LFR loot exploit is so bad. Free Tier for all

Dungeons, Raids and Scenarios
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12/02/2011 12:33 PMPosted by Infernalist
Companies shouldn't be expected to produce perfect products.

What is this logic? "perfect" is impossible to achieve, but companies have trials so they don't end up hurting, killing, or paralyzing a person for life. My point is, that's what the PTR is, and why they released it ON THE PTR - to test it. I'm sure -someone- somewhere reported it, either random people or top end guilds. But again, obviously there will be bugs, but it could have been fixed on the PTR.
If I'm reading Riggs post in this thread right, BL didn't even use the LFR framework to do this. They literally just cleared Normal mode 6 times utilizing alts and sprinkled their mains throughout each raid to soak up specific types of loot.

vodka did essentially the same thing, except the LFR framework (which has been known, and intended, since the system details were announced) allowed them to use fewer characters over all.

Yeah if this is what they did, props. I don't feel that is as wrong as the beginning of this thread kind of lead us to believe.
12/02/2011 12:55 PMPosted by Wðrgenfreman

People, this is NOT hard to understand. Look at their damn spreadsheet. http://i.imgur.com/LXX8t.png

They rotate three NEW core members who have not seen LFR loot for the week and who are on different tier tokens. The rest of the raid is comprised of 22 alts. Once those three people have seen the bosses die, they hop on their alts and three NEW core people come in who have not seen loot for the week. The only people who get loot from these runs are the three people who have not seen loot drop for the week. This is NOT an exploit or a hack; it's smart.

You don't have to be a scientific rocket to understand this.

I'm confused by this. Armory ANYONE in Blood Legion -- they haven't even done LFR yet this week. What the spreadsheet looks like is they did 6 normal clears total, all on different characters.

If Blood Legion did what the spreadsheet is telling us they did, then that's pretty legit. 6 clears of Normal Dragon Soul in the first week to gear up their mains? That's pretty awesome.

The confusion is my fault. I meant to indicate the vodka ran the LFR in the way I described, not Blood Legion. Apologies.
So they are exploiting it to become what it should of been in the first place. I'm totally fine with that.
Thank god, 4 pagest till this thread dies, and we can stop hearing about the QQs of bloodthirsty idiots Jealous of the best in the world in this game.
Please ban people who did this. Or at least something more than taking away their loot. This kind of behavior should not be encouraged. This is part of why the WoW community is so terrible. The top guilds decide that exploiting is a better way to win than honest competition.
guilds that are currently abusing this system (US side):

blood legion
eternal reign

BL hasn't even done LFR for the week.
While what the OP listed is an exploit...

Has anyone ever thought that most of the top top top end guilds were running their players through LFR with 24 alts to pass to them? This is a perfectly legitimate way to do it.

It's probably the wannabe 100-200 guilds that were exploiting the LFR loophole bug that they just hotfixed.
12/02/2011 10:03 AMPosted by Bashiok
are deciding what steps we'll be taking for the gear that was already obtained.

And what no thoughts to take action against the accounts of those who intentionally exploit the system? What reason is there for these players to not do exploits again when all it means is the gear obtained from the exploits is lost and they can continue on otherwise unaffected?

There is no fear of repercussions of ToS violation when the offenders find the current methods of enforcements to be empty which is why so many people continue to do such.
Even if they did it in LFR it really wouldn't be 'exploiting' in my opinion. Even if 3 mains/22 alts rotating on LFR is incredibly cheesy it's well within the rule set proposed by the system. If any of those characters were eligible for loot TWICE than yes that breaks the system and should be met with swift action.

I believe the uproar however is exactly that. People gaming the system to absolutely guarantee that everyone gets everything they need from the first 4 bosses by these mains getting multiple shots at each boss.

The 3 mains/22 alts rotating thing is really hard to break without fundamentally changing the way LFR works. Only allowing you to do the place once breaks the place for legitimate people who D/C or suddenly have to go. Basically it just makes the system an absolute mess.
I dunno. I'm having trouble accepting the part where its OK for an entire main raid team to get their full 4 piece set in a night, or two of raiding, and that this was intended in the light of Blizzard's implications in posts concerning their loot system in LFR.

Regardless of how they do it (though the one method is obviously an exploit that deserves harsh consequence, while the other sounds like an unintended loophole that needs correcting). Either way it sounds very dubious and NOT alright.
I can't believe people are this upset about it.
12/02/2011 10:03 AMPosted by Bashiok
deciding what steps we'll be taking for the gear that was already obtained.

You don't take it out.

You ban the character for knowingly exploiting a bug. These are NOT your average players, they know exactly what they are doing is wrong and an exploit.

If they seriously want to keep playing at the top, then they need to have everything stripped from them and told to start again from basics.
12/02/2011 01:07 PMPosted by Feff
6 normal clears lol, wow go outside or something no lifers

You do know for someone of Vodka's level it only took them about 2 hours-ish to clear 8/8, right? and that could have easily been span over the first 3 days of the patch, the 6 runs that is.
These are top end guilds, Blizzard should ban them.
But hey, if your a top end player in a top end guild or someone like Swifty. You can do whatever you want in this game and get away with it.
In defense of those guilds, it WAS a lose-lose situation for them.
They were probably thinking along these lines...

  • [A.] Blizz finds out about the gear thing but doesn't do anything because they already anticipated full 25m guild groups distributing gear in an advantageous way. Under this scenario not participating in the 384 gear thing while some other top guilds do would put them at a disadvantage for world firsts.
  • [B.] Blizz finds out about the gear thing and does consider it an exploit resulting in the gear being taken away (thus wasting the time you spent on it) and possibly handing out suspensions.

Either way, it's a lose-lose gamble.

I think the people saying they should be perma-banned are just being ridiculous though. Either they should:

  • [A.] Just get the gear taken away along with a short (3 hour to 72 hour) suspension and a warning of harsher penalties if they participate in "gray areas" in the future.
  • Or

  • [B.] Take away the gear and suspend them until Thursday of next week which gives guilds that didn't participate in the exploit a 2 day head start on heroics.

Permanent ban does seem ridiculous. Maybe a week or 2, enough to get the point across, without being too harshe about it.

By the way, I don't care if the LFR is new. There used to be exploits for sneaking in extra raids in a given week way back in vanilla, and I am fairly certain were banned for that. The LFR was explicitly setup so you only get loot once a week, this is a loop hole regardless, and should be treated as an intentional exploit of the system.

Lose-Lose gambit is a poor bet to make, when there is plenty of similar, past experiences where Blizz has had to slap players hands for being naughty.

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