How exactly do the charms work?

Dungeons, Raids and Scenarios
I know that provided you have one they give you an extra chance at class appropriate loot off the boss.

I have a few questions regarding this.

1. Is this only for World bosses and LFR .... or does this extend to normal/heroic guild raids as well? I ask this because some guilds gear tanks/healers first because those are the core of a raid team. I was under the impression it was the former, but again not sure. Would appreciate some clarification here.

2. In regards to Sha of Anger, how does it work with the Heavenly Onyx mount? is that randomly assigned? or what goes on there ?
It can be used on any raid boss. What it basically does is give you another roll at loot (you can also get money, flasks, etc). Its not a guarenteed epic item when you use it (just a small chance).

This applies to ANYTHING on the loot table that you are eligible for (for your current spec when you killed the boss).
10/04/2012 06:30 AMPosted by Wyvernmaster
It can be used on any raid boss
Including world bosses. Not sure how it interacts with the mounts off world bosses. If they are full raid rolls it probably wouldn't work since the loot of the world bosses tend to be either you get an item or you don't and doesn't involve rolling, but I haven't seen any evidence to confirm/deny charms on world bosses.
Any raid boss. You get a roll show up and options to roll or cancel. Rolling uses a elder charm. Cancel does not.
But since normal mode and heroic raids are usually ML'd how does it effect them. I understand you said all raid bosses, but does that mean people are eligible loot that the ML doesn't necessarily see? or is ML pretty much gone in its entirity?
10/04/2012 04:05 PMPosted by Bedelia
but does that mean people are eligible loot that the ML doesn't necessarily see? or is ML pretty much gone in its entirity?


Yes people are eligible for loot that the ML does not see. But ML still works as it allways did.

Think of it this way, you kill the boss, ml gets to hand out the loot that dropped and next to the boss is a questgiver who has a chance to hand out loot if you give them a token. The charm loot has nothing to do with the boss beyond the fact that a boss had to die.
It's a bonus, it's not affected by the loot system.
Guess that isn't bad then if you put it that way. Definitely has a chance to get people geared up quicker, possibly into heroic modes. Especially if they go in their with 10 tokens next week ya know.
10/04/2012 04:34 PMPosted by Bedelia
Guess that isn't bad then if you put it that way. Definitely has a chance to get people geared up quicker, possibly into heroic modes. Especially if they go in their with 10 tokens next week ya know.


9 max next week, but I suspect a lot of people have spent them this week.

I blew a lot of Sha, beause the tier gear will last a month at least
I was just talking best case scenario cause at some point people are going to be sitting on tokens.
Use them on bosses that give the best loot for you.
For example I killed sha this week (world boss) upon dieing, I saw that I got no loot from his loot table. (Though if I had, it wouldn't have changed anything). You then get a roll window that shows up. You can either roll with a coin or pass.

By doing this, so far this week I've received 3 pieces of loot (2 from raids, 1 from sha) as have many others in guild. Since it caps out at 10 coins at any given time. With a maximum of 8 raid bosses ( I really wouldn't waste it on lfr unless your only source of a weapon is from there) You may as well start spending them on bosses which have multi class loot tables. IE tier tokens and accessories. Since those are the items that you'll have to fight for the most.
Here's how they work.

You can get 3 elder charms a week maximum. When you kill a boss it gives you a bonus loot window that asks you to roll. If you choose to roll it eats up an elder coin and gives you another chance at loot from that specific bosses loot table for your current spec.

Most of the time you will only get ~30 gold, but sometimes you will 'luck' out and get another piece of loot. I don't know if it can roll something you already have or how smart it is, but I am fairly certain it does check your specialization before handing you something.

Lastly because you can do Galleon, Sha of Anger and LFR multiple times a week (even though you only get a loot chance once) it will give you the option to use a coin each and every time regardless of whether or not you've killed them once already. Probably not worth it overall, but if you only care about PvP gear you would want to kill Sha of Anger 3 times a week so you could munch up all your coins.

Coins have a maximum of 10 so you should spend them before that.

Basically just save them for the content you can currently clear and for the items a specific bosses loot table that you're looking at. Have bad luck at trinkets on a certain boss? Now you get a second chance every week!
just killed sha for the second time, have 5 elder coins, and no option popped up. Did they nerf this?
Two minor questions.

1. If you swap spec between boss death and charm-use click, does it change which spec you're using the charm as? For example, if I killed Spirit Kings as retribution, then swapped to protection before using charm, would I be eligible for Qiang's shield?

2. I was under the impression that role in Raid Finder mattered, so I've been letting the other tank onetank Spirit Kings and going DPS since I pull big numbers. Would RF ignore my queued role and consider only my spec, preventing me from getting tank gear by doing this? Since role can easily be edited in a normal mode raid, I'm guessing in all modes it only checks your active spec.
Two minor questions.

1. If you swap spec between boss death and charm-use click, does it change which spec you're using the charm as? For example, if I killed Spirit Kings as retribution, then swapped to protection before using charm, would I be eligible for Qiang's shield?

2. I was under the impression that role in Raid Finder mattered, so I've been letting the other tank onetank Spirit Kings and going DPS since I pull big numbers. Would RF ignore my queued role and consider only my spec, preventing me from getting tank gear by doing this? Since role can easily be edited in a normal mode raid, I'm guessing in all modes it only checks your active spec.

I'm not sure about (1), but for (2) I know that Raid Finder checks the spec you are currently running when the boss dies to determine the spec you roll for loot as (for your normal loot chance at least). For example, I queue'd into part 2 HoF as a DPS, but swapped to tank spec for the final boss and received -- off of my Coin, no less -- the plate tank legs. So I can verify that spec, not queued role, influences loot. As for the timing in #1, though, I haven't tested it to be sure.
1. If you swap spec between boss death and charm-use click, does it change which spec you're using the charm as? For example, if I killed Spirit Kings as retribution, then swapped to protection before using charm, would I be eligible for Qiang's shield?

Not sure.

2. I was under the impression that role in Raid Finder mattered, so I've been letting the other tank onetank Spirit Kings and going DPS since I pull big numbers. Would RF ignore my queued role and consider only my spec, preventing me from getting tank gear by doing this? Since role can easily be edited in a normal mode raid, I'm guessing in all modes it only checks your active spec.

LFR loot definitely checks 'Active Spec' at time of boss kill. If you really want tank loot from Spirit Kings you have to stay tanky.
If you switch to prot after the boss dies then your bonus roll will give you prot gear. The trinket and ring I have were both won that way since I have never tanked in LFR.

2. I was under the impression that role in Raid Finder mattered, so I've been letting the other tank onetank Spirit Kings and going DPS since I pull big numbers. Would RF ignore my queued role and consider only my spec, preventing me from getting tank gear by doing this? Since role can easily be edited in a normal mode raid, I'm guessing in all modes it only checks your active spec.


LFR is role at the time of kill, not at time of queue.

So if you queue as a DPS and then go Prot for the entire raid, you will get Prot gear.

(this is how a lot of tanks queue to avoid the long queue times)
Thanks, seems I've been operating under false assumptions for a month now. Thankfully I only recently started working on my offspec, but this cost me a shot at Qiang's shield several times.

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