The next Warchief (spoilers)

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Ya, I'm making one of those threads.

Anyway, we know Garrosh's days on the throne are numbered. There's going to be a rebellion within Orgrimmar and an Alliance raid that will depose and probably kill him.

Welcome back Thrall. See post on Page three for the quote. Granted, it's still conjecture, but highly likely conjecture
04/26/2012 06:49 AMPosted by Aurriastraza
Varok Saurfang, much as people would like him, just can't fit the bill. He has too much emotional baggage to adequately lead.So, pick a candidate and discuss merits.


I disagree, that emotional baggage comes mostly from the death of his son, wich, in a warrior's society is something that can actually happens to anyone, is tragic, of course, but not as tragic as it is to us. Lots of kings, generals and warchiefs from history loss relatives and took it like a man.

Thrall, as mentioned, as a bone to pick concerning Cairne. He also had his own reservations. Plus, a lot of players want Thrall back.


Not sure about this one, at least on this forums the vast majority doesnt want him back. On the other hand, Thrall is probably who is going to take over the mantle.

04/26/2012 06:49 AMPosted by Aurriastraza
Gallywix.... probably doesn't care.


He is the new guy, even if he cared about he doesn's stand a chance.

04/26/2012 06:49 AMPosted by Aurriastraza
Garrosh killed Cairne. Baine will almost certainly be involved with the Garrosh raid, and is a good contender for Warchief himself.


Didn't do nothing yet to deserve the Horde's respect besides being the son of Cairne.

04/26/2012 06:49 AMPosted by Aurriastraza
Sylvanas is the #1 warmongerer. Let's face it, she wants war with the Alliance as bad as Garrosh does. Difference being, she's actually doing a lot of stuff about it. Course, not a lot of people would support her, if she did make a move, Theron included.


No way. Too much oposition against her.

04/26/2012 06:49 AMPosted by Aurriastraza
Vol'jin swore he'd kill Garrosh. Only thing stopping him is a promise to Thrall, who himself is pretty ticked at Garrosh, as seen in 4.2. He's also the oldest Horde leader on the list, as far as membership, after Thrall


THIS IS THE GUY. Well respected warrior, good strategist, cares for his people, have guts. Just not an orc, but still, the very best option. Also, i think most people love him, and trolls deserve some love after all this years of troll genocide in game.
Baine has done a lot, actually. He retook Thunderbluff without the assistance of Garrosh or most of the Horde (although with a bit of neutral and Alliance aid). He also saved Garrosh's life, in a short story

As for Varok, I still disagree. If you read The Shattering, it's made pretty clear that Varok is burnded too much by the loss of his son. He's willing to stay in Northrend afterall, not because he must stay, but because he wants to stay. He had the option to go back, and probably would've, had his son lived. A lot of kings and generals may steel from the losses they've had, like Varian has, but Varok hasn't. The one thing keeping him stable was taken from him
04/26/2012 07:21 AMPosted by Aurriastraza
Baine has done a lot, actually. He retook Thunderbluff without the assistance of Garrosh or most of the Horde (although with a bit of neutral and Alliance aid). He also saved Garrosh's life, in a short story


You may be right, but still isnt enough compared with Vol'jin for example. Is a hero mostly for the taurens. I could be wrong, just my thoughts.

04/26/2012 07:21 AMPosted by Aurriastraza
As for Varok, I still disagree. If you read The Shattering, it's made pretty clear that Varok is burnded too much by the loss of his son. He's willing to stay in Northrend afterall, not because he must stay, but because he wants to stay. He had the option to go back, and probably would've, had his son lived. A lot of kings and generals may steel from the losses they've had, like Varian has, but Varok hasn't. The one thing keeping him stable was taken from him


Very good point here. But i tend to think the mighty Saurfang could and should overcome his pain to lead his people to a brighter future. Pretty much like Tirion did: after being isolated for years on that hut in EPL he raises to lead the argent crusade. I enjoyed that alot, could be done to Saurfang too.

Also, you didnt say who are your candidate, i will like to know.
Any choice but Thrall is wishful thinking.....but for the sake of the thread.

Varok Saurfang- SHOULD have been the choice from the beginning. I give two craps about his age, he was the right choice period. ESPECIALLY considering Thrall said from the get go he was coming back.

Yes he lost his son, but if Thrall would have asked, Varok would have manned up. He's like Ned Stark without the blatant stupidity

Baine- Baine isn't fit to be in charge of a pie-eating contest, much less the entire Horde.

Gallywix Not gonna happen.

Theron Who? Seriously though,he's got enough on his plate dealing with the BE's issues right now, and has no support from anywhere else in the Horde

Sylvanas- Not trusted at all. We's probably see serveral factions pull out of the Horde is she were made Warchief

Vol'jin To use a Sopranos reference, Vol'jin is a lot more Silvio Dante than Tony Soprano. I just don't see him comfortable being the #1 guy.
Well, someone clearly has a bit of a biased opinion =P

My choice? Personally, I'd love to see Varok leading the Horde, or Cairne, neither of which will likely happen... for some obvious reasons on the latter. Given the candidates, I think Vol'jin is most capable
My best bet if we take out Thrall (since that is no fun to include him) would either be Vol'jin or Baine.

Vol'jin may be seen as too cunning for his own good. He also has a bad case of "Focus on the big picture and not petty squabbles" these people usually die sadly of this dangerous ailment or amount to very little over all. Though race exceptions become greatness from it, it usually involves going neutral.

Baine is too young and new to be Warchief.The Horde are in an interesting position right now. With Cata focused on only 2 orcs it made it seem only Garrosh or Thrall could lead the Horde in MoP. It'll be weird to have some random Orc all of a sudden reach for warchief. That is why It'll most likely be Thrall since according to him only Orcs can be warchief.
04/26/2012 07:58 AMPosted by Aurriastraza
Well, someone clearly has a bit of a biased opinion =P


You mean this?

Varok Saurfang- SHOULD have been the choice from the beginning. I give two craps about his age, he was the right choice period. ESPECIALLY considering Thrall said from the get go he was coming back.

Yes he lost his son, but if Thrall would have asked, Varok would have manned up. He's like Ned Stark without the blatant stupidity


Maybe biased opinion, but he is right all the way.
Lots of kings, generals and warchiefs from history loss relatives and took it like a man.


There's no such thing as taking the death of your child like a man. Some maybe emotionally distant about it, others push on through because of the obligations to their people. But none that truly care just shrug it off.

Thrall did not choose Cairne or Vol'jin because he believed that an orc would be accepted as the Warchief more than any other race. He did not choose Eitrigg or Saurfang for their age. He wanted to choose a brave heroic young orc and a war hero who is known and loved by the Horde. It is said in the story that Dranosh Saurfang was the perfect one for the job, but unfortunately, he's dead.
Probably is, if you take away Saurfang and Garrosh, there aren't any other orc leaders who stand out, beside Thrall
nazgrel
04/26/2012 06:49 AMPosted by Aurriastraza
Theron seems to be pretty pro-orc nowadays, considering Sylvanas bullies him. Probably a Thrall advocate


Theron is too worried about his own people to give a hoot about the horde as a whole. He doesn't even want the power he has let alone an empirical standing.
04/26/2012 10:11 AMPosted by Aurriastraza
Probably is, if you take away Saurfang and Garrosh, there aren't any other orc leaders who stand out, beside Thrall


What about Zaela? She was basically central to the rebellion in the Dragonmaw Clan that allowed them to throw off rule by fel orcs. That being the case she is already experienced in the kind of fighting that would be needed to oust Garrosh.

I know that probably won't happen but I'm tired of Thrall. Varok and Eitrigg are old and really they should retire (do orcs retire?). So far we have Dranosh and Garrosh as new, young orc blood and they both get corrupted and killed. Lets get a new generation, this time without the "oops I'm evil now".
Baine- Baine isn't fit to be in charge of a pie-eating contest, much less the entire Horde.


Is Vol'jin really much better than this? His best friend, who had been obviously stewing with ideas of rebellion for some time (see the short story) seized control of the Echo Isles and mind controlled a good portion of the Darkspear. It then took Vol'jin several years to actually do anything about it while he got a nice collection of shrunken heads and coconuts from adventurers. Before that he sat pretty idle as Tirasian fleets bombarded said isles when Proudmoore attacked... really, the only notable choice he made right prior to the pre-event in Cata was to join Thrall and not be sacrificed to the Naga.

So he threatened Garrosh? So what? He does nothing about it. It was just an empty threat. And now where is he? practically living in exile with his people in "slums", and he's being harassed by the same Naga that killed his father and decimated his tribe.

Things Vol'jin has done:

Taken back the Echo Isles from his former best friend, which, arguably, he should have never lost. And despite being a powerful Shadow Hunter, he still needed a loa's direct intervention to get it back.

Killed Zar'jira many years after the events of Warcraft III. Only got his revenge because she went after him... so it was still reactionary on his part.

Threatened Garrosh... which really was not a wise choice as it probably ostracized his people more than anything.

Took on the Zandalari and won and rallied the Alliance and Horde to oppose them. I can yield that this was pretty bad-ss, but by the time he started taking an active role in this, most of Stranglethorn was overwhelmed and his people/Horde allies/Alliance allies either poisoned, dead, or zombified. I'd say the Ghostlands situation, but I don't know it that well. All we know is that the Halduron had to call on backup from the Quel'dorei.
Problem with Zaela is she's new. Even newer than Baine, who at least has been around (since WC3 I believe. If not, WoW for sure).
04/26/2012 11:47 AMPosted by Aurriastraza
Problem with Zaela is she's new. Even newer than Baine, who at least has been around (since WC3 I believe. If not, WoW for sure).
He showed up in the Frozen Throne.
04/26/2012 10:11 AMPosted by Aurriastraza
Probably is, if you take away Saurfang and Garrosh, there aren't any other orc leaders who stand out, beside Thrall


nazgrel

or even rexxar, but rexxar wouldn't like that responsibility one bit
Taken back the Echo Isles from his former best friend, which, arguably, he should have never lost. And despite being a powerful Shadow Hunter, he still needed a loa's direct intervention to get it back.

This isn't a note on Vol'jin's incompetence or lack of power, it's a testament to how powerful Zalazane really is.

We're talking about a Witch Doctor who banished all of the Primal Loa from the Isles (The Animal ones) and locked them in the Emerald Dream, and they needed a Loa who was powerful enough to bully other Loa around (Think of Malorne in power, compared to the rest of the Ancients) to pull the original Darkspear Druids into the Dream. They couldn't even be released until Zalazane was defeated.

Killed Zar'jira many years after the events of Warcraft III. Only got his revenge because she went after him... so it was still reactionary on his part.

Zar'jira really didn't make her presence known anywhere. If she had, I know the Darkspear would have hunted her down.

04/26/2012 11:46 AMPosted by Aurius
Threatened Garrosh... which really was not a wise choice as it probably ostracized his people more than anything.

Cairne did the same thing, and people love and miss him.

Took on the Zandalari and won and rallied the Alliance and Horde to oppose them. I can yield that this was pretty bad-ss, but by the time he started taking an active role in this, most of Stranglethorn was overwhelmed and his people/Horde allies/Alliance allies either poisoned, dead, or zombified. I'd say the Ghostlands situation, but I don't know it that well. All we know is that the Halduron had to call on backup from the Quel'dorei.

The meeting of Zuldazar didn't happen until 4.2 Any events before 4.2 were likely unknown to him.

After which, well, we took care of everything that happened in Stranglethorn.

Now remember, before Wrath, Blizzard hasn't really been good for getting our leaders out in the World. Hell, Thrall sat on his !@# for everything except when he went to Nagrand. Vol'jin indirectly did things through questlines before Cata.

He had sent Rokhan on a 'secret mission' which we still don't know about, having recently seen him in Northrend.

He had a Troll dispatched to Arathi to secure Trol'kalar.

He had Trolls in Stranglethorn actively sending people to fight the Skullsplitter and Bloodscalp.

if you were Revered with the Zandalar Tribe, and spoke to one of them, they would say, "I knew someone like you once... His name was Vol'jin... Spirits bless you, friend." I'm paraphrasing, but even the Zandalari knew how strong he could be.
04/26/2012 12:14 PMPosted by Dragonheals
Probably is, if you take away Saurfang and Garrosh, there aren't any other orc leaders who stand out, beside Thrall


nazgrel

or even rexxar, but rexxar wouldn't like that responsibility one bit


Rexxar is hardly an orc leader. He might be well known and liked, but he hates living among his own kind. At this rate, he's more of a glorified hunter (much like how Thrall is a glorified shammy, sadly)

And I did forget about Nazgrel. He would be a good candidate, if Outland were ever updated.
Vol'jin

Out of everyone in all of Cata, he seemed to keep his head straight the most.

And if he doesn't work?

Basic campfire for Warchief!

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