Huge discrepancy in difficulty (10 vs 25)

Dungeons, Raids and Scenarios
Guilds actually have a higher success rate in 25s than 10s. I can bring in numbers to an argument that don't mean anything too!

Feng the Accursed (25): 626 (67.31%)
Gara'jal the Spiritbinder (25): 580 (62.37%)
Four Kings (25): 511 (54.95%)
Elegon (25): 202 (21.72%)
Will of the Emperor (25): 104 (11.18%)

Feng the Accursed (10): 5209 (62.26%)
Gara'jal the Spiritbinder (10): 3396 (40.59%)
Four Kings (10): 2853 (34.10%)
Elegon (10): 820 (9.80%)
Will of the Emperor (10): 546 (6.53%)


That is based on a percentage of guilds who have killed stone guard which is significantly harder on 25man vs 10man. Hell, blizz doesn't even give the illusion of equal difficulty on that fight by removing 1 of the 4 mechanics people have to worry about in 10man.
Guilds actually have a higher success rate in 25s than 10s. I can bring in numbers to an argument that don't mean anything too!

Feng the Accursed (25): 626 (67.31%)
Gara'jal the Spiritbinder (25): 580 (62.37%)
Four Kings (25): 511 (54.95%)
Elegon (25): 202 (21.72%)
Will of the Emperor (25): 104 (11.18%)

Feng the Accursed (10): 5209 (62.26%)
Gara'jal the Spiritbinder (10): 3396 (40.59%)
Four Kings (10): 2853 (34.10%)
Elegon (10): 820 (9.80%)
Will of the Emperor (10): 546 (6.53%)


That is based on a percentage of guilds who have killed stone guard which is significantly harder on 25man vs 10man. Hell, blizz doesn't even give the illusion of equal difficulty on that fight by removing 1 of the 4 mechanics people have to worry about in 10man.


What is it about the words: first boss, normal mode and easy on both sizes that you people don't understand? Unless of course you think he was actually hard in which case I feel sorry for your raid.
Actually, I think those numbers are based on all guilds in the database with just Stone Guards removed.

You can go to WoWprogress and check them yourself.
Actually, I think those numbers are based on all guilds in the database with just Stone Guards removed.

You can go to WoWprogress and check them yourself.


While I can see that the stoneguard %s are at 99.xxx rather than 100 it seems a little off that 1000 25man guilds have killed stoneguard and that the 1000 guilds are 99.xx% of all 25man guilds versus 5000 25man guilds that kill normal morchok.

The nerf to DS shouldn't matter since, allegedly, its recording the guild whether or not it kills the first boss
As someone said, those numbers are really only based on guilds that have cleared stone guard, not of all guilds. That being said, there are far more 10 man guilds no and days and a lot less 25mans. Several top guilds have reorganized into a single or multiple 10man groups now.
10/08/2012 06:07 AMPosted by Xaar
he comes back with all his faux-elitism that we missed so much!


Wasn't he trying to act like his guild was good back in DS and/or FL, yet his guild couldn't down SK when they raid Tuesday/Wednesday? lol. I just find it funny he used to talk all this crap before, then disappeared.
10/08/2012 11:11 AMPosted by Naumu
he comes back with all his faux-elitism that we missed so much!


Wasn't he trying to act like his guild was good back in DS and/or FL, yet his guild couldn't down SK when they raid Tuesday/Wednesday? lol. I just find it funny he used to talk all this crap before, then disappeared.


What exactly this commentary has to do with the OPs question about 10vs25 is beyond me. Maybe you should take your commentary about a certain poster to another thread.... :p
10s are SOOOOO much easier than 25s. Yet again. No wonder everyone does it nowadays.

After our 25 broke up tonight, we went to see if we could finish the instance in 10's. One shot the last boss without any issues whatsoever, with every single person in the raid talking about how much they screwed up.

I really wish blizzard would get better at this.
You would think that with Blizzard coming out and saying that 10s were easier in Cata that they'd be more careful, but whatever.

They also said there'd be more incentives to raid 25, so I'll reserve judgement.
Man, I am PUMPED to beat this horse again.
10/08/2012 11:11 AMPosted by Naumu
Wasn't he trying to act like his guild was good back in DS and/or FL, yet his guild couldn't down SK when they raid Tuesday/Wednesday? lol. I just find it funny he used to talk all this crap before, then disappeared.


Arent you hilarious, btw, maybe you used your time of research, you would have killed Elegon by now ? But hey.. I guess this is just your alt and your main is on Illidan or something right ?

Back on the topic, with only 8 debuffs now, I thought enrage timers would be a little tighter on 10man to compensate for the lack of difficulty in group movement, but it seems Blizzard still intends on catering to your delusional thinking in 10man mode.

PS : I tried both 25 and then 10man Elegon last night, to see the difference, and because it was getting late.
give it a week or two, if anything is glaring in terms of difficulty between 10 and 25, I assume it will be hotfixed/adjusted. (but who knows)


A lot of the damage from progression/extra gearing is already done by that point.

I just dont see how there always seems to be a gap between the two, and it almost always favors 10 mans. You would think they might lean on the side of 25s for once.
You'll have to excuse Narph. He's used to parsing in the 20-50th percentile range. So while he thinks he's amazing and is part of this awesome 25 man, he's actually an underperforming terrible.

http://raidbots.com/epeenbot/us/gnomeregan/narph/
You'll have to excuse Narph. He's used to parsing in the 20-50th percentile range. So while he thinks he's amazing and is part of this awesome 25 man, he's actually an underperforming terrible.

http://raidbots.com/epeenbot/us/gnomeregan/narph/


I tend to use my rage for defensive abilities more than pumping heroics strikes as much as possible, I prioritise my survibility and utility before my overall DPS for now, dont worry, ill go back in the ranking afterwards.

I find it very ironic that you mock my 25man when your whole freaking server cant seem to manage to build a single one. But it probably has to be because none of Elunes player like 25man, right ?
http://raidbots.com/epeenbot/us/Dalvengyr/Dysheki

And please don't defend your current tiers like your previous tiers were better. They weren't.
10 v 25 debate!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

http://gifsoup.com/webroot/animatedgifs6/2057852_o.gif
I'm curious to know what would happen if Blizzard tuned 10-mans to be easier and presented them as the easier form of raiding. I get the feeling that 25-man credibility would skyrocket and we'd see a lot of players migrate toward the larger format.
Simple solution. 15 man raids. End topic.
10/09/2012 01:24 PMPosted by Pjmiagi
Simple solution. 15 man raids. End topic.


That's not a solution that's avoiding making a decision. They painted themselves into this "two equal sizes" corner and some BS middle of the road compromise isn't so much as a solution as simply trying not to piss anyone off.

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