Class Feedback – Paladin

Paladin
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What type of content do you focus on? [PvE/PvP/Both]
-Prot - PvE
-Holy - Both

If PvE, what type of PvE? [Heroics/Raids/Other]
-Prot - Heroics only as needed, otherwise Raids
-Holy - Heroics

If PvP, what type of PvP? [Arenas, BGs, Rated BGs]
-BGs primarily, but will do Arena/Rated BGs if asked.

What are your biggest quality-of-life issues? For instance, no longer requiring ammo could be considered a quality-of-life improvement for hunters.
-I honestly don't have any? The only thing that stands out is a gap closer as a Prot, but that doesn't even really bother me any more.

What makes playing your class more fun?
-My survivability--being able to use cooldowns effectively to help my raid and myself. Being able to help out my healers with raidwall, my miniscule AoE heal (lol), and various bubbles.

What makes playing your class less fun?
-Honestly, if I didn't have fun with the two roles, I wouldn't play them, so...*shrug*

How do you feel about your “rotation”? (Rotation is the accepted order in which abilities are used to maximum efficiency.)
-While I wish it was a bit more engaging (another way to dump HP perhaps?), I like it as it currently stands. I can produce max threat and still be able to evaluate the need for CD usage on a boss fight. I appreciate the single target and AoE differences that were laid out in Cata--just wish that Consecrate wasn't so expensive in general without speccing into the talent (I chose PoJ instead).

-No rotation for holy--I just play it to have fun anyway...

What’s on your wish list for your class?
-More solid usage for Inquisition, something more single-target'ish to work into a priority over something like HW.

-Holy...umm..sorta content as it is? I'm just a part-time healer though...

What spells do you use the least?
-Probably Salv--everything else gets a good workout. Salv is sort of a "forget it" spell? I probably give it more use when one of the tanks forgets to stop pushing max threat on a tank swap--slightly odd that it gets more use against a tank than it does a DPS thanks to the threat changes....
What type of content do you focus on? [PvE/PvP/Both]

PvE

If PvE, what type of PvE? [Heroics/Raids/Other]

Raids as Protection and Retribution

What are your biggest quality-of-life issues?

Retribution

A 3 holy power Templar's Verdict has less priority than most of our filler spells. But at the same time our filler spells can delay CS and HP generation. Judgement is especially a hindrance. Overall 'clunkyness' of the ret rotation with far too much reliance on procs (Divine Purpose, Art of War). The absolute mess that occurs when popping Avenging Wrath and zealotry together with Hammer of Wrath still taking priority off our main HP finisher. Guardian of Ancient Kings should not be a 5 minute cooldown, while not a direct comparison, Pillar of Frost for Frost DKs gives 20% strength every minute while we get perhaps a little more strength on a far longer cooldown with an absolutely pathetic amount of damage when GoAK expires.

Protection

Holy power is not well thought out for protection. It works for retribution to a degree, but prot it's just an annoyance.

Not enough separation between prot warriors and prot paladins. Ardent Defender as a pathetic 31-point talent that I've had fail to proc properly many times (sometimes restoring only 8,000 health of a 170k HP health pool). The 20 second cooldown added to WoG really destroyed a very nice mechanic where the prot paladin had good control of their own health via GbtL and Eternal Glory, now holy power is mainly wasted on shield slams that don't really do anything. If Hammer of the Righteous misses/dodged/parried the primary attack, no surrounding mobs are hit, while prot warriors can still get some aggro on groups with shockwave/thunderclap even if some targets avoid the damage.

What makes playing your class more fun?

3 different specs that do 3 different things. The idea being prot as guarding their party rather than being a straight up warrior, in theory, although with the latest changes there isn't much difference.

What makes playing your class less fun?

Holy power as prot is an annoyance to deal with. Too much proc/RNG reliance as retribution. Putting more effort into playing Retribution to maximize DPS while a Frost DK is more or less pressing Obliterate and Frost Strike with Howling Blast Procs to do their best.

How do you feel about your “rotation”? (Rotation is the accepted order in which abilities are used to maximum efficiency.)

Not enough things to press as Prot, no real choice. If Avenger's Shield is on CD, you press Judgement, if both are, Holy Wrath. It's just pointless fillers between when you get to press Crusader Strike.

Ret is too proc dependant.

What’s on your wish list for your class?

Revamp holy power or at least continue to make adjustments on shorter timeframes than ignoring most issues and then hotfixing a Censure buff.

Bring back Divine Intervention as a paladin battle res.

GCD attached to changing seals. Remove the GCD to allow smoother switching to AoE damage as retribution.

What spells do you use the least?

Consecrate, Seal of Justice, Turn Undead, Hand of Salvation after the threat changes, Holy Wrath as a bottom-of-the-barrel filler for ret and prot.
What type of content do you focus on? [PvE/PvP/Both]
PvE

If PvE, what type of PvE? [Heroics/Raids/Other]
Raiding mostly, Heroics if I'm bored.

If PvP, what type of PvP? [Arenas, BGs, Rated BGs]
Don't PvP much, but when I do, BGs.

What are your biggest quality-of-life issues? For instance, no longer requiring ammo could be considered a quality-of-life improvement for hunters.
Ret seems a bit reliant on RNG, which isn't news. Other than the additional cleave to Seal of Righteousness, Seals of Command annoys me. Light of Dawn is ok for Heroics, but for raids it seems almost worthless since most fights require you spread out and/or people are moving around alot.

What makes playing your class more fun?
I like the lore behind it, and it's one of the few classes that can heal, tank, or dps. Hand spells have saved the day more than once and can be quite helpful. I like Art of War procs. Holy damage in general. Holy Radiance and Word of Glory.

What makes playing your class less fun?
Slow holy power accumulation in regards to Ret. I like Zealotry, but ignoring fillers and proc's while it's up seems awkward. Other than Holy Radiance, there isn't much in the way of raid heals in Holy's toolbox for the most part, unless I just suck.

How do you feel about your “rotation”? (Rotation is the accepted order in which abilities are used to maximum efficiency.)
The Ret "rotation" seems alright in concept, though Holy Wrath as a filler seems pretty weak. It'd be nicer if haste scaled a bit better with Sanctity of Battle to kill some of the downtime.

What’s on your wish list for your class?
I liked it when Divine Purpose had a chance to proc another HP from abilities, though there's already alot of RNG for Ret already I suppose. WotLK version of Sacred Shield (I can dream). A 3 second CD on Crusader Strike, or more meaningful fillers. The Ret 4 piece Tier 11 set bonus being available as a talent in the Ret tree.

What spells do you use the least?
Seal of Justice, Turn Evil (though it is fun when used).
What type of content do you focus on? [PvE/PvP/Both] PVE

If PvE, what type of PvE? [Heroics/Raids/Other] Heroics with some light raiding - not hardcore, just for fun.

If PvP, what type of PvP? [Arenas, BGs, Rated BGs]

What are your biggest quality-of-life issues? For instance, no longer requiring ammo could be considered a quality-of-life improvement for hunters. Not having to manage mana and holy power. Please pick one.

What makes playing your class more fun? Mana....you know, being able to heal and have fun and be conscious of my mana without obsessing about it to the point where it's the only thing I'm concerned about in an instance or raid.

What makes playing your class less fun? Holy Power and and still no good way to quest with decent damage as a healer. I don't think we need 12k damage on healers, but have you ever solo quested as a healer? Other games have designed their healers so we level slower than other classes but it's not a huge mana and time sink like it currently is with Holy Paladins. It's slow. Painfully slow.

How do you feel about your “rotation”? (Rotation is the accepted order in which abilities are used to maximum efficiency.) I dislike this idea that healers (Paladins especially) were given healing spells (and altering the way many of them work while adding new ones) so that we could make "choices" and now we're being forced into these rotations like we're DPS classes.

What’s on your wish list for your class? The removal of Holy Power.

What spells do you use the least? Flash Heal (the mana cost makes it silly), Holy Wrath, Exorcism is 8k so I don't use that much

09/12/2011 09:00 AMPosted by Nethaera
Please copy the below questions into your reply and answer each one.


* What type of content do you focus on? [PvE/PvP/Both]

PVE

* If PvE, what type of PvE? [Heroics/Raids/Other]

Tanking/healing 5-man dungeons, heroics, etc.

* If PvP, what type of PvP? [Arenas, BGs, Rated BGs]

Random BGs

* What are your biggest quality-of-life issues? For instance, no longer requiring ammo could be considered a quality-of-life improvement for hunters.

I wish you would rename "Hand of Reckoning" so that it does not have "Hand" in its title. This is a quality of life issue because the current name makes the Paladin class hard to explain to newcomers: "Hand spells are special, you can only have one Hand spell active on a person at once. Except for the Hand spell that isn't a Hand spell."

* What makes playing your class more fun?

The ability to use utility functions at the right time. Cleanse. Bubble. Hand of Freedom.

* What makes playing your class less fun?

Too many buttons - see "rotation" below.

* How do you feel about your “rotation”? (Rotation is the accepted order in which abilities are used to maximum efficiency.)

I don't really care for the Prot rotation. Two things I don't like: I don't like the tightly meshed cooldowns - it is rough to keep track of which button to hit when, and I wish things were looser, so I had more choice over which ability to hit. The other thing I don't like is how many buttons are needed - I can't fit all my buttons onto easy keybinds.

* What’s on your wish list for your class?

Shrug. Pink ponies?

* What spells do you use the least?

Turn Evil and/or Inquisition. I never want to use fears in dungeons, and Inquisition seems like you need to spec Ret to use it.
What type of content do you focus on? PVE

If PvE, what type of PvE? A bit of everything; usually questing and 5mans, would like to get back to raids (haven't since LK)

If PvP, what type of PvP? N/A

What are your biggest quality-of-life issues? The duration lengthening of the Blessings, as well as their consolidations were nice. So were the duration extensions of Seals, way back. It would be nice (and yes, I'll actually say this) to see some new icons... I'm not a healer, I'm Prot, but when I do need to heal, every icon is a hand with a different glow, while half my defensive cooldowns are a shield with a different sort of glow.

What makes playing your class more fun? Adding more attacks was great, but I'll admit that I liked having the passive defense boost that came from Holy Shield tied to WoG and CS/HoJ. Holy Power was nice, but really doesn't get much for me in the end.

What makes playing your class less fun? Worrying about spamming defensive cooldowns that are short cd and just feel like they should just be spammed constantly anyway (the change to Holy Shield). I used to play a 'Shockadin', which I know is an unofficial design, but the horrid changes to Denounce made me cry; one talent change that was so brutally pvp based that ruined a fun, if suboptimal spec.

How do you feel about your “rotation”? I like the rotation in Prot, but I find it's a little bit too dependent on the CDs. I realize tanks need CDs, but I mmiss Holy Shield's built in.

What’s on your wish list for your class? See above, i want the old Denounce back desperately. I would love to see Paladins gain something a little bit more 'caster'y... Holy Shock becoming baseline to give the rest of us something else besides judgement. I would also love to see glyphs created to allow Paladins to use the Guardian from other specs; a high dps prot pally who gets to summon the avenging Guardian, or the Shockadin getting to do the same for high dps needs, or maybe adding the healing Guardian to the prot for a different variation on survival.

What spells do you use the least? Inquisition. I forget I have this spell on my bar, frankly.
What type of content do you focus on? [PvE/PvP/Both]
-I do find myself immersed in both, with a significant amount of PvP recently. For this feedback response, I'm going to focus more on PvP since it's fresh in my mind. However, my true focus will always be PvE.

If PvE, what type of PvE? [Heroics/Raids/Other]
-My favorite aspect is raids (especially Hard-modes), but as of lately because of school and a busy work schedule, I only have time for heroics and the occasional PUG normal raid. I consider myself a PvE player at the caliber of Heroic Raids though.

If PvP, what type of PvP? [Arenas, BGs, Rated BGs]
-As of recently, mostly just Random BGs. My Paladin hadn't PvP'ed in Cataclysm much until around the start of Season 10, when I figured I'd grind an honor gear-set. I have tried other rated play, and find arenas to be the most exhilarating yet frustrating type of PvP. For whatever odd reason, I find some enjoyment in it.

What are your biggest quality-of-life issues? For instance, no longer requiring ammo could be considered a quality-of-life improvement for hunters.
-There are many, but one of the most silly ones that can easily be fixed is the 30 yard range on Hand spells. Being at range from danger is crucial to our survival, and if many other utility spells can retain a 40 yard range, why can't these? This also applies to Redemption as well.

-As a Holy Paladin in PvP, the overabundance of interrupts, silences, stuns, and other crowd control abilities are a menace to keeping a team alive. Sure, I'm able to LoS a lot of CC and fakecast, but there is only so much you can do before your teammates are really in trouble. I feel at the current time, CC and interrupt abilities provide too much reward for little thought/interaction, and should be evaluated across the board.

-Another major quality of life issue is dispels - most importantly offensive dispels. Like interrupting and CC'ing, the reward they provide for such minimal investment (barely any mana cost, but GCDs) can be game-breaking. Additionally, many of our class's defensive cooldowns (HoSac, Freedom, even Bubble!) are easily anticipated and subsequently taken away before they have a chance to provide any benefit. Adding some dispel resistance, or making certain buffs undispellable for Holy would help a lot. Gotta love latency issues when a Mass Dispel cast lands BEFORE you bubble and it STILL removes it, rendering your major cooldown worthless.

What makes playing your class more fun?
-Something I always loved, was being a truly defensive healer, and having more group-saving abilities than other healing classes did at my disposal. Having something to counter rough situations in a defensive manner provided such a rewarding feeling of accomplishment. Granted, homogenization has spread this ideal across all healers, so I feel this to no longer be the case. Long story short - a plethora of unique and defensive cooldowns made me happy.

-This next point goes both ways (good and bad) - RNG. As a healer, having to rely on uncertainty is frowned upon, since it always seems to favors us when we don't need it, but kills us when we do need it. One thing I really love is Infusion of Light. Every time I crit with Holy Shock, I feel very excited and it provides such a great advantage.

What makes playing your class less fun?
-When our defensive abilities are stomped on. If our class is balanced around having powerful abilities with assumed up-time, shouldn't they actually remain up?
-Furthermore, the style of raid healing smaller or spread-out groups is still troublesome for Holy Paladins, as we must rely on cast-time heals to do any meaningful healing.

What’s on your wish list for your class?
-For Holy: More Dispel protection, AoE healing improvements, more Hard-Casting protection (perhaps Aura Mastery + Concentration Aura combined could have a shorter cooldown than 2 minutes?). Also, perhaps improvement in Hand-spell utility.

What spells do you use the least?
-Righteous Fury.... out of habit I use it in PvP in hopes of attracting a Hunter pet or something to avoid CC (probably doesn't work any more, but like I said, it's only a habit). I know it's just a Prot spell, but even still, it has no dynamic use to it.
-Hand of Salvation. Had its uses for aggro-happy DPS, but since the hotfix to tank threat, it is now an irrelevant spell. It would be awesome if this spell was redesigned, perhaps to something like a magic-equivalent of Hand of Protection.
-Consecration. This used to be a staple spell, and now is just bleh. It not only costs a boatload of mana, its damage is just horrible. If you don't want us using it, why do we have it?
-Inquisition makes me sad as Holy. It just doesn't last long enough to even try to use it.
-What type of content do you focus on? [PvE/PvP/Both]
PvE

-If PvE, what type of PvE? [Heroics/Raids/Other]
Heroics and raids

-What are your biggest quality-of-life issues?
I have no issues with my quality-of-life

-What makes playing your class more fun?
A bigger healing toolbox so im not stuck spamming the same 3-4 spells.

-What makes playing your class less fun?
Having to spam the same 3-4 spells

-How do you feel about your “rotation”?
its not bad really, very simple, but i would love some more situational stuff to make healing seem more dynamic on a paladin.

-What’s on your wish list for your class?
Fix mastery to something else besides a weak shield, i would even like a +x% healing bonus over what we got. Please either fix or get rid of our aoe, holy radiance isnt worth using half the time(almost none in 5 mans and 10 mans) and make LoD a little stronger. Oh, and flying mount...YES!

-What spells do you use the least?
Holy radiance and light of dawn.
Just as a note this is primarily a retribution spec response.


  • What type of content do you focus on? [PvE/PvP/Both]

  • Both.

  • If PvE, what type of PvE? [Heroics/Raids/Other]

  • 5 mans, 10 mans

  • If PvP, what type of PvP? [Arenas, BGs, Rated BGs]

  • BGs, Some Arenas (up to the 1800 rated level)

  • What are your biggest quality-of-life issues? For instance, no longer requiring ammo could be considered a quality-of-life improvement for hunters.

  • The use of Holy Power over the old "Hit cooldowns when they come up" playstyle was a big change that I felt was for the better, made ret flow more instead of becoming a glorified game of DDR.

  • What makes playing your class more fun?

  • Heavy support, I like being able to assist my teammates with my abilities to aid towards victory while being able to choose to come out and dish out punishment myself.

  • What makes playing your class less fun?

  • Constantly CC'd, easily focused, dispel spam makes me feel extraordinarily weak, unable to effectively catch up to fleeing targets. These are primarily pvp concerns, ret is just very fragile in pvp with no true means to defend itself.

  • How do you feel about your “rotation”? (Rotation is the accepted order in which abilities are used to maximum efficiency.)

  • Rotation feels a bit shallow, CS 3 times then TV/Inquisition with very few filler spells to go between CS cooldowns. Wish I had a more engaging rotation.

  • What’s on your wish list for your class?

  • Holy Wrath gone the way of the dinosaurs or changed to fit Ret's play style, not being extremely weak against dispel classes, a proper means to catch up to fleeing targets or engage new targets, and not being so easily focusable in pvp.
    My primary PvE problem is basically "need something to hit between CS and TV". Holy Wrath and Consecrate are rarely used, while hitting these AoE spells in downtime between other cooldowns feels clunky. More fillers or talents to change Holy Wrath and Consecration to be useful fillers would be a godsend.

    For PvP a Ret might as well run at the first sign of a mage or other caster. Dispels are just excruciatingly effective against us to the point its not fun at all to play. While I can see the use of a dispel ability to remove abilities such as Hand of Freedom off a warrior is warranted, against the paladin it has just much more of an impact than say dispelling Power Word: Shield off of a priest. A means of defending myself against classes with dispels at the cost of either mana or offensive power would help tremendously. Its not fun to be spammed and stripped of all my cooldowns save for just Zealotry and Guardian.

    As for gap closers and snares, Seal of Justice and Long Arm of the Law just don't do the job. Justice sacrifices a lot of our offense to keep a target nearby, assuming we can even get to the target in the first place. Long Arm of the Law works until we're snared again or the target uses an ability like Heroic Leap, Blink, or Disengage to increase the gap again. Then we're back to square one of trying to get near him. Having at least Justice being applied from Judgements would help a lot. Or making Long Arm of the Law clear the initial snares on us would be helpful as well. Just having a means to engage a target again or having a fair shot at catching them are what I'd like.

  • What spells do you use the least?

  • Consecration, Holy Wrath, Seal of Justice. Between the initial 2 spells I usually hit them when I have nothing else to use as a filler for PVE ret's rotation. In pvp they feel extremely weak to use to even warrant the GCD they incur. Seal of Justice has no use in PvE whatsoever. While in pvp the damage lose for a mediocre means to hold a target nearby feels very very taxing compared to what other classes are capable of.
    What type of content do you focus on?
    PvE, with a little PvPing here and there.

    If PvE, what type of PvE?
    Raids, with a few heroics.

    If PvP, what type of PvP?
    BGs.

    What are your biggest quality-of-life issues? For instance, no longer requiring ammo could be considered a quality-of-life improvement for hunters.
    As a Protadin, mostly the threat change. Bores me so much now that I can hold a raid boss spamming Crusader Strike with Seal of Truth on. I don't. But it still takes some excitement out of it. Besides that, not so much bothers me.

    What makes playing your class more fun?
    The sheer amount of ways I have to reduce damage taken. I love my happy tank cooldowns. They make me happy in ways I should not admit. Also, captain america shield throwing.

    What makes playing your class less fun?
    As prot, not too much. I used to have a ret-spec, but it just got too... eh... to play. But as Prot, besides that threat gripe, I'm all rainbows and ponies.

    How do you feel about your “rotation”? (Rotation is the accepted order in which abilities are used to maximum efficiency.)
    Even with the constant judgement regeneration, my Mana keeps pushing the limits of dead even on the simple rotation. Lets not get started on the oh crap the raid boss is pissed off fight harder everyone! rotation.

    What’s on your wish list for your class?
    Not really sure at the moment.

    Wait! More fun glyph choices. Mostly the minors.

    What spells do you use the least?
    I actually get to use a great deal of them, which is why Prot is currently more exciting for me then most.
    Since Holy Paladins tank heal most of the time, I would love too see Mastery get an upgrade or something done with it to make it feel more useful. Right now everyone just goes Int>Spirit>Haste>Crit>Mastery which is okay, but it'd be fun to see Mastery used more if your a tank healer.
    What type of content do you focus on? [PvE/PvP/Both]
    PVE

    If PvE, what type of PvE? [Heroics/Raids/Other]
    Heroics and a Raid every so often

    If PvP, what type of PvP? [Arenas, BGs, Rated BGs]
    N/A

    What are your biggest quality-of-life issues? For instance, no longer requiring ammo could be considered a quality-of-life improvement for hunters.
    Divine Storm felt like a class defining ability for Ret Paladins and the removal of it from single target DPS has left a hole in the fun for me. I don't care how you change the numbers, but simply swap Holy Wrath for Divine Storm in their respective places and I would be very happy.

    What makes playing your class more fun?
    I know this will sound stupid to many, but I love how flashy (graphically) playing a Paladin is. Hence, why I loved Divine Storm so much. Also, I love the Divine Warrior lore of it.

    What makes playing your class less fun?
    Zealotry for ret dps is just one ability too many. I think it could just be rolled into Avenging Wrath for the same effect and we would have one less button to hit.

    How do you feel about your “rotation”? (Rotation is the accepted order in which abilities are used to maximum efficiency.)
    Tanking feels fine to me, but having a rotation that is either using HoR or CS every other cd gets a little stale. (Minor complaint really) Like I mentioned earlier, Zealotry feels out of place to me and could be rolled into another ability. Simply put I feel Ret has too many cd's to keep track of.

    What’s on your wish list for your class?
    A return of Divine Storm to single target dps. Consecrations mana cost lowered. Spell effects matched to character models; Tauren paladins block some of their own special effects.

    What spells do you use the least?
    Turn Evil
    What type of content do you focus on? [PvE/PvP/Both]

    PVE

    If PvE, what type of PvE? [Heroics/Raids/Other]

    Raids

    If PvP, what type of PvP? [Arenas, BGs, Rated BGs]

    N/A

    What are your biggest quality-of-life issues? For instance, no longer requiring ammo could be considered a quality-of-life improvement for hunters.

    Currently, Paladin tanking is in a good place. I like how I can reach combat table coverage if needed as I don't feel that putting an additional burden on my healers is very fun for anyone (especially with some encounters having large raid-wide burst, or having to react to someone not paying attention).
    However, I'm not a fan or Retribution DPS at the moment. Compared to other melee dps, retribution seems to be the odd child out. The resource systems for Death Knights and Rogues allows them to use any ability when the resource is available, not requiring them to have ability cooldowns, where warriors have almost every ability on cooldowns that 'line up' with each other. I'm sure you already know about the interactions between the crusader strike sooldown and the global cooldown, so I won't go into detail. Let me just say though, that waiting to use an ability because its not available and I don't want to waste the gcd on a weaker ability is not fun (this is as opposed to a rogue who might pool energy at certain times, who has all their abilities available). Given that not taking Sanctity of Battle as a talent makes Bloodlust useless to a Paladin (but taking it makes a well timed Zealotry an awesome period of a fight) and the fact that dps plate simply has haste on it, we can only afford 1 filler between Crusader Strikes. Also, cooldown dependency (especially on a fight like Majordomo Staghelm where i might get parried for half of my Zealotry) can be frustrating at times. Don't get me wrong, enormous burst when you know you're going to need it is amazing.

    What makes playing your class more fun?

    The incredible utility of all talent trees.

    What makes playing your class less fun?

    See above.

    How do you feel about your “rotation”? (Rotation is the accepted order in which abilities are used to maximum efficiency.)

    See above.

    What’s on your wish list for your class?

    Protection - Some sort of distance closer. Warriors and Bears have charges, Death Knights have death grip.

    Retribution - A better interaction between the Crusader Strike cooldown and the global cooldown (Sanctity of Battle)

    What spells do you use the least?

    As prot, I use almost everything. Almost my entire spellbook is bound to my keyboard and mouse because I need that utility and there is a point in almost every fight where something is useful.

    As ret, I hate that Holy Wrath has been shoe-horned into the rotation simply due to the fact that it has a short cooldown. If I'm trying to beat a giant man-druid who has the ability to transform between a scorpion and a fire cat, I don't think he's going to much notice the pea-shooter that is Holy Wrath.
    What type of content do you focus on? [PvE/PvP/Both]
    PvE mainly. I do some PvP from time to time.


    If PvE, what type of PvE? [Heroics/Raids/Other]
    I raid in 25 mains and in 10 mans on alts. I occasionally do Hs on my 4rth 85 but its terribly boring now so I've kinda stopped.


    If PvP, what type of PvP? [Arenas, BGs, Rated BGs]
    When I PvP I exclusively do BGs for fun. I'm not a serious enough PvP (on this toon) to play anything else, and prot kinda sucks outside of normal BGs.


    What are your biggest quality-of-life issues? For instance, no longer requiring ammo could be considered a quality-of-life improvement for hunters.
    I don't really have any quality of life issues. The only thing that is kinda annoying is that if I'm off tank I cannot do much damage at all because of oom (not much of a problem) and a lack of vengeance. Warriors have Vig to stack their vengeance, bears go cat, Dks switch presence (no vengeance, and I haven't raided with a blood dk since wrath so I don't know about their damage when MT or OT). Its not a huge issue; the only fights that it may affect are lord and beth, but it shouldn't be a game-breaker.
    The only other thing would be to make seals last 1 hours so they match up with Kings/Might.

    What makes playing your class more fun?
    This is an interesting question. I have played a prot pally since I started playing again back in BC. Maybe I have this odd desire to be punched in the face. I enjoy being in more control of the fight than when I'm dps (but I do love big numbers). From a class POV I enjoy the rotation somewhat. I like being able to know what I'm going to hit next, but it has become boring. Its much better than ret because I hate downtime and being completely proc dependent.
    Overall I have just loved prot since back in the day and still do. I just love the style of paladins from a lore perspective and feel powerful when I tank.

    What makes playing your class less fun?
    The simplicity of prots rotation and the randomness of rets rotation (although I'm sure if I played ret more than once a week I could get to enjoy it more and not feel so overwhelmed).

    The broken HotR that rolls to miss twice. It needs to go back to either it hits all or it misses all, not if the melee misses they all miss and if it hits then the holy damage is also rolled to hit or miss. This may have been re-fixed but it seems unfair to have it this way when you compare how the other tanks AoE abilities work.

    Losing holy power on a miss/dodge/parry of CS/HotR is annoying. I know its necessarily (or was so) to make us value threat stats and so that we couldn't spam WoG. It just isn't fun to miss 3 CS in a row or have your SotR miss so your SD proc or Inquisition falls.


    How do you feel about your “rotation”? (Rotation is the accepted order in which abilities are used to maximum efficiency.)
    I feel like its really easy as prot. I can play it without looking at my screen as long as I have some kind of sound play when I get a proc and when I reach 3 HP. I switched to:
    SotR 3HP (SD or Inq up) > Inq 3HP > CS > AS > HoW > J > Conc > HW
    Just for a lil bit more of a challenge, but its unfortunate that its only a very small dps/tps increase for the added attention needed. Looking have CDs is the good part of the rotation. I enjoy having some control over whether I live or die, but I don't like the idea of having it all hinge on my hit/exp or timing as it is now for blood dks. Some control is good, too much is bad. I am actually really enjoying having to time my HS well since I get block capped.

    Having HW in the single target rotation seems very pointless for prot and ret. Its very low damage and should be redesigned or replaced imho.

    Ret, for how often I play it, is very overwhelming, especially during bloodlust when procs are just flying off the screen. The rotation can go from not pressing anything for 3 out of the last 6 secs to spamming TV to try and be able to CS without wasting HP. I like watching big TVs pop up over and over again but it doesnt really feel like as much of a rotation when its 2-3 buttons during good times and very slow, lower damage when procs arent coming.


    What’s on your wish list for your class?

    Fix HotR
    Make AD not let me die for like 1 sec after it saves me...Its terrible annoying to have it save me, just to have an add hit me .3 secs after and kill me. Or worse yet hit me simultaneously and not even get healed.
    Give seals 1hr durations.
    Remove HW from the rotation, replace with something more dynamic.


    What spells do you use the least?
    Holy Wrath I use when I have to in order to fill a gap. I almost never have to use Divine Shield in PvE anymore. Exo is only used on the pull. All the hand spells I dont use very often, but probably more than DS. I also never use seal of justice.
    09/12/2011 09:00 AMPosted by Nethaera
    What type of content do you focus on? [PvE/PvP/Both]

    PvE, for sure.

    If PvE, what type of PvE? [Heroics/Raids/Other]

    All types of PvE. Raiding, Heroics, holiday events. I enjoy going back and doing old raids with people I care about. Heroic Raids can be fun, sometimes.

    09/12/2011 09:00 AMPosted by Nethaera
    What are your biggest quality-of-life issues?

    Holy Power seems really binary at the moment. Not enough spending options.
    Holy: Single Target or AoE (or single target because Light of Dawn isn't positionally possible)
    Ret: Inquisition or nuke.
    Prot: Single Target or AoE threat or "meh" heal on a large cooldown.

    09/12/2011 09:00 AMPosted by Nethaera
    What makes playing your class more fun?

    I love the feeling of the class, anything that makes me feel like a warrior blessed by the light.

    What makes playing your class less fun?

    Inability to respond to a situation.

    Holy: Positional requirements can be rough on Holy Radiance and LoD. So when heavy aoe damage hits, sometimes I wonder; "Should I be spamming Flash of Light to keep people alive? or Over-healing the beacon for holy power?"
    Hand of Sacrifice would be great for a lot of fights but I feel this spell ends up being a liability more often than not.

    Ret: Target switching can be a little awkward especially when CS is on cooldown, you have 0-2 holy power and you have no procs active. Hurray for melee swings taking care of those sons of flame, right?


    How do you feel about your “rotation”? (Rotation is the accepted order in which abilities are used to maximum efficiency.)


    Retribution: Random. I want to feel in control of my dps. With Divine Purpose and Art of War, I feel I have little control over my consistent dps.

    Holy: Since there isn't really a optimum rotation for holy because, at least for paladin, the triage heal system works well; I would add that weaving Divine Plea and other cooldowns can be difficult.

    Divine Plea's healing reduction effect does make it "interesting" to figure out when to use it.

    That being said for fights like Heroic Baleroc I see no "good" time to use it. This can be most frustrating when you know you can get mana back, and you need mana back, but doing so is just as dangerous as not doing so.


    What’s on your wish list for your class?

    Holy: Group targeted heal rather than a group heal with vast positional constraints.
    I would love to have a secondary stat to juggle along with haste. Mastery needs to affect all of our heals.
    Ret/Prot: Distance closer. Seal of Justice is just incredibly awkward and impractical.
    Also the range requirement on Long Arm of the Law feels odd especially when gauging the distance between you and a boss abnormal hit box.
    One major, important note here is that Long Arm of the Law is effected by slowing effects.
    Because of this it is one of the less effective distance closers in the game.

    Ret: Zealotry and Divine Purpose should somehow work together instead of against each other.

    Just get rid of the bubble. I'm sick of being balanced around an immunity effect that typically delays the inevitable, covers a player mistake or better yet is just used to remove a debuff others can't.

    09/12/2011 09:00 AMPosted by Nethaera
    What spells do you use the least?

    Hand of Sacrifice, Hand of Protection, Hand of Salvation, Seal of Justice, Divine Shield.
    I use Hands a lot as holy but basically never as prot or ret. The mentality just isn't there for those specs to use them.
    Also, Sacrifice has the genuine potential to kill you when it's most necessary.
    Seal of Justice? I'm honestly not sure what this is doing here, it has such a limited, impractical use in its current state, that it can be compared to Divine Intervention.
    Divine Shield, the oops bandaid.
    Oh, btw Hand of Freedom is literally never used in Firelands.
    It seems Hand of Freedom is really important for PvP, but typically slowing/root debuffs in raids are always immune to the freedom effect.


    I realize this wasn't asked but I think the talent trees for paladin are severely lacking synergy and talents that "link"properly.

    Speed of Light and Infusion of Light sound similar, but the spells they effect are completely different.

    Magic Cleanse for a talent point needs to become a "healer" perk.
    For fights like Baleroc, there is no magic debuff to cleanse, so this feels like a wasted talent point.
    For Ragnaros or Alysrazor a dispel will do more for the target than a heal will.
    So should I respec before every fight to make sure I have the utility of a magic cleanse only when I need it?
    Also, since Holy Light was necessarily removed from Tower of Radiance, the talent is severely under-budget.
    ■What type of content do you focus on? [PvE/PvP/Both]
    PvE

    ■If PvE, what type of PvE? [Heroics/Raids/Other]
    Raids

    ■If PvP, what type of PvP? [Arenas, BGs, Rated BGs]


    ■What are your biggest quality-of-life issues? For instance, no longer requiring ammo could be considered a quality-of-life improvement for hunters.
    Seals disappearing every time you die. Maybe I'm just bad but whenever I get brezzed (usually in panic situations) my first thought is to keep the group alive and always forget to put on my seal of insight, or cant risk the time for GCD to put it up. I think Seals should be activated until cancelled or swapped out for a different seal

    ■What makes playing your class more fun?
    all of the "life savers" like LoH and divine protection/hand of protection

    ■What makes playing your class less fun?
    wasting ~7% mana (or more) on a divine light that heals for less than a holy light crit

    ■How do you feel about your “rotation”? (Rotation is the accepted order in which abilities are used to maximum efficiency.)
    im holy so no rotation

    ■What’s on your wish list for your class?
    keep seals Active until cancelled
    for holy, I'd like to see holy power be converted to mana if we dont need it. Countless times im sitting at full holy power and the group is fully healed so I have no choice but to either let it disappear or to waste it for my ineffective mastery absorb. It doesnt have to be a substantial mana increase. maybe like .33% mana per holy power. better than a silly absorb for 600 dmg

    ■What spells do you use the least?
    Turn evil (low range), Seal of Justice

  • What type of content do you focus on? [PvE/PvP/Both]

  • Both.

    09/12/2011 09:00 AMPosted by Nethaera
  • If PvE, what type of PvE? [Heroics/Raids/Other]

  • All of the above. I like to experience content old and new, and I enjoy seeing what I can solo as a Paladin.

    09/12/2011 09:00 AMPosted by Nethaera
  • If PvP, what type of PvP? [Arenas, BGs, Rated BGs]

  • I have done BGs and Arenas. I have yet to try Rated Battlegrounds.

    09/12/2011 09:00 AMPosted by Nethaera
  • What are your biggest quality-of-life issues? For instance, no longer requiring ammo could be considered a quality-of-life improvement for hunters.

  • Being interactive with my abilities and rotations. I do miss Wrath Paladins mechanics. It always had your mind going, monitoring what was going on, if you needed to go offensive or defensive. I would not care if it was toned down for Cataclysm play, it was the mechanics that made it enjoyable. While I welcome the new Holy Power system, it is clunky.

    09/12/2011 09:00 AMPosted by Nethaera
  • What makes playing your class more fun?

  • I love being support. Paladins used to be very inbetween, but it also made them a powerful ally. I enjoy the utility a Paladin can bring, especially as Retribution.

    Also, relying on cooldowns, and our cooldowns can be stalemated.

    09/12/2011 09:00 AMPosted by Nethaera
  • What makes playing your class less fun?

  • My heals are a bit annoying as Retribution. Word of Glory is great, it helps keep my friends alive, but it leaves me with none. The tiny HoTs that Paladins had in Wrath helped keep them going. Now I feel if I try to squeeze off a heal, I'll get locked down, if I try to juke, I'm already hurting for heal. I would really like something, if anything small to give us some sort of sustainability, even if its small.

    09/12/2011 09:00 AMPosted by Nethaera
  • How do you feel about your “rotation”? (Rotation is the accepted order in which abilities are used to maximum efficiency.)

  • As Retribution, it's alright. Aesthetically, I don't feel any "oomph" like other classes get. Its just shhwng, shhwng, chhng, shnk. Other classes its SHKRRRGK BOOM lightning static slam bam! Mechanics wise, its missing something. Theres always an empty spot while you wait on cooldowns. It also makes me feel like there is little interactivity that other classes have. Can't put my finger on it.

    09/12/2011 09:00 AMPosted by Nethaera
  • What’s on your wish list for your class?

  • I would like a little flavor of Wrath back. It had some fun interactivity with it. I'm not asking for the power of back then (don't we all remember that, it was silly), just some of the fun.

    Maybe DPS hybrids could have an option at the bottom of their tree, they could go full damage, or choose a support. Choosing either or would change the effect of some abilities.

    09/12/2011 09:00 AMPosted by Nethaera
  • What spells do you use the least?

  • Consecration. A beautiful ability now too expensive and not worth the cost.

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