BFG extremely rigged towards Alliance

General Discussion
I've never seen such an imbalanced terrain in any battleground. Specifically in BFG, horde have a GIANT, GIANT disadvantage. I am not exaggerating, I am not trolling, I'm dead serious. The terrain is extremely skewed into the favor of the alliance.

Let's take a look at the map:
http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/6673/gilneasbig.jpg

From a new person's respective, it looks like a pretty complicated battleground. Once you get used to it, it's not all that complicated. There are 4~ paths to and from the mine, 3 path to and from the light house. Sounds like a slight imbalance, but that's not what I'm getting at. The 4th path is waterworks to mine, it's long and was implemented for an achievement. It's not worth our time.

Now, here's where the messed up part is:

The Alliance have a MUCH shorter, and uninterrupted path to the Waterworks. The horde have two slight terrain interruptions on the way to the Waterworks. One path being uninterrupted, but extremely longer. The Alliance have two, extremely short, uninterrupted paths. The Alliance have platforms on the river to get them across easier, the horde have nothing. The horde have to have water walking or path of frost to get past the second interruption.

Here is the map showing what is what:

http://img810.imageshack.us/img810/9826/gil2e.jpg

Red path being the Horde main path.
Orange path is the secondary Horde Path.
Black lines are the terrain interruptions.
Blue path is Alliance main path.
Teal path is Alliance "secondary" path.

The first black line is a gate that Horde must go around or spend some time jumping to get across.


The second black line is a river that has no platforms, horde must cross this with water walking, any damage taken will slow them down.

Now this is where problems come in. Smart Alliance teams will completely abuse this.


What the alliance can do is get to the second horde interruption before the horde does, and completely abuse this. They can Ring of Frost on the river, blow off their water walking abilities, completely peel them off while the other team goes in for the cap of water works.

Here is the way it would work:
http://img708.imageshack.us/img708/8194/gil2.jpg

It is completely ridiculous. The horde can have 2 paladins with crusader aura and aura mastery, and they still would not get there in time to stop the interception.

The only hope I have in rated battlegrounds against teams that are 1500+ is to assault Light House instead of water works.

Twin Peaks are also completely ridiculous, but I'm not getting into that. BFG is worse.
horde usually win bfg in my battlegroup.. so complain more?
02/21/2011 6:25 PMPosted by Scoobydoom
horde usually win bfg in my battlegroup.. so complain more?


Sorry, I'm not talking about scrub random battlegrounds where people backpedal with PvE gear and are spamming frost bolt, I'm talking about high end coordinated rated battlegrounds.

I guess this would even be an advantage in randoms too. Maybe you're just making it a 9vs10 for your team.
02/21/2011 6:27 PMPosted by Nikkone
horde usually win bfg in my battlegroup.. so complain more?


Sorry, I'm not talking about scrub random battlegrounds where people backpedal with PvE gear and are spamming frost bolt, I'm talking about high end coordinated rated battlegrounds.

I guess this would even be an advantage in randoms too. Maybe you're just making it a 9vs10 for your team.


you sound pretty mad bro... the fact that you are doing rated bgs as an ele sham is a pretty poor choice considering how gimp they are, maybe you should respect resto and stop projecting your poor play style choices on others.

btw you're also 75 points under what you need for spell pen, and 1% under the hit cap for pvp. Before you call other people bad, you should make sure you're not bad yourself.

Do your team a favor and respec, but if you wont do that then atleast get the min stats you need to be productive instead of QQing on the forums.

The only hope I have in rated battlegrounds against teams that are 1500+ is to assault Light House instead of water works.

I was going to tell you to stop complaining and assault the other node, but you already answered your own post.



Sorry, I'm not talking about scrub random battlegrounds where people backpedal with PvE gear and are spamming frost bolt, I'm talking about high end coordinated rated battlegrounds.

I guess this would even be an advantage in randoms too. Maybe you're just making it a 9vs10 for your team.


you sound pretty mad bro... the fact that you are doing rated bgs as an ele sham is a pretty poor choice considering how gimp they are, maybe you should respect resto and stop projecting your poor play style choices on others.

btw you're also 75 points under what you need for spell pen, and 1% under the hit cap for pvp. Before you call other people bad, you should make sure you're not bad yourself.

Do your team a favor and respec, but if you wont do that then atleast get the min stats you need to be productive instead of QQing on the forums.


I'm not going to post anymore against a troll.

"Doing rated bgs as an ele sham"

Stopped right there. Move along.

02/21/2011 6:32 PMPosted by Methodize
I was going to tell you to stop complaining and assault the other node, but you already answered your own post.


If I assault the other node, it's still an advantage for the alliance, they start off with 2 assaulted nodes, we start off with 1.


you sound pretty mad bro... the fact that you are doing rated bgs as an ele sham is a pretty poor choice considering how gimp they are, maybe you should respect resto and stop projecting your poor play style choices on others.

btw you're also 75 points under what you need for spell pen, and 1% under the hit cap for pvp. Before you call other people bad, you should make sure you're not bad yourself.

Do your team a favor and respec, but if you wont do that then atleast get the min stats you need to be productive instead of QQing on the forums.


I'm not going to post anymore against a troll.

"Doing rated bgs as an ele sham"

Stopped right there. Move along.


Maybe you should actually read it, or you actually did, realized im right and decided to say im a troll instead of seeing the truth in what im saying, either way qq more
I'm sorry. I came in here and all I could think about was Big #&@$ing Gun.
I'm sorry. I came in here and all I could think about was Big #&@$ing Gun.


I was stuck on The Big, Friendly Giant. I love that book.
If I assault the other node, it's still an advantage for the alliance, they start off with 2 assaulted nodes, we start off with 1.

You said so yourself that water works isn't worth the effort.

I don't complain to be amazing at pvp or strategy for the BGs, but wouldn't it be better to throw off the "smart alliance teams" that go to the water works pathing and block you, and instead go to the lighthouse and take it, and then you now control the uninterrupted pathing to water works?

It seems to me that horde have an advantage in that they can choke hold the alliance team into their "base" and if you have the majority of your team in that vicinity you can see people trying to get by and hold lighthouse against them, considering you win the first brawl. I feel like you should have enough time to get water works in addition to the light house.
I remember the alliance qq about av, horde had a big advanage etc etc, they still suck at it even after its fix.
Had this happen in a Rated BG.

Absolute bull**%#.

Never learn from any mistakes do they?
02/21/2011 6:41 PMPosted by Methodize
If I assault the other node, it's still an advantage for the alliance, they start off with 2 assaulted nodes, we start off with 1.

You said so yourself that water works isn't worth the effort.

I don't complain to be amazing at pvp or strategy for the BGs, but wouldn't it be better to throw off the "smart alliance teams" that go to the water works pathing and block you, and instead go to the lighthouse and take it, and then you now control the uninterrupted pathing to water works?

It seems to me that horde have an advantage in that they can choke hold the alliance team into their "base" and if you have the majority of your team in that vicinity you can see people trying to get by and hold lighthouse against them, considering you win the first brawl. I feel like you should have enough time to get water works in addition to the light house.


You're not getting the concept of smart.

You don't think I haven't tried assaulting Light House instead of Waterworks? The word "smart" means they're not stupid, they will know we are not zerging WW, and will send 90% of their team back to Lighthouse. They also have the option to completely ignore us, take WW, and zerg the mines being atleast an 8 vs 2, while us heading back to mines would be plain stupid because we'd end up with 1 node, and the path back is too long.

Even if we do take LH, the defense path between mines and LH is too long, with enough pressure, they'll take one of our nodes.

This is how every rated BFG goes.
Elemental shamans can also drop an earthbind totem where the horde are going to run to root them. Lawson's team does this. It angers me.
I will say that when I'm in on winning battles for Gilneas, it's when we hold mine and waterworks (very easy to swap between the two to block attacks). But, I always bring path of frost with me for crossing the river.

edit: admittedly not rated bg experience
Sorry, but I had to laugh. BFG? Giant advantage? Heh, loved that book as a kid.
I think a lot of people are confused to the balance problem here.

Lighthouse and WW are significantly closer to each other than Mines and Lighthouse, and Mines and WW. Winning BFG is 90% defending these two nodes, because it's significantly easier to defend these two nodes than it is to capture mine.

In random BGs, I could care less about the imbalance. There is always one significantly less geared team and one team that doesn't follow any form of strategy that will lose their games 90% of the time regardless of map advantages.

My favorite part, is TP and BFG were designed specifically around the rated battlegrounds idea. The funny part of it is both of them fail greatly. Horde have to use a different strategy because of the terrain differences. TP should have been a raw mirror of a battleground. BFG should have been a perfect triangle.

Before anyone decides to point this out. This doesn't excuse the Horde advantage we've had in AB for 6 years. That advantage wasn't nearly as big of a deal when BGs were just for honor however, that advantage was a little over a second going to Lumber Mill. That never altered strategies or anything along that nature.

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