You said you wouldn't nerf DS blindly

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http://www.mmo-champion.com/content/2656-Dragon-Soul-Difficulty-Changes-Impact-Blue-Tweets-Comics-MMO-Report

MMO Champ JUST published a blog about how effective the 5% nerf was. As the graph indicates, progress is continuing at a healthy, linear rate. It hasn't leveled off.

Why are you nerfing heroic mode, again? You explicitly told us that you would not continue with blind nerfs on auto pilot. You said you would look at the data to see if they were needed.

Heroic mode caters to a different segment of your community and I don't understand why you have to continue to nerf it towards LFR-style difficulty when there don't seem to be any HM guilds in favor of this. At the very least, you should have kept to your stated commitment and reviewed data prior to issuing the nerf.
Honestly, I think at this point, the people who really want to be progressing in the content already have finished. The rest really don't have the skills to perform beyond normal modes and I doubt any amount of buffing is going to change that.

Having the buff working in heroics modes at all was a mistake. To continue to add to said buff on heroic is even worse. Heroics ARE supposed to be the bleeding edge niche market in WoW. They are supposed to be the version of the fights that only a select few manage to defeat (and for the record, that isn't me and I don't care). I've got normal mode and LFR already. I don't need a watered down Heroic to add to that for validation.

LEAVE HEROIC RAIDS ALONE.
We're not "nerfing blindly." Keep in mind that, the debuff can be disabled. So if you and your Raid choose to do so, you can take on the encounter without it.

We also explained our thought processes in the original announcement blog about the debuff here.

For those of you who raided in Firelands and/or Icecrown you’re no doubt aware that as time goes on we want to keep people progressing by adjusting the difficulty. For any number of reasons a group may be having difficulty on a specific encounter each week, and our intent in adjusting the content is to ensure the ability to keep progressing, enjoying the content, and gearing up. With Icecrown we progressively buffed the players, and while this slow progression (and ability to opt-out of the buff) were both beneficial, it led to an expectation of your characters power, and once you left the raid you could certainly feel less effective. For Firelands we attempted to fix that by nerfing the content instead of buffing players, but we nerfed the content difficulty all at one time, which was counterproductive for players who really didn’t need as severe a change as we made. With Dragon Soul we’re attempting to do the best of both by having a progressive nerf to the content, keeping player power constant while providing small increases in assistance over a long period of time, as well as allowing players to opt-out of the assistance by speaking to Lord Afrasastrasz.


If you'll read the exact same post, it was not so-effective in normal.


This is besides the point, we KNEW the buff was going to increase, the only thing in question was when, which seems like the end of each month until it reaches 30%, judging by ICC.
02/22/2012 10:11 AMPosted by Idej
This is besides the point, we KNEW the buff was going to increase, the only thing in question was when, which seems like the end of each month until it reaches 30%, judging by ICC.


And it might not even go that high.
Neth, you know full well that turning the buff off is not an option for most guilds. I find it insulting when Blizzard continually throws that line out there, and I don't even raid these days. Let heroic BE heroic. The different levels of difficulty were there for those looking for it. Heroic was supposed to be for the top 2%. Normal for the regular joes. Now LFR for those that "wanted to see the content". Stop spoon feeding the heroic content to the LFR masses by nerfing any and all challenge in this game.
I don't mine the nerf. My raid only manages about 4 hours a week on average (0-2 hours this week =( ). We can only spend about 4 hours downing a new heroic boss. This gives us the advantage because we can gear up while waiting for the nerfs. I wouldn't like the nerfs if I was in a hardcore guild that raids 10 or more hours a week.
A robotic auto-defense post from Neth, bummer.

Defend it all you like, dumbing this game down is ruining it. WoW had the vast majority of its players at the end of TBC when the game was OH SO HARD. These casual players you cater to aren't going to stick around when the vets who log on every day stop doing so.

The feel of community keeps this game intact and you guys are focusing on everything but. LFR, LFD and the absurd ease with which the game is played are the cancer that is killing this game. You will never accept this so the game will continue to decline.
Thing is they never asked the guilds if they wanted the nerf. Their data only says who is stuck, but that doesn't mean they want nerfs. Things like this just cause people to quit the game in disgust.
Actually, subs were highest when you were all complaining about WOTLK and it's LOLEASYMODE.

Turn the buff off if you don't want it. I honestly could not care less, I cleared normal on my hunter before the 5% buff and that was good enough for me.
A robotic auto-defense post from Neth, bummer.

Defend it all you like, dumbing this game down is ruining it. This game had the vast majority of its players at the end of TBC when the game was OH SO HARD. These casual players you cater to aren't going to stick around when the vets who log on every day stop doing so.

The feel of community keeps this game intact and you guys are focusing on everything but. LFR, LFD and the absurd ease with which the game is played, are the cancer that is killing this game. You will never accept this so the game will continue to decline.




So you say, and how is that a robotic response? If you're saying that because you don't like the response then it's not fair. I really doubt LFR nad LFD is killing the game. YOu seem to be using that for your crusade.
The feel of community keeps this game intact and you guys are focusing on everything but. LFR, LFD and absurd ease with which the game is played, are the cancer that is killing this game. You will never accept this so the game will continue to decline.


Except Wrath was when they had the most active subscribers.

Also You say this game is easy but I don't see you killing heroic madness/spine on a weekly basis nor do I see you with a heroic ragnaros kill.
If you'll read the exact same post, it was not so-effective in normal.


This is besides the point, we KNEW the buff was going to increase, the only thing in question was when, which seems like the end of each month until it reaches 30%, judging by ICC.


Yeah, 5% would only help people just shy of doing it.
Chances are, those stuck on normal are having sudden failures of drastic natures, not getting stuck by enrage timers or not quite soaking split damage as well.

10% is probably going to have a similar effect, more heroic progression than normal, but there will be some normal.
02/22/2012 10:22 AMPosted by Aeluron
So you say, and how is that a robotic response? If you're saying that because you don't like the response then it's not fair. I really doubt LFR nad LFD is killing the game. YOu seem to be using that for your crusade.


It's robotic because she merely repeated what has been said before, going so far as to link a previous post. Nothing organic about it.

I have no 'crusade,' I have an opinion that I share with many others. I'm here, on forums I pay to use, in part, to state that opinion.
02/22/2012 10:08 AMPosted by Feandel
The rest really don't have the skills to perform beyond normal modes


This is a gross generalization. The problem for most players with raiding is not their skill level. Anybody can watch videos and learn where to stand and what to do when, it's not rocket science. Monkey see, monkey do. Nothing to do with skill. Which is actually why I agree with you about not needing nerfs.

The problem for the majority of the community when it comes to raids is the organizational aspect of it. Most people won't even let you come to normal mode even with an LFR achievement and a decent ilvl. They want you to outgear the instance and have a full achieve before you can get in, creating a catch-22 that's just about impossible to get out of without belonging to a guild that raids on a regular basis, and getting into one of them is pretty hard on most servers as they're always full and require you to "apply" as if it were some kind of employment position.

So it isn't that players are too "bad" to do raids, it's that most players don't get into the instance to be able to learn and don't belong to guilds that are willing to tolerate a few wipes in the process.

Yes, I know that's why we have LFR, but LFR was way too easy and should have been tuned closer to normal mode, or should have been normal mode. If people can't take it and wipe in LFR, tough, they don't have to use it.
If turning off the buff makes no difference other than the "difficulty" then the ability to turn it OFF means nothing.

Do you get more tier tokens for defeating it at the original difficulty level? No.
Do you get a chance at extra loot? No.
Do you get more VP? No.
Do you get better drops? No.
Do the items that DO drop get better tailored to your group? Nope.
Do you get bragging rights? No. No achievement, no proof, nothing. So no you don't.

You have the "option" to make things harder on yourself. But for no reason. So there you go. The argument that you can "turn it off" is like saying that just because you can stick the key in the ignition and drive your car away, pushing it around is still a perfectly valid option.
3 months of DS down, 9 to go.

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