[PvE] Frost Mage Guide - 4.1

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Would it be worth hard casting a FFB to maintain the trinket bonus if you get a horrible RNG streak?
It's better than "moderately viable." It's superb. Stacking won't take long; Ignite ticks will help.
07/26/2011 11:37 AMPosted by Nyteshadè
Would it be worth hard casting a FFB to maintain the trinket bonus if you get a horrible RNG streak?

I would say no, but if the stacks are about to fall off, it's probably worth it to hard cast one FFB with like 3-5 seconds left. I'm not sure what the time is between once FFB hits the target and the first DoT tick.
One thing I will say is that though the NF was the clear winner in simulation, it was only a hundred or two DPS above the alternatives. By contrast, I expect that it's BiS by a much larger margin for Fire, Shadow and Warlocks. I wouldn't tend to take one unless it was otherwise going to be sharded.
Well, due to the lack of heroic trinkets we don't have much of an option. Excluding NF, the only trinket we can get in heroic is the lightning capacitor. And that's off ragnaros....
This is correct I thought you ment to have 2 orbs out at the same time. While trying to follow your opening I used each one as soon as I could push the button all the way to poping the second Icy Veins. I take it now this is not correct?

It's been edited. You should wait till the first one is gone to cast the second. Having two out while casting frostbolt leads to possibly lost charges. And i do agree with critrocket that using it with the other one will cause a "void" where you will only be casting frostbolt.
07/25/2011 11:36 AMPosted by Switch
"First strike"

For both the "Simultaneous" and "Staggered" rotation, this is the period where you're popping Icy Veins, FFO, and Deep Freeze quickly in order to get Coldsnap on cooldown quickly so that you can repeat whichever cooldown cycle you are using as soon as possible(CSnap occurs at the 30 second mark for Simultaneous, 1 minute mark for Staggered).

Refrain "Rotation"

This is the period where FFO, Icy Veins, and Deep Freeze are on cooldown. The "rotation" aspect is basically Frostbolt while maintaining a single FoF charge for Brain Freeze procs. If a BF/FoF1 is present, it is safe to fire it off and return to FoF0. FoF2's should discharged with Ice Lance.

Priority as follows: FFB(with FoFX) -> LanceFoF2 ->Frostbolt
*This priority ONLY applies to the refrain rotation.

Pet Freeze->DF can also be considered part of the "Refrain" as well. When your DF CD is around ~4 seconds, you'll want to discharge all FoF charges before PF->DF.

LanceFoF1 is generally only appropriate during this discharge period, during times of heavy movement, or when a damage/trinket buff is about to expire.

(begin "refrain" rotation, but important to note that you will rarely have to cast Frostbolt while the two Frostfire Orb's are out)

This is correct I thought you ment to have 2 orbs out at the same time. While trying to follow your opening I used each one as soon as I could push the button all the way to poping the second Icy Veins. I take it now this is not correct?

It's not necessarily incorrect. It has it's uses, but generally on longer fights you're sacrificing FoF charges for a large DPS spike.

With Icy Veins and two FFO's running at the same you can only fire off a charge every 1.0 seconds due to the GCD constraints. Double FFO can(and likely will) proc FoFs/BFs faster than you can discharge them. DPS will spike quite high during this period but at the cost of FoF charges over a longer period. Refer to post#203 for more detail.

This is why I only use(if Csnap comes back up) double FFO at the end of a fight since the boss will typically be sub 30%. It's a judgement call for the most part. Great for 5 man bosses since you'll never have Csnap twice, but for longer fights I generally don't do it.

I have similar opinions on Arcane(both Wotlk and Cata4.1 versions)

BUT...at your gear level I would recommend using Fire or Arcane. Frost only really begins to shine and turn heads when you can maintain the hit cap AND soft crit cap(allowing you to run Mage Armor with Glyph of Frostbolt instead of Glyphed Molten Armor). Until then you will likely be disappointed with your DPS.

Soft Crit Cap is 33.3% but raid buffs can reduce this number greatly.

5% crit buff, 5% crit debuff, and 3% from Focus Magic can drop the level you need to maintain with gear down to 20.3%, but that's asking a lot in 10 man. Make sure you're carrying glyph dust with you at all times so you can switch some things around if needed.

Thank you for your response :) Actually though I'm not dissapointed at all. I was pulling 12-14k on bosses in 5 man and only 359 ilvl+ was smoking me in the instances I've run. Anything above 10k is fine for me in 5 man, I will hit ZG/ZA Ilvl fast enough. So long as my dps is not holding the grp back i'm fine with Frost. I've wanted to play frost since vanilla, so I'm happy :)

I have a lot I can do still, as soon as I get 4 more orbs ill be making the 365 dagger.

Just remember you have a 15% damage buff in randoms and your spells will crit on a level 87 boss a lot more than a raid boss. =D

Even still, 10-12k in the gear you have on indicates you must be playing the spec pretty well. Keep at it!

We really need more Frosties pulling good DPS. I don't like having to wait until a boss is pulled to summon my Water elemental. I've been kicked from pugs countless times just for being Frost even thought I'm pulling between 17k-20k, 19k-22k with LFD buff. =(
Baeloroc 10

Running Unglyphed Molten Armor(Glyph of Frostbolt), missing 10% spell power buff, and 5% crit buff(LoTP/E. Oath)

Normally would run Glyphed Molten armor in this situation, but the 4pc PvP bonus to Frostbolt parses higher past 27ish buffed crit with Glyph of FB,

...in 4 peice 384 PvP gear. =D
Baeloroc 10

Running Unglyphed Molten Armor, Missing 10% spell power buff, and 5% crit buff(LoTP,Crit Mass)

...in 4 peice 384 PvP gear. =D

You cast Ring of Frost on Baleroc three times? wtf for? I call shenanigans.
AAaaahahahaha I KNEW that was comin! I fat fingered it once. I think the pulse check for the freeze is what ticked 3 times.
Hey Switch, I'd like to make a character on your server and ask you some questions rather than spamming forum space if you don't mind? Whenever you get the chance and aren't busy. Thanks!
Okay. Not sure when you will check this but i'll be on at 8 pm EST. I'll stay on for about 1 hour.
Of course, the very minute my raid starts. x.x lol maybe some other time?
If anyone else is using the PvP setup like me (WTB some luck)...concerning the presence of Focus Magic, 5% Crit buff, and 5% Crit debuffs in a given raid your setup should change as follows.

>33.33% buffed crit = Use Mage Armor + FB Glyph
>=30.13% buffed crit = Use Mage Armor + FB Glyph
>=25% buffed crit = Use Molten Armor(Unglyphed) + FB Glyph
<25% buffed crit = Use Glyphed Molten Armor (though it's usually a large enough drop in DPS that switching to Arcane is a good idea at this point)

FB Glyph is a lot more useful when you're using 4pc PvP.

Essentially the soft crit-cap break point for using [Mage Armor(unglyphed) + FB Glyph] with 4pc PvP drops to 30.13% instead of the 33.33% value with a PvE gear setup.
<- did 23k on zanzil as Frost, with no points in ignite; and running with glyped Frost armor. and no, was not using the frost pot.

if anything, just my opinion:

1, i dislike the idea of Frost 'needing' ignite. ignite is more of a 'fire' based element. i do like more dps, but being 'forced' to spent 8 points for ignite just felt like WoTLK's Torment of the Weak. there's got to be a better way

2, Frostfire Orb talent could use a rework. the primary effect is fine, but the secondary effect is largely useless - espeacially since we almost 100% took up glyph of Frostfire.

3, being the only 35 yard mage spec sucks. espeacially all the other spells like FFB, ice lance are all 40 yards. just put a 5 yard bonus on frostbolt in a deep frost talent - a huge improvement of life for frost mages.

4, i would like the idea of having frost mages stick to frost armor as their armor of choice - but i guess thats gonna be alot of work/rebalancing to do

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