Too scared to Arena...

Arenas
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01/27/2012 11:37 PMPosted by Vandaro
Actually that info is a month or so old now.


I think it was sarcasm =P
01/27/2012 07:54 PMPosted by Vaeflare
In fact, we have design plans for new PvP combat mechanics that will make PvP gear and weapons markedly better in PvP than equivalent level PvE gear and weapons.


Like being completely useless in PvE so other people don't have to carry those people in full PvP gear? Yes please.
The impression i've been getting from this patch is that the Devs felt bad for Rogues, so they've exempted them from any form of game balance until MOP. In both PVE and PVP, Rogue DPS is way out of line, and that's without Legendary Daggers. I guess Fire Mages can still compete with non-legendaried Rogues in PVE, but they are already slated for nerfs. The Daggers just take the situation from insane to Maw of C'thulu Eldritch Horror.



Like being completely useless in PvE so other people don't have to carry those people in full PvP gear? Yes please.


I somehow doubt many serious raids are "carrying" PVP-geared players. In LFR perhaps but that is what vote-kick is for.

That said, I wouldn't have a problem with your proposal if the rule was imposed for the reverse as well. Get them god damn legendaries, broken proc trinket/weapons and welfare daggers out of my PvP.


Talking about PvE in general, but you're right about it working the other way also.
Solution for one problem: create a filter that don't let players enter in a raid or dungeon with PVP gear and the same with PVE gear in BGs, RBGs or maps like Tol Barad when it is in battle.
In fact, we have design plans for new PvP combat mechanics that will make PvP gear and weapons markedly better in PvP than equivalent level PvE gear and weapons.

The overall goal is to reduce the barrier for crossing between PvE and PvP (and vice versa), as well as to also ensure that PvP gear is the best in PvP, and PvE gear is the best in PvE.


These two statements contradict. You want to make it easier to go from pvp to pve. But the biggest barrier as it stands is the fact that pvp gear far outweighs any skill in a pvp battle. This makes it so that the only way to have a real chance is to spend a while collecting pvp gear. Now you want to make pvp gear even more effective over pve gear to make that barrier even stronger? That's moving in the opposite direction.
01/26/2012 07:32 AMPosted by Suolis
I have never been this scared in my life, I haven't played arena in over 2 weeks. I am currently having nightmares of rogues opening on me and killing me.


Maybe you should go outside. I'm not sure if anyone has told you yet, but, it's just a game bro. Those pixels can't hurt you.
Burst is worse than in S5 (the first season of WotLK), rogues are a god-class, PvE gear has sh!t all over PvP, and players are even more selective about what classes/specs they bring to RBG's than arena. Blizzard is keeping a close watch? Yea, right. Cataclysm was an utter failure in regards to PvP and pushed most of my friends to quit.

I can't believe Blizzard is going to include arena in the Battle.net World Championship. It's not entertaining at all because very, very few resources are dedicated to PvP. Arena is either an e-sport or it's not, and Blizzard made their choice long ago. They refuse to further split PvE and PvP, actively work on class balance (as in not wait six months between needed changes), and fix broken/outdated systems like dispels and DR. Hell, they won't even do something as simple as update the interface to support PvP.
Burst is worse than in S5 (the first season of WotLK), rogues are a god-class, PvE gear has sh!t all over PvP, and players are even more selective about what classes/specs they bring to RBG's than arena. Blizzard is keeping a close watch? Yea, right. Cataclysm was an utter failure in regards to PvP and pushed most of my friends to quit.

I can't believe Blizzard is going to include arena in the Battle.net World Championship. It's not entertaining at all because very, very few resources are dedicated to PvP. Arena is either an e-sport or it's not, and Blizzard made their choice long ago. They refuse to further split PvE and PvP, actively work on class balance (as in not wait six months between needed changes), and fix broken/outdated systems like dispels and DR. Hell, they won't even do something as simple as update the interface to support PvP.


Hey they've made important changes to arena this expansion like making it take forever to conquest cap if you're over 2k rating and forcing people to win trade due to rampant mmr bugging and refusal to reset mmr. Oh and they finally managed to design almost every piece of set gear and trinkets in an entire raid tier to be blatantly overpowered in pvp, all while claiming up and down that they care and are listening despite showing zero proof by waiting 2 years to blue post on the arena forums in a thread about a shaman who is either trolling or has deep emotional issues about a video game.

One of our upcoming goals in Mists of Pandaria is to make the gap between the overall DPS/healing of both PvE and PvP items smaller. In fact, we have design plans for new PvP combat mechanics that will make PvP gear and weapons markedly better in PvP than equivalent level PvE gear and weapons.

The overall goal is to reduce the barrier for crossing between PvE and PvP (and vice versa), as well as to also ensure that PvP gear is the best in PvP, and PvE gear is the best in PvE.

More details on these upcoming changes will be posted as they become available.

I respect your polite tone and I know you are just trying to raise the OP's spirits but even your own words really boil down to having someone bail you out when a Rogue strikes. While that is indeed the best and often only solution, it really doesn't say much about the balance of Rogues in general.


Regardless of anyone’s rankings past or present, the process of learning and striving to improve never stops: it helps even the most battle-hardened gladiator remain able to go toe-to-toe with their fiercest opponents.

In team-based combat such as Arenas, pressuring an enemy in order to go for a kill or striving to protect your comrade from being the brunt of a focused assault are part of the experience, no matter what classes are driving to get the job done. Most matches are an incredibly complicated dance between combatants: a push and pull of offensive and defensive tactics, of coordinating switches, interrupts, dispels, crowd control, and of learning when to use your particular cooldowns or abilities, and when to change your tactics on the fly. Depending on who you ask, what class they are, what brackets they are in, and what team compositions they run, you are likely to get a totally different answer as to what particular class gives them the most trouble at any given time.

As far as the current balance of various classes: it’s something we are, as always, keeping a close watch on. We welcome you to post constructively about your observations in the appropriate threads, and the more focused and on-topic you can keep it, the better.

While it's not possible to address every individual thread or concern of the community, rest assured we are listening, regardless if you see us post within a particular thread or not.



Once again I am confused, you are making the ability to switch between PVE and PVP easier; but you are making it so in PVP the PVP gear is the best option and if you do not have it you will be underperofrming.

Every time I read something about what you are planning in MOP I get more confused. Good thing I am not purchasing MOP. It just sound bad.
It is too dangerous to do arenas alone! Here, take this!

*Gives you my staff*
One of our upcoming goals in Mists of Pandaria is to make the gap between the overall DPS/healing of both PvE and PvP items smaller. In fact, we have design plans for new PvP combat mechanics that will make PvP gear and weapons markedly better in PvP than equivalent level PvE gear and weapons.

The overall goal is to reduce the barrier for crossing between PvE and PvP (and vice versa), as well as to also ensure that PvP gear is the best in PvP, and PvE gear is the best in PvE.

More details on these upcoming changes will be posted as they become available.


In other words Panda era will fix it which it wont. I am not buying this or the expansion for that matter. You had 2 expansions to address the out of control burst and have failed miserably.

Next expansion will be the same damn thing. You still will not address the real issue and that is the fact that pvp and pve really need to just be separated PERIOD. Until that happens it will never ever work.

It will be another expansion of people just saying well it's a pve game.
In fact, we have design plans for new PvP combat mechanics that will make PvP gear and weapons markedly better in PvP than equivalent level PvE gear and weapons.

The overall goal is to reduce the barrier for crossing between PvE and PvP (and vice versa), as well as to also ensure that PvP gear is the best in PvP, and PvE gear is the best in PvE.


These two statements contradict. You want to make it easier to go from pvp to pve. But the biggest barrier as it stands is the fact that pvp gear far outweighs any skill in a pvp battle. This makes it so that the only way to have a real chance is to spend a while collecting pvp gear. Now you want to make pvp gear even more effective over pve gear to make that barrier even stronger? That's moving in the opposite direction.


I'm a little confused by this too... I'll admit I don't PvP much (actually I don't think I have since WotLK), but if you make PvP gear significantly better than PvE gear, doesn't that increase the barrier between PvP and PvE?

I have to be missing something (either about the way PvP works or some insight on the part of the developers on how it will work in MoP), because it just doesn't make sense to me.
Blizzards stance on this seems to be the exact same thing Microsoft does with its operating systems. They sell you something with problems then make you wait to pay for the fix. They make the cure, they create the disease.
01/28/2012 06:25 AMPosted by Ðibble
I have never been this scared in my life, I haven't played arena in over 2 weeks. I am currently having nightmares of rogues opening on me and killing me.


Maybe you should go outside. I'm not sure if anyone has told you yet, but, it's just a game bro. Those pixels can't hurt you.

I laughed so hard when I read this. Your obviously missing the point. He's scared to do arena in a sense that its just not worth continuing because the amount of skill you put in is absolutely worthless because the amount a rogue, druid, mage, or death knight puts in will be far less and they are rewarded with 30k crits consistently every single time, global resets, finishers, CCs, healer bombs, and pretty much anything else that will suit their needs. Guess who has to take the brunt of almost all of that while having one of the longest defensive CDs in the game? Warriors, and according to Blizz the most underpowered class in PvP right now still doesn't need any help.
Funny how Blues just copy and paste instead of actually talking to people. I think skynet got to Blizzard cause they're all just mindless robots.
01/27/2012 12:12 PMPosted by Moohoof
Didn't we get these huge HP levels in Cataclysm to fix the problem with PVP burst? Why was damage scaled so high that the HP changes were negated?


This is my question, too.

Ghostcrawler and his team went to such great lengths to implement these expanded healthpools, and then proceeded to scale damage so ridiculously that all of it wound up being for nothing.

In wrath, people could die in 2 seconds or less, and that's one of the reasons WoW was disowned by MLG as an e-sport - because it was ridiculous and broken. Now, in Cata, people can die in 2 seconds or less. Was Ghostcrawler simply forgetful?

As someone else stated, at least in Wrath defense and healing was designed around the assumption that everyone can die in 2 seconds. In Cata, defense and healing is based on the model of triage or extended fights. Not to mention the interrupt and dispel mechanics are broken in Cata as well (both being too trivial). So actually Cata's PvP gameplay is even worse than Wrath, despite all this hoo-ha about bigger health pools.

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