Where are the RAID PUG's?

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Blizz killed those, didn't you get the memo?



Fixed
06/30/2011 03:55 PMPosted by Zhery
I'm one of the people for whom cutting edge content has become functionally inaccessible with the changes of Cataclysm. I'm not satisfied or impressed with your attempt to sell me on the idea of being happy with obsolete content.


If you haven't done it, its not obsolete content.

Back in vanilla people ran MC after BWL and AQ came out, and in TBC people ran Kara well after BT/Hyjal came out. There were no badge incentives to run those older raids until 2.4. People raided the content that was 'next' for them.

Wrath was the anomaly, not the norm.


Honestly? That isn't your call to make, it's mine. I'm making a commentary, as a paying customer, to the purveyors of the product. Your opinions about whether I should be happy or not aren't really relevant to the issue.

The key issue here is that the accessibility model has been changed, drastically. I don't like the changes. I liked the Wrath model, and I don't like the Cataclysm model. You considering it an anomaly doesn't influence how I plan future expenditures of my entertainment dollars. Blizzard has lost customers, specifically in relation to Cataclysm. Blizzard has also indicated they have metrics which clearly indicate that a lot of people think that the Cataclysm content is inaccessible.

I'm one of those people. I'm not speaking for any of the rest of them, but I am making my opinion clear. I'm explaining why I think the content is less accessible, and I'm explaining what I think of their attempts to placate me with obsolete content. I'm commenting on the design and business philosophies behind Cataclysm and expressing my displeasure therein.

If you think the content still seems relevant (to YOU) then by all means, have at it. But please don't try to tell me what I should think.
seasoned raiders can still do those things on their alts, they still lead, they are still successful, nothing is changed.

If you have not raided at all yet and would like to at least pug T-11 you are still SOL.


I pugged 4/6 BWD with no achievements (as in 0/12, I don't think I had even done BH at the time) and pretty bad gear before 4.2. At a later date, I pugged nef with no achievement. Knowing the encounter mechanics goes a long way.

No achievements and you don't know the fights? Well, one of those problems is easily fixable.

so you wont join a new guild because it has no guild perks...but you cant raid because you dont have a guild. well then, when you want to rai again you'll join a guild who's at similar situation and progression as you.

I'm a recruitment officer for Colossus and what I see in recruitment forums is this:

"HM 8/13 experienced (5/13 killed) lf HM 11/13+ guild, I will accept nothing less. must raid 2 days/week max between 7 and 10pm PST. realID below, contact me"

so a 5/13 wont accept anything below a 11/13. wanna bet he's not finding a 11/13 who wants him ever?
*Waves to Robokapp*

This isn't about me anymore though. I Got a random invite from a lvl 6 guild and it just so happens that they were gonna raid that night and have many more planned. I kinda hit the jackpot with them. This is about those that cannot raid because they do not have the acheive and honestly short of being very lucky there is little chance anyone has to raid at all at this point in the game.

Getting to raid should not be about getting lucky.


Unfortunately if you have to pug raids it is about getting lucky. You have to be on at the right time, see someone forming a raid who's willing to take you then hope you get lucky enough that the other 9/24 people in the raid are up to par.

So yes it's a crap shoot, that said if you spend enough time trying to pug raids you will eventually succeed. That or find a guild that is willing to raid with you, I guarantee there is a guild out there that is willing to give you shot if you are willing put in the work.

Good to know. So what you are saying is get a raid guild or be a tier behind this whole xpac?


This mentality baffles me. I mean what else can they do for you? Do they need to start scewing encounters so someone can make an addon for you that does everything in the encounter for you. Good lord......


Of course, how else are you supposed to play WoW? lol
As others have posted, if you really want to raid, there are good raiding guilds actively recruiting. We are for example.

I suggest you browse your realm forums and the guild recruitment forums.

Know what you want, go hunt for it, and join the guild that suits you. There are more guilds looking for decent raiders right now in this game than I think at any time previously.
06/30/2011 01:32 PMPosted by Delatt
People have been pugging 4.0 raids on my server for months. The last couple months a lot of them have been going for 4/4 in BoT or 5/6 in BWD.


This

I've seen a lot of pugs going on Zul'Jin, but then again it's an overcrowded carebear server.

And of course, it's "iLvl 360 PvE equipped, link achievement, go at SW bank for inspection etc etc."

But somewhat pug none the less.


Then this

Honestly? That isn't your call to make, it's mine. I'm making a commentary, as a paying customer, to the purveyors of the product. Your opinions about whether I should be happy or not aren't really relevant to the issue.

The key issue here is that the accessibility model has been changed, drastically. I don't like the changes. I liked the Wrath model, and I don't like the Cataclysm model. You considering it an anomaly doesn't influence how I plan future expenditures of my entertainment dollars. Blizzard has lost customers, specifically in relation to Cataclysm. Blizzard has also indicated they have metrics which clearly indicate that a lot of people think that the Cataclysm content is inaccessible.

I'm one of those people. I'm not speaking for any of the rest of them, but I am making my opinion clear. I'm explaining why I think the content is less accessible, and I'm explaining what I think of their attempts to placate me with obsolete content. I'm commenting on the design and business philosophies behind Cataclysm and expressing my displeasure therein.

If you think the content still seems relevant (to YOU) then by all means, have at it. But please don't try to tell me what I should think.


I'm sorry... all see is "QQ, I want Firelands to require no skill, QQ..."

I thought Cata cleaned all these Wrath babies out? Apparently not, considering they won't use the new "stepping stones" of raid design for progression...
06/30/2011 04:15 PMPosted by Convicted
seasoned raiders can still do those things on their alts, they still lead, they are still successful, nothing is changed.


Well, what I am finding is they tend to keep their alts in the same guild too... and all run their alts together for the guild achievements.
Long Story Short:

1 -) Content was easier before (and new): Wrath of the Lich King content was easier. Even on some hard moves, making the new raid "pugable". Like blue said, thats not the currently idea and people may not feel so excited to pug old content.

2 -) Most people are in a guild now: During WoTLK, being in a guild didnt matter at all. Being able to PUG the content and having social interaction by other ways made quite some players decide to go unguilded for a long time. Blizzard gave out some great perks for being part of a guild (some people may say mandatory buffs), so there are less people unguilded around, reducing the number of pugs. Long story short, the raids still happening, but that guy is doing something with his fellow guild member.

3 -) Not the best time for pugging old content: Most people are busy with Firelands stuff, doing quests around, etc.. plus it is almost summer, vacation times, blah blah blah

(sorry for the poor english)
06/30/2011 04:33 PMPosted by Cindyanne
Well, what I am finding is they tend to keep their alts in the same guild too... and all run their alts together for the guild achievements.


I'm not finding that, it's tough enough to get all of them online for the main raids, when you are talking about 2, 3, and 4 or more alt runs... those aren't going to be all guild.
Why would I care to raid content if I know full well its been nerfed and its not the same level of intensity of when it came out. Even if I haven't seen the content before its now a used piece of trash with its arm tied behind its back. I'll get no great sense of happiness knowing full well its been nerfed.

Blizzard when you initially release content it better be ready to stand on its own if you have to adjust content after release its no longer interesting. The same with leaving Titles and mounts in for nerfed content. I no longer respect or care.

I say all this coming from one of the lowest progressed factions and servers.
06/30/2011 04:15 PMPosted by Tasida
Honestly? That isn't your call to make, it's mine. I'm making a commentary, as a paying customer, to the purveyors of the product. Your opinions about whether I should be happy or not aren't really relevant to the issue.


Don't bother, blizzard has made up its mind. To them all the casuals are second rate customers and raiders are priority customers. Just accept that and make your move.

They are really not going to listen to your feedback, no matter how constructive it is because they have made up their mind. Its not worth it. Just quit the game, thats the best feedback you can give.

We'd have so much better game, if people just voted with their wallet earlier.
Why would I care to raid content if I know full well its been nerfed and its not the same level of intensity of when it came out. Even if I haven't seen the content before its now a used piece of trash with its arm tied behind its back. I'll get no great sense of happiness knowing full well its been nerfed.

Blizzard when you initially release content it better be ready to stand on its own if you have to adjust content after release its no longer interesting. The same with leaving Titles and mounts in for nerfed content. I no longer respect or care.

I say all this coming from one of the lowest progressed factions and servers.


Honestly if you were capable of doing the content before the nerfs and you wanted to you would have done it. The content is being nerfed for the people who were incapable of running it before.
I saw (successful, to boot) pugs all the time before 4.2 on Aerie Peak. Might just be your server has a dead pug community.
Keep in mind, Blizzard developers (*choughghostcrawlercough*) build this game for themselves, sure they make money off millions of players, but they are building the game so they can play for their own amusement.


I think this is fairly evident. Right now, even with the player loss, it seems Blizzard is content to let them run the ship into the ground and treat WoW as their own amusement park. I'm guessing blizzard must be too concerned with Titan to care about the bleed off of players because of problems with the game.

They cant seem to "balance" classes (which we know isnt going to happen because of far too many variables" so they decide to change aspects of the classes with each patch. What I don't understand is why they dont give a more viable pathway to obtain normal tier gear and leave the heroic gear where it belongs, in hard mode raids.

One of the biggest things that blizzard has done, and the sheeple actually don't realize it or are blind to it is that what we got with Catyclysm is half an xpac. So blizzard has to put these stupidly artificial boundaries there to try to keep people engrossed with the game. Lets limit the number of vps and jps per week. It works, but only to the extent that now people log on to get their limit and then go bye bye for the rest of the week until things reset and they can then come back on to earn their allowance again.

So far, I havent seen a return of players. Granted the patch is still fairly new and maybe people will come back, but if anything the realm seems even more devoid. As I type this it is 7pm on a Friday night and there are a whopping 26 alliance in Firelands doing quests and 42 in Hyjal doing quests.

I think Wow has reached its pinnacle in subscribers and they're now on the backslope on a long slow decline of players.

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