banning recount from wow part 2

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i just wanted to post my thoughts on this topic since the old thread was maxed out. I dont think recount should be banned so much as it should be massively overhauled.

when i am in raids on my healer or dps my FPS takes a beating depending on the fight we are attempting. As a person with an older pc and not enough money to buy a new one, it gets very frustrating when i know i have the experience and gear to be "topping charts" but i am limited in my output because of my pc.

a person with an older pc or slower internet has just as much right to enjoy wow and the content in it like a person with a $3-4k pc does. DPS DOES NOT= SKILL. you can be the most talented player on your server with some of the highest quality gear there is and still have your performance suffer from lag spikes, slow internet, over worked pc etc, and when people look at the meters you are automatically judged as a bad player.

There are many many factors that affect a person's DPS in dungeons and raids, Recount does not take these things into consideration and neither does a large portion of the player base. So in my opinion and personal experience, Recount has started more problems and misjudgments than i have seen it solve.

What do you players think about recount?
Recount isn't getting banned.
I sympathize. It sucks to be limited by your computer. But consider: if you're limited by your computer, what's the most obvious solution? Get a better one, correct?

Same with DPS. If a raid is being inhibited by someone with bad DPS (whether they don't know how to play, are undergeared, have bad computers, or are subject to random DPS-hindering acts of god), the DPS is replaced. Recount makes this process easier so that the raid can continue with a higher chance of success.

As for people thinking you're bad for pulling bad DPS... well, yeah. That happens. Recount didn't invent the act of calling people bad. On the same token, people with great DPS can still be bad. If they stand in fire and die horribly, the five seconds they were pulling 40k for don't matter very much. They'll likely be removed, as well.

Chillax. Recount isn't going anywhere.
I like recount. When raiding, if your pushing against an enrage, or the boss has a soft enrage it helps you know who is and isn't carrying their weight. That way your raid grp can figure out who needs to research their class and what not. There is a warlock in my raid group who used to do low dps, everyone noticed he did low dps so he asked another lock in the guild for tips. Now he does fine dps. If not for recount he may not have know he had a problem and still been holding us back.

edit:also there have been times that I left my ogr hearth cloak on, or let my poisons expire and only noticed because I saw my damage on recount was abnormally low. Those are also times I'm thankful for it.
Recount doesn't kick people, people kick people.

If you got rid of recount, you would still be kicked. People would find other reasons to kick you. If you stay in fire too long, they'll kick you. If you start going low on mana, they'll kick you.

If you are being kicked while doing good DPS, then it is their fault.

If you are being kicked for doing below acceptable DPS, then I'm sorry, but you should not be in the group. We should not have to ban an addon because you are unable to DPS properly due to your PC/Internet.
If you really think it takes 3-4k computer to play WoW at a high level you are sadly mistaken. It is actually rather patheic for players who use computer issues and lag as an excuse on a regular basis. WoW runs on almost ancient computers at this point. My 6 year old laptop can handle 25man raiding on basically a wireless connection.

Recount matters because if the boss doesn't die you need to figure out why they didn't die and fix that. If it is a healing issue or a dps issue the meters will show that. If people are dying you can figure out why they are dying and fix that. Recount is a valuable tool if used properly.

If you are slowing down a progression run people deserve to be called out. It is really that simple. I'm not talking normal modes and LFR/LFD because those are pretty faceroll with all honesty. The best players in WoW can do both high dps and fill all the requirements of a fight. If you can't do both you just aren't good and just need to admit that.
Yeah, I hate when my e-peen takes a beating too. ❤
04/15/2012 08:18 AMPosted by Bridenbrad
a person with an older pc or slower internet has just as much right to enjoy wow and the content in it like a person with a $3-4k pc does


My computer is a cheap piece of rubbish that is 5 years old. I can run 25 man raids with 30fps minimum with Skype/vent and various other programs all active at once. I have no idea what kind of antiquated pcs some people are running if they can't even run with decent FPS on 5 /10 mans.

Many people don't understand that simply defragmenting your hard drive can help in many cases. /shrug. Or turning the graphic quality down in game.

04/15/2012 08:18 AMPosted by Bridenbrad
DPS DOES NOT= SKILL. you can be the most talented player on your server with some of the highest quality gear there is and still have your performance suffer from lag spikes, slow internet, over worked pc etc, and when people look at the meters you are automatically judged as a bad player.


Ah but for a DPS role, it is part of the measure of skill. If you do terrible dps there is room for improvement. If you can't be bothered to improve then you are terrible. People will not want to take someone doing 10k dps into normal DS let alone heroic DS regardless of personal circumstances because you will hold your team back.

DPS is what makes or breaks boss kills because if tanks are doing their jobs and healers are doing theirs. A dps not pulling their weight and coasting along with the excuse of 'my computer sucks' will end up with the boss hitting enrage.

And yes enrage timers are needed or you will see 2 tanks 20 healers and 3 dps teams to allow for maximum survivablity. Would take ages to down the boss but without enrage timers dps classes and specs would be utterly worthless.
Recount has far more uses than just a damage meter.

Just because you think DPS isn't important, when it is, doesn't mean the most informative addon in this game is bad.
this isnt a new-gen mmo, these failure addons and "philosophies" are here to stay. wait til the next best thing, by the next best game company.
My old HP notebook (3 year old machine) would hit about 3-4 fps on Atramedes because of all the special effects. So, yes, a computer system can affect your ability to raid well. I chose to hold off on raiding until I got a better computer.

If recount is used in the right way, it can be an effective tool for a player trying to improve their dps rotation, healing or tanking. I don't think it should be banned from the game. Even if it was, players would find other excuses for removing someone from a raid.
The post has nothing to do with recount so I'm very confused...
Recount does its job, if your computer can't handle recount get rid of it. Smart players know recount is not always representative of importance to raid / group. This is a very poorly thought out argument against an addon.
if anything, damage (and other) meters should be made part of the base client.
Recount is a useful tool for raiding and I doubt it's going anywhere. Used correctly, it's a way to gauge your performance and look for areas of improvement. What makes add-on's like recount bad are people who use them to ridicule or lord their superiority over others.

Raiders need add-on's like Recount to see why they are hitting that enrage timer, or who isn't interrupting a certain spell, or who isn't cleansing a debuff. If people could use it as the informative, practical tool it is then it would be much better off.

Also, if you're looking at DPS and not damage you're doin' it wrong.
All I'm reading from this is something along these lines:
"I am the/a weak link in this party/raid.

This may be because I am unwilling to take steps to improve my performance, like research my class and spec, practice with a dummy or with a party willing to give me a hand, look up fights and strategies, seek out advice, gem, enchant, or reforge my gear properly and do not seek out resources to help me with these things.

Those above reasons I will justify by this being a game, my having a life, and general disinterest in paying attention to a social game where you play in groups with other people.

But they may also be due to reasons beyond my control, as much as I hate it: My computer has some trouble handling some fights or my internet provider likes to choke my bandwidth and they have a monopoly in my area.

Whatever the reasons, addons that allow players to read the combat parses in game allow them to determine that I am not performing up to par. Because it allows them to determine I am the weakest link and possibly the cause of the group being unable to complete an encounter and therefore might cause me to be removed from groups it needs to be removed from the game."
i just wanted to post my thoughts on this topic since the old thread was maxed out. I dont think recount should be banned so much as it should be massively overhauled.

when i am in raids on my healer or dps my FPS takes a beating depending on the fight we are attempting. As a person with an older pc and not enough money to buy a new one, it gets very frustrating when i know i have the experience and gear to be "topping charts" but i am limited in my output because of my pc.

a person with an older pc or slower internet has just as much right to enjoy wow and the content in it like a person with a $3-4k pc does. DPS DOES NOT= SKILL. you can be the most talented player on your server with some of the highest quality gear there is and still have your performance suffer from lag spikes, slow internet, over worked pc etc, and when people look at the meters you are automatically judged as a bad player.

There are many many factors that affect a person's DPS in dungeons and raids, Recount does not take these things into consideration and neither does a large portion of the player base. So in my opinion and personal experience, Recount has started more problems and misjudgments than i have seen it solve.

What do you players think about recount?


Not trying to be rude, but your gear definitely isn't "Top the Charts" level.
Everyone should be accountable for his/her performance. If there are underlying reasons why you are under performing let the group know so they can decide whether they want to carry you or not.
for the love of god, why bring this topic back up?.... secondly, if recount lags your computer on certain fights, turn it off for those fights. I have to turn recount off for 25 man ultrax and madness or i get something around 3 fps.
04/15/2012 08:18 AMPosted by Bridenbrad
it gets very frustrating when i know i have the experience and gear to be "topping charts" but i am limited in my output because of my pc.


Most of your gear is tank stuff, you have no strength gems, you're missing gems and enchants, you're missing two professions, you're even missing all three prime glyphs.

It's not recount's fault you're going to have terrible DPS.

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