High elf as an Alliance race.

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I don't think population is a limiting factor.

Death knights. Not to many of them were made, they were able to break free of Arthas' control, but still have to deal with the things that come along with being a death knight. There are more forsaken than death knights because death knights were supposed to be his commanders. No more death knights are being made, as the Lich King is dealt with, but people can still play them (and even newer races can be a death knight if it fits lore well). Not sure if people are looking for a cure to their condition, it's likely someone is.

Gnomes. 80% were killed and many others were irradiated, but I think the gnomes can "cure" irradiation (like you see in the gnome starting zone).

Magni was turned to diamond but he's probably going to be fixed/"cured".

Darkspear trolls. There wasn't to many of them to begin with, they were the smallest tribe that split from the Gurubashi Empire but fled their home of STV and moved to Echo Isles, but were almost wiped out by a naga, murlocs, and humans.

Draenei. A near immortal race that were originally a small portion of survivors from Argus and were chased by the Burning Legion all over before getting to Draenor. Many of them were again killed by the orcs, Kael'thas' blood elves, and other things, before finding another home on Azuremyst Isles.

Worgen. Many Gilneans were killed by other worgen, undead/the Horde, and etc. Not all worgen were able to get some of their human side back. Worgen were only a small portion of surviving Gilneans, other surviving Gilneans are still human. Worgen are probably limited, there probably won't be any new ones, at least in any big numbers, any time soon. Not sure if the worgen curse passes to their children or not. I think people are looking for a cure to their curse.

Forsaken. They were looking to be close to all being killed till Sylvanas got Valkyr to raise more, they can't reproduce, but not even Garrosh really liked seeing people being raised. Not sure if people are looking for a cure to undeath, but it's likely someone is.

Goblins, (the playable ones). They're a small portion of surviving ones from their original home of Kezan, they're the cartel under Gallywix, that were almost all killed. Other goblins aren't really allied with anyone and won't be joining any faction, more profit not to.

Tauren. They were the group of nomads almost killed off by the centaur, but now live in TB.

Pandaren. They were a small portion pandaren originally from Pandaria but went to live on a turtle that isn't going to grow any bigger. The playable pandaren are an even smaller group, way smaller, of pandaren on the turtle that decide to join a faction. And half of that join the Horde/Alliance (half of the small portion of a small portion join the Horde or Alliance). And not many more will be joining the Horde/Alliance, Pandaria pandaren won't want to and Wandering Isle Pandaren said they didn't want to and you'd need to find the turtle again and transport them somehow.

Basically, there are limits on other races, some people are looking for cures, and many have (had or are supposed to) small populations but lived through it and are strong now.

My 2 cents.
The population hangup doesn't address language, appearance, architecture, or how bloody boring they are.
09/19/2012 01:40 PMPosted by Skytotem
The population hangup doesn't address language, appearance, architecture, or how bloody boring they are.


Boring in your opinion. I'd say playing a race that is doomed to die or forced to abandon their principles and pride to survive and return to their, 'Home,' is very interesting. How far do they let their pride and loyalty to the Alliance carry them? To their death? Perhaps to the propagation of a whole new race; Half Elves?

You call the High Elves' story boring, but its not much different than the Horde's at this point. Go with the majority or die. I suppose if you find the option that goes with moral superiority boring, then yeah, you would find them boring, but that's you.
I don't think population is a limiting factor.

Basically, there are limits on other races, some people are looking for cures, and many have (had or are supposed to) small populations but lived through it and are strong now.

My 2 cents.


Beautiful summary. I didn't think of the dranei like that or the forsaken for that matter. All I know is that people will be expecting new races/classes with their expansions, and someones got to pick that up. The list of other races that could be in wow is very short. Ogres, nagas, high elves, furbolgs, centaurs, murlocs, kobolds, gnolls and demons. Of that list, murlocs, kobolds, and gnolls are probably not advanced enough to be considered playable characters (though gnolls do have nice camps). and The centaurs have even less people than the high elves, along with being butt ugly (though if you could play a dryad that would be interesting). Demons (with the exception of a satyr) usually are not that bright and don't build things. With warlocks controlling them, I doubt they would also be a playable race at the same time. So what are you left with? Naga, (who do apparently maintain some semblance of civilization in their under water palaces), Ogres who make entire villages on their cute little ogre mounds and in caves, and high elves, who have lodges and buildings scattered throughout wow already, even in outland.
09/19/2012 12:04 PMPosted by Korrii

Yes, actually.

http://www.wowpedia.org/Blizzard_lore_posts#High_elf_population


Date: 29 September 2005

Yes, this thing is almost 7 years old. You don't think things could change within that time?


The date doesn't mean anything if Blizzard hasn't said anything to the contrary, and so far, they haven't. Unless Blizzard changes that, it is canon lore that the High elves have too low a population to be a player race. Period.
09/19/2012 02:18 PMPosted by Kynrind
The date doesn't mean anything if Blizzard hasn't said anything to the contrary, and so far, they haven't. Unless Blizzard changes that, it is canon lore that the High elves have too low a population to be a player race. Period.


Didn't we just establish that theirs less Alliance Panda's then High elfs? So if they are a playable race high elfs can be too.

Also like i said in the very beginning of this thread i would be ok with them just having their own faction, beyond the one in Dalaran mind, and have their own little zone in Stormwind.


Date: 29 September 2005

Yes, this thing is almost 7 years old. You don't think things could change within that time?


The date doesn't mean anything if Blizzard hasn't said anything to the contrary, and so far, they haven't. Unless Blizzard changes that, it is canon lore that the High elves have too low a population to be a player race. Period.


Unfortunately there is no "period" now. Anything happening in the game now is beyond the old lore. Now wow is happening in the present, so to speak. They no longer have to follow any script or maintain anything that is "cannon", as the game is developing as we speak.

And I would say the date matters a lot. Do you think that 7 years ago anyone would have dreamed that you could play a panda? I don't think so. Again, even you admit that "so far" they haven't, but you cannot say for certain that they never will.

Again, they never took on the scenarios we proposed in this thread. Did anyone remark on the possibility of finding an alternative to fel magic? This thread is not about proving lore anyway, it is a proposal for something new. Why are people so quick to just shut it down with OLD information.
09/19/2012 02:27 PMPosted by Korrii
And I would say the date matters a lot. Do you think that 7 years ago anyone would have dreamed that you could play a panda? I don't think so. Again, even you admit that "so far" they haven't, but you cannot say for certain that they never will.

They could also make Leprechauns canon again.

That's not a point in your favour.
09/19/2012 03:25 PMPosted by Kellick
And I would say the date matters a lot. Do you think that 7 years ago anyone would have dreamed that you could play a panda? I don't think so. Again, even you admit that "so far" they haven't, but you cannot say for certain that they never will.

They could also make Leprechauns canon again.

That's not a point in your favour.


Wow, you arent respectful at all are you? When someone challenges your views you should reevaluate them instead of lashing out.

Leprechauns? More like trolls... oh wait.
Have to agree there. Blizzard says they'll never do something, and then they turn around a do it if it will garner them enough support.

People said Worgen would never happen. But they did.
09/19/2012 02:18 PMPosted by Kynrind
The date doesn't mean anything if Blizzard hasn't said anything to the contrary, and so far, they haven't. Unless Blizzard changes that, it is canon lore that the High elves have too low a population to be a player race. Period.


Well, we get into Wrath and High Elves look like they have enough to have their own full blown faction that's equivalent to the Blood Elves in Dalaran. Plus they've still played a part in certain areas of the Blood Elf story.

So there's that to munch on.
09/19/2012 03:44 PMPosted by Talendras
So there's that to munch on.


inb4 they go neutral.
09/19/2012 03:47 PMPosted by Mordstreich
inb4 they go neutral.


Or they just get absorbed into Blood Elves.

Not like the High Elves have been that much useful to the Alliance as of late anyways.
Wow, you arent respectful at all are you? When someone challenges your views you should reevaluate them instead of lashing out.

Leprechauns? More like trolls... oh wait.

You're argument was that it could be retconned.

The existence of any High Elves could also be retconned.

That anything and everything could be retconned is not a point for or against anything.

That something would require a retcon, is.

It's not a question of not being respectful, it's just that your position rests entirely on the hypothetical possibility that Blizzard goes against previously established canon, and attacking people who point it out.
Wow, you arent respectful at all are you? When someone challenges your views you should reevaluate them instead of lashing out.

Leprechauns? More like trolls... oh wait.

You're argument was that it could be retconned.

The existence of any High Elves could also be retconned.

That anything and everything could be retconned is not a point for or against anything.

That something would require a retcon, is.

It's not a question of not being respectful, it's just that your position rests entirely on the hypothetical possibility that Blizzard goes against previously established canon, and attacking people who point it out.


Attacking people? When have I done anything but disagree with the fact that everything is set into stone. Other people have posted plenty of examples of blizzard changing it's mind on subjects/races.

The point of this thread is to suggest an idea. This idea could be implemented and it could not. However, some people feel the need to keep repeating that "lore" does not allow any change; this in itself is an extreme untruth. In my limited knowledge I can name a few more example of changes.

For example, the Light was once thought of as a deity, but now is thought of as sort of a universal force of good without sentience.

If that's not a big difference, I don't know what is. Pointing out that it CAN be possible is not the same thing as attacking anyone. And yes it does lend credence to the argument, as it is enabling a discussion to continue without someone shutting down the option outright.

For your reading pleasure here is a link to several "retcons" that have happened both in game and in novels.

http://www.wowwiki.com/Retcon_speculation

I very much like the fact that now anything can happen. I'm looking forward to the new story lines /novels. If you want to remain stuck in the past thats fine, but don't get upset when other people want to move on and find more interesting things to look at.
09/19/2012 04:13 PMPosted by Korrii
. I'm looking forward to the new story lines /novels. If you want to remain stuck in the past thats fine, but don't get upset when other people want to move on and find more interesting things to look at.


This is passive aggressive, arrogant and not constructive. This is probably the type of thing people have in mind when they say 'attacking'. Since telling them they're stuck in the past is hardly polite.
09/19/2012 04:16 PMPosted by Skytotem
. I'm looking forward to the new story lines /novels. If you want to remain stuck in the past thats fine, but don't get upset when other people want to move on and find more interesting things to look at.


This is passive aggressive, arrogant and not constructive. This is probably the type of thing people have in mind when they say 'attacking'. Since telling them they're stuck in the past is hardly polite.


Nor is coming up and saying, "The idea is terrible, stop bringing it up."
Boring in your opinion. I'd say playing a race that is doomed to die or forced to abandon their principles and pride to survive and return to their, 'Home,' is very interesting. How far do they let their pride and loyalty to the Alliance carry them? To their death? Perhaps to the propagation of a whole new race; Half Elves?

You call the High Elves' story boring, but its not much different than the Horde's at this point. Go with the majority or die. I suppose if you find the option that goes with moral superiority boring, then yeah, you would find them boring, but that's you.


It's boring because it's not even unique to them. That's half the Blood Elf storyline, only they already got over it.

And what happens if the High Elves get past their little hangup there? They go back to being boring typical fantasy elves.

Physically identical to blood elves, speaking the same language, architecture etc...

Most people (i'll admit, not all) want them out of some bizarre sense of nostalgia and because they're reminiscient of WC2/3 not because they're actually 'interesting'.
09/19/2012 04:20 PMPosted by Skytotem
It's boring because it's not even unique to them. That's half the Blood Elf storyline, only they already got over it.


The thing is, its the -other- half of the story. The untold half.

09/19/2012 04:20 PMPosted by Skytotem
And what happens if the High Elves get past their little hangup there? They go back to being boring typical fantasy elves.


Uhm... how do they get over it? Do the Naaru wave a wand and magically make enough High Elves to make them equal to Blood Elves or something? This isn't a matter of repopulating; the High Elves simply cannot do that. They're doomed unless they become Blood Elves, and they already made their decision not to. Right now, there is a story to be told of a dying breed, and it can go out in a blaze of glory, or with a whimper. Personally, I find the, 'Blaze of Glory,' storyline to be more interesting than the other.

If anything, their last stand as the High Elves might indeed birth a new race with a new kingdom; Half-Elves. Their sacrifice might be the start of something greater. The tenets and culture they form for themselves in the twilight of their existence as a race could be adopted for a new one, born of their fall. I don't know about you, but its not often we see new races, 'Born,' into the storyline. Arguably the Forsaken and the Worgen, but look how popular they are by the players, and how much of an impact they have in the world around them.

09/19/2012 04:20 PMPosted by Skytotem
Physically identical to blood elves, speaking the same language, architecture etc...


Unless they come up with their own dialect, and adapt new Architecture similar to Dalaran's, which already seems like a mix of human and elven architecture.

Most people (i'll admit, not all) want them out of some bizarre sense of nostalgia and because they're reminiscient of WC2/3 not because they're actually 'interesting'.


Nothing wrong with an iconic race for a faction. Imagine if the Horde had -no- Trolls. How many Horde players would want Trolls?

The High Elves have an intensely interesting story because its the untold half of the story of the Blood Elves. Both sides form the whole story that belongs to the denizens of Quel'thalas. We've seen and experienced the story of those who fell from grace to survive. I see no reason why we can't do the same for those who chose to die for their beliefs and loyalty, and will ultimately fall for it.

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