Patch 4.3: Tier 13 Set Bonuses - 9/29

General Discussion
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You forgot to update DK, I recommend a complete revisioning of both Tank and DPS sets.
09/29/2011 02:18 PMPosted by Nanohaxial
Probably has to do with the fact that the Doomguard for Demo does massively more damage than the other two specs. I wouldn't be surprised if the bonus still benefits Demo the most.

and yet, demo still does less dps than affliction so... your point?

  • 2P -- The duration of your Doomguard and Infernal summons is increased by [20|30] sec and the cooldown of of those spells is reduced by 4 min. (20 for Demonology, 30 for non-Demonology.)
  • 4P -- Soulburn grants a 10% increase to your spell power for 10 sec, and Soul Fire cast with Soulburn active now grants a Soul Shard.

I still don't like the two piece as the time bonus is still unequal. Why does it have to be more? Affliction and Destruction are getting rank 1 of Ancient Grimoire for free. Why should the set bonus grant 1 rank of a talent for only some specs? If Guardian pets are overpowered then change the talent that adds more to demo. Don't unfairly give other talent specs access to a talent with a tier set without compensating the other spec.

4-set is better but it still just doesn't feel right. It means everyone will be using soul fire with soul burn though it only is a requirement when down to one shard left. So it is better in it gives everyone a way to regen a soul shard in combat but it still doesn't feel right for people that don't benefit from soul fire or have to stop the other uses of soul burn just to get +10 spell power.
I have been tanking forever and playing this game since it came out and this is my first inquiry about who attends your board meetings to discuss paladins.

Who's brilliant idea was it to nerf Divine Guardian from 2 min cd 100 yd. then give us a four piece bonus a couple months later that only undoes the nerf.

I am sorry but that lacks ingenuity and I am INSULTED that your committee on this subject has spit in the face of my entire class with this pathetic excuse of a "cool bonus." I would rather have no 4-piece bonus than have a reversion of a nerf as my bonus.

Please consider the disappointment of your paladin tanking community prior to releasing this patch.

^Agreed, and don't forget about the lame 2-piece either...unless they plan on adding damage back to judgement. But yeah, that 4-piece is weak.
The 4p for dps DK is just absolutely awful...especially comparing it to something like the hunter 4p which gives equivalently nearly 4x the bonus in stat ratings that a DK gets. The proc percentage either needs to go up for it to be worth anything (pretty much no matter how high it gets, the 2p will still smash it though). The alternative is the rating boost needs to go way up...that could be fun, changing our priority while the proc is active.
Warrior 4 piece makes me happy on this inside.
And nothing to the terribad DKs set bonus. Both of ours are procs off of procs. Everyone elses are for the most part direct application. Do this, you get this. We have if it procs, you have a chance for this to happen. WTF Blizz!
The elemental tier bonus changes were nice, however a lot of us are still worried about two things

1) The 4 piece stacking bonus duration seems a bit low, and a lot of us are afraid that it will be too hard to maintain that haste. While it I'm sure Blizzard doesn't intend for the duration to be so long that it's a perma 750 haste four seconds seems like it will be a lot of mismatching. With the current duration it means that we have to have a mastery proc every other cast in order to keep a stack going, and that's assuming patchwerk style fights. I think something like 10 seconds is more reasonable.

2) As it is now Elemental shamans will still hold onto their 2 piece bonus from T12 because of how strong it is. I have no idea how Blizzard intends to sway us away from it, but hopefully it is not through nerfing it as we are only competitive with this bonus, and we do not rock the meters unless we're given pretty fights designed good for us, and bad for others (IE: patchwerk).
Did u guys change holy radiance because of the 4pc bonus? I hate the way you guys "balance " and destroy perfectly fine abilities.
I've just read the revision to feral 2 and 4piece, have to say I do look foward to berserkmanglespamming 2set, seems like it could be overpowered in comparison unless a restriction is placed on it aka:

Whenever you pulverise, your mangle (bear) critical strikes have a 100% chance to trigger savage defense for 6 seconds.

Regarding the 4 set - admit you cannot stop feral dps from using it. Your propsal will be unfair towards competant druid tanks (you know the ones, who cat dps at periods, but also brez, innervate and even paw the newly raised on baleroc.) Setting a time restriction is not a good measure, just let this one slide for a change because we all know feral dps is subpar currently, giving them a winning raid cd might make up for their current situation.

I look forward to your acknowledgement it's not worth all the RnD time to prevent cats from getting it while allowing bears who are not baddies to suffer no ill effects.
Zarhym check out the following image.

Margin of error is += 17 dps.

Keep in mind this is purely the set piece bonuses. Not based on the ilvl of the gear that would come with T13. It's just a current gear level assessment of the relative value of the set bonuses.

as with this tier, 2 piece is currently working out to be more valuable than the 4 piece. Which means we will be sitting quite well when gearing up and holding two 2 pieces.

note: the 2 piece is based on a stacking proc for rime. So you need to use a GCD to consume the extra stack granted by the 2 piece. That seems reasonable to me, given the single GCD way it worked out at over 1700 dps which is unrealistic for a 2piece. But even with the GCD, it's worth about 1280 dps, depending on how you prioritise rime. As several people guessed, the 2 piece is relatively huge right now. "Incredible" even. It's more valuable than our current 2 piece and 4 piece combined.

The 4 piece is awful. As expected, it works out to about 340 dps. The uptime on the buff is 38%. I hope that changes, or will work differently to how we've guessed (maybe it will stack, have a different proc% or trigger etc). But given bliz left our 4pc T12 worse than our 2pc maybe not.

Fun times ahead.

Do the developers see that on the image it says the 2 piece tier 12 plus 2 piece tier 13 yields the HIGHEST damage?
So Arcane basically gets a 20 second cooldown on Arcane Power?

Also, shouldn't Frostfire Bolt also have a chance to grant Stolen Time?
Yay good job blizzard :D The holy priests ones are much more favorable now <3
Healer, 2P -- After using Power Infusion or Divine Hymn, the mana cost of your healing spells is reduced by 25% for [10|23] sec. (10 sec for Discipline, 23 for non-Discipline.)

Does the "After" in this case apply to after Divine Hymn is started into the cast, or "after" the channel effect of the spell is finished. In the case of it going off just after the initial cast, you end up losing, 8-non-haste sec, on a 3 min cooldown, which leaves the active time of discounted healing spells up at 15 sec instead of 23. if on the other hand its after the spell is finished being cast that would leave holy priests with the 23 sec of discounted healing as the set bonus says.
09/29/2011 03:00 PMPosted by Thalatte
Probably has to do with the fact that the Doomguard for Demo does massively more damage than the other two specs. I wouldn't be surprised if the bonus still benefits Demo the most.

and yet, demo still does less dps than affliction so... your point?

The bonus should be roughly equivalent for all specs. The Doomguard already does significantly more damage for Demonology, so giving it an equal increase in duration would provide a much larger bonus to them. Add in the possibility of using the Doomguard more than once per encounter, and you've got an overpowered bonus that pretty much makes Demonology the only choice for DPS (while tying even more DPS into a long CD uncontrollable AI).
I think a lot a nice quality of life fixes went in with these newest bonuses...but for the love of god please do something about the dps dk double proc bonus. It IS a dps boost, of course, the problem is that it's a quality of life nightmare. DKs aren't completely gcd locked like the days of wrath, but the times when we ARE gcd locked is...when we proc. doubling up on the procs is just going to make this feel crappy, you WILL be wasting either procs or other attacks, despite being a gain that's just no fun at all.

The 4p is just not that strong, when you consider the proc chance and how RP tends to be spent (for both specs it's often dumped all at once, so your procs will just overwrite each other anyway, then you go without for a long time). I like that they're inventive set bonuses, but they just aren't going to be very fun in practice.
i feel like the 4 set bonus of the boomkin is still not competitive. If the Talent Euphoria would include Starsurge in it then the 4 set bonus would have alot more impact and would be alot more fun with.

The Euphoria that would include also starsurge would make boomkins to finally not question if it was a waste to use starsurge without eclipse since they could have use wrath or starfire and get the Euphoria proc out of it
Why isn't the DK set bonus doing anything fun? Boring design is bad design. We're already pretty GCD starved which as I recall was a specific design flaw that Blizzard was trying to rectify in 4.0, so double procs of DC or HB are going to rot until we have room to fit them in.

Try this on for size:

2 set - each tick of frost fever adds X mastery, stacks. Reset to 1 stack when disease is refreshed. Only applies to latest disease applied.
4 set - haste now affects disease tick rate.

Wow look, passive stacking bonuses that work off of each other yet don't require a rotation overhaul or force a GCD crisis.

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