Ask the Devs - Answers #2 "PvP"

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My ice lance is getting nerfed

Why dont you remove RBG based on their previous popularity?
03/22/2011 11:51 AMPosted by Jerrion
Not a single Holy Paladin question answered.

better to not get an answer than to get the answer us hunters did on our traps

"uhh, we cant fix that sorry"

I don't disagree with you. But as someone who plays both classes SP are in a lot better shape then locks atm. Not to mention they are a hybrid so you have other options. Locks are stuck playing a support class that cant kill anything alone. That WAS NOT what warlocks have been since I started my main in early vanilla. If anything priests should be the support class. Hell all casters other then frost mages are in a bad place right now because of lockouts and melee trains....

just my humble opinion

Yeah thats true priests can always respec disc but to be honest disc priests are having horrible mana problems. I understand that locks are in a bad spot (especially demo) but Spriests friendly dispell nerf is just adding to the homogenization between classes. The dispell and off healing is what made spriests different from locks and other casters.
What I got out of the answer to questions about balance druid and ele shaman low representation in rated BGs and arenas, was simply that there's no intention to change anything other than to possibly give ele shamans another defensive cooldown.

While I know you feel these specs are "exceptional in battlegrounds", their representation just isn't there in arenas or rated BGs. After doing well over 200 RBGs I've seen maybe 10 balances druids(10 matches with them not 10 different ones) and I've only seen 1 ele shaman. My guess is the reason they are exceptional in regular BGs is because there is no coordination whatsoever by their undergeared or underskilled opponents, so all classes and specs can be exceptional if played by a competent player. That being said, the same is not true for RBGs and arenas where you won't be allowed to sit and hardcast except on very rare occasions. You are limiting these specs based on how they do at the lowest end on the pvp spectrum, which is like saying you feel a boxer who is badly underperforming in the ring doesn't need further training because he is "exceptional in bar fights".


One part of your answer about self healing for hybrids "Feral druids can stop, shift, and heal themselves up" is totally false. A feral druid can heal maybe 50-60% of their health if they burn through a full mana bar, which no smart feral can or will do because the amount of GCDs and casts it would take to heal that much whle in their weakest form and it would leave them with no mana for shifting. In fact a feral druid's largest heal is a bandage...I wish this was hyperbole, but it's the truth.

Balance druids, shadow priests, ret paladins(aside frow WG, which will be nerfed soon), and ele shaman can potentially heal themselves to full, but at the cost of most of their mana pool and several long hardcast spells...mana for these specs(aside from Ret) doesn't come back quickly. Compare this with a rogue or warrior who can self heal with no longterm penalty. Although their DPS will be lower for 5-10 seconds there is no other risk that they take in self healing, while the hybrids risk running themselves out of their resource for the rest of the fight. Considering the risk/reward difference for these 2 types healing themselves I would think that the hybrids, who risk more, should be rewarded at least the same.

I really appreciate you answering these questions, even if I disagree or vehemently disagree with some of your answers.
03/22/2011 11:02 AMPosted by Bashiok
With the exception of a few (kind of silly) dual Blood comps in the 2v2 bracket, we see most of the Blood DK complaints when they are Battleground flag carriers. Tanks are hard to kill – that’s their thing. When tanks do obnoxious amounts of damage in PvP in addition to high survivability, as happened in some of the Lich King seasons, that feels broken. In Cataclysm, their damage is a lot lower in PvP, but their survivability is high, which feels more appropriate. We did nerf the Glyph of Dark Succor to keep it from being abusive. We’d rather the role of tanks in PvP be as flag carriers and defenders rather than the dude chasing you around trying to kill you.

This does nothing to address the issue that Blood DKs have incredibly better survivability as flag carriers than prot warriors, prot paladins, or feral druids.
Nothing on fixing Charge jumping?
Q: Elemental Shaman are rarely seen in high rating Arena teams nowadays. I want to know the thoughts and opinions of the Dev. Team regarding the PVP abilities of the Elemental Shaman. Can I expect any improvement? – ?? (Korea), Mythren (Europe [English])

A: As with Balance above, Elemental was hurt by several of the Cataclysm changes. They hard cast spells a lot in a world where every melee spec (and many casters) have a reliable interrupt. (And as we’re saying elsewhere, we think interrupts are too good in PvP overall). Likewise, Elemental is hurt by dispels. Our intent was to make dispels more expensive, but that hasn’t really toned them down as much as we wanted. Long-term, as with the interrupts, we do need to chill dispels out even more. But certainly dispelling Flame Shock hurts Elemental’s damage a lot. Similarly, Elemental’s big claim to fame in Lich King was how much burst they could do in a small window, and we have toned that down a lot with the larger health pools that players have. Finally, the Heroism / Bloodlust buff was once mandatory for 5v5 brackets, and obviously isn’t any longer. Elemental could probably benefit from another survivability cooldown. Elemental Mastery doesn’t fit that niche as well as we’d like, since you need it for offense as well.

I don't want to get overdramatic about this, because too many people say "worst", "ever", and the like. But this was pretty disappointing in its lack of information. If you play one of the classes that feels they are vastly underpowered, or lacking the tools to even put up a fair fight in PVP, this regurgitation of the very things we said to you is pretty flat.

I don't think I can convey the problem, but let me try: If you're an elemental shaman, you are constantly batted around by frost mages. Or sat on by arms warriors. If they're middle campers, they start looking for you to come back across the field. Then we get a glimmer of hope that we're going to hear about what our ails are and how they intend to be fixed. You think "hell, maybe this won't be so bad if I can just get an idea of when the misery will be over."

All I can really give for feedback is the following:

If you weren't prepared to give answers on PVP, then you shouldn't have made the topic PVP. If you were prepared, why didn't you give us any information? Elemental could benefit from another cooldown? We know. We told you that. Elemental Masterys glyph wasn't working as a CD? WE KNOW! WE USE IT!

And the one issue I was praying to see addressed was why Astral Shift was removed, and if it would be coming back. Nothing? Not even a mention? If you came to the forums of these classes once in awhile it would be a different story but you don't.

We asked the very things you said back to us. Is there anyone up there like a Marketing person or a PR agent who can say "yeah thats going to go over poorly?" If there isn't, I'll do it for free. Let me know where I can send my credentials via e-mail.

I felt like a sucker for playing an evidently flawed class, but I held out because I convinced myself people at the top wanted to see us improved. This glib response smacks of indifference, which is fine. But I now can't play Elemental with any real interest because I know the outcome when faced against another class, and I know the future in a game that doesn't want to see our improvement.
And still no answer on the vanish/pet bug.

Thanks Blizz!
85 Blood Elf Hunter
Testament of Blood
03/22/2011 11:51 AMPosted by Jerrion
Not a single Holy Paladin question answered.

better to not get an answer than to get the answer us hunters did on our traps

While I can understand how game-breaking having a trap resisted (popping cool-downs thinking you have a kill or having your healer die because peels failed) at least hunters have other forms of control and bust. The skill cap on hunters is way higher than other classes (other than mage maybe?) and a well played hunter makes you want to bang your head into a wall until you pass out. Right now holy paladins just suck completely in high end arena. There is no comp that is better served by bringing a paladin over a druid/shaman/priest. Its close to as bad as druids had it in season 5 (not quite bad but its getting close)

That being said, it really sucks for hunters to! Sorry bro!
03/22/2011 11:02 AMPosted by Bashiok
Demonic Circle and fears that are good for both offense and defense
demonic circle... make it a real emergency button... because the only time i want to port is when i have a rogue and prot warrior spam stunning me while eating my face. and everyone is immune to fear for 10+ seconds nowadays... you know what happens to a non healer clothie when a melee gets to beat on them for 10+ seconds?? yeah... see ya at the graveyard.

03/22/2011 11:02 AMPosted by Bashiok
because then they would always hit, even against a stealthed rogue for instance
and if a stealthed rogue is dumb enough to step on a trap, that they can SEE, it should hit them... think of it as a dumb dumb check... in fact if a stealthed rogue steps on a hunter trap it should do 400% of watever it was going to do... just because they'd have to be an idiot to step on it in the first place.

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