/spec! Kul Tiras has the greatest level design in WoW history!"
You also don't know the sub numbers, and they haven't been released since the WoD debacle, and I assure you Legion and BFA have done far better than WoD.
11/06/2018 08:48 AMPosted by Tinúviel
Like, I went to Aldi the other day and bought some banana chips. That 19 year old guy working the cash register for me and telling me to have a good day works for me now, right? I think I'll give him a raise.


can I have that in writing please. It as my son. he really need a raise. Been two years now. Never missed a day and even comes in on days off.
11/06/2018 09:50 AMPosted by Ziziana
11/06/2018 09:46 AMPosted by Snowfox
...
If only 'the customer' wasn't a schizophrenic with literally 3 million voices in their head all in disagreement.

Azerite is garbage is pretty universal.
Character progression feels bad is pretty universal.
Terrible specs not getting buffs and good specs only getting nerfs feels bad is pretty universal.

Great, now get everyone to agree on flying, focusing on casual vs hardcore content, and whether horde or alliance need the buff.
11/06/2018 09:09 AMPosted by Snowfox
11/06/2018 09:07 AMPosted by Cognyack
...

I totally support a World of Warcraft subscription coming with a waffle of the month delivery service.

Totally.

I am.. not.. opposed.. to this waffle delivery system you're proposing..


I support this. I'm also entitled to maple syrup.
11/06/2018 08:21 AMPosted by Onorlus
WE pay Blizzard.

Um... No. No, we don't.

We pay a fee for a service provided by Blizzard. That service is the game interface and servers available for us to play on.

We purchase products from Blizzard. Those products are the "game boxes" or digital games we install on our personal PCs.

Blizzard, in turn, uses the money generated from all products and services sold to pay bills. Those bills could be anything from payroll to the water bill.

The fact that their revenue is based on consumers purchasing products and services absolutely DOES NOT give those consumers the right to dictate how, when, where, why, etc. those products and services are produced, distributed, or what is contained within them.

Blizzard goes a step above...they do actually listen to their "clients/customers" and try their best to please them as best they can based on the multitude of information gathered and the millions of persons who pay for their products and services.

We, the players of Blizzard games, the "client", the "consumer", have some odd idea that "we" are the only person that matters. We forget that there are millions of players worldwide, all of whom want what "they" want just like we want what "we" want. But what "we" want and what "they" want don't always line up. Blizzard actually does a pretty decent job of sifting through the mountains of opinions, complaints, screams, moans, tears, and other information so that they can attempt to make at least some of us happy some of the time in different ways.

No company can make everyone happy all the time. No company can please each individual consumer, they can only try to please some of them sometimes and others other times. That's just how the world works.

If you don't like the product or service provided by a particular company, you are free to not pay for those products or services.
Entitled in the GD is normally around Loot. No you arent entitled to loot in a RNG game, no one is. We get it as it comes and blizzard even changed that to be personal loot and you always have a higher chance than normal for loot.

The entitled to good content is a yes. Entitled to loot is a no.
11/06/2018 09:50 AMPosted by Snowfox
11/06/2018 09:50 AMPosted by Ziziana
...
Azerite is garbage is pretty universal.
Character progression feels bad is pretty universal.
Terrible specs not getting buffs and good specs only getting nerfs feels bad is pretty universal.

Great, now get everyone to agree on flying, focusing on casual vs hardcore content, and whether horde or alliance need the buff.

Or work on those issues instead? Since they seem to be the biggest issues?
11/06/2018 09:35 AMPosted by Snowfox
11/06/2018 09:34 AMPosted by Zeropointt
When there are no more meaningful “complaints” on GD...you’ll know that only the shills remain.

Wasn't it yesterday you were claiming GD was going to become an echo chamber?

Do you even realize how incredibly ludicrous that claim is?
I’ve been posting on forums long enough to be able to notice trends in posting habits.

This forum is slowing WAY down, and you know it is because you have as much experience with forums in general as I do.
Because this forum can only be accessed by paying a subscription fee, the natural progression is that as people start to let their subs lapse, the only remaining posters will people with good opinions of Blizzard.

You won’t hear from the disgruntled customers anymore and will go back to rating mogs and arguing about lore.

Nothing lasts forever, the fact that subs have been in steady decline since WotLK is pretty well accepted by even the most diehard fan of Blizzard products.

People leave, some come back...but most don’t. And there’s ALWAYS a small group of diehards left on the forums begging for mercy as the servers are shut down for good.

WoW is an anomaly- it was able to catch lightning in a bottle at a time when there were no real options for more “casual” MMO players. So it has the benefit of inertia. But just because the stock is doing well (the past 72 hours notwithstanding) doesn’t mean this game is.

And WoW has been moving away from the things that made it so strong in the first place for a while now. Starting with WoD. No, WoW won’t officially “die” for some time yet- maybe never. There are a lot of moves Blizzard can make with WoW that will keep it afloat for some time. When (not if...when) it goes F2P, plenty of people will briefly return to try it again, and more will try it for the first time. They might even play long enough for a few good quarters.

But I won’t be playing that diminished version of WoW even though you probably will. And I wouldn’t try to argue that everything was “fine” with said diminished version.

Even though plenty of people will.

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