Dark Apotheosis tanking?

Warlock
I really like what Blizzard has done with Dark Apotheosis, it made questing and soloing alot easier, but in dungeons right now its worthless. I've looked over all the different tank classes and Dark apotheosis, and the only thing thats really missing from Dark Apotheosis is lack of defensive CD's and Vengeance. I know that Vengeance gives you attack power which wouldn't boost a warlock in Dark Apotheosis, but maybe if Dark Apotheosis had a Spell Power based Vengeance instead.

I'm going to list some of the Pro's and Con's I've noticed about Dark Apotheosis:

Pro's:
-We can spam abilities like harvest life/drain life for self healing
-We have a taunt
-We have a good AoE
-We have pets that can tank an add if say we cant actively tank that and the target we are tanking (casters)
-We would be a spell damage tank rather than a physical damage tank
-We have a good mana/demonic fury system for maintaining fury ward
-Mastery helps defensively for Dark Apotheosis
-Archimonde's Vengeance, nuff said.
-Have a -10% physical damage done

Con's:
-No vengeance
-Fury ward only has 1 charge
-Not enough/weak defensive CD's
-Lack of Armor boost in Dark Apotheosis
-no auto attack while casting
to be the devils advocate (in the literal sense!)...because we can...should we?

When you look at all aspects of warlock lore do you see them standing at the front of the army dressed in their tier cloth ready to withstand the onslaught of the enemy? no, you'll find them in the back summoning their demons to do this task.

Personally i think for lores sake this is where we should leave the warlock.

He/she would risk his soul to command demons for power but would not risk life nor limb in a melee battle...thats what the meatshields are for.

I realise this topic is a bit one-sided at the moment because tanks are stepping into our arena and outdpsing a lot of dps (not just locks). This in my opinion also needs looking at by Blizzard but is a different topic to the one being discussed.
Well I dont see the point of them giving us a taunt, and many "tank" abilities if they did not want us to tank with it. I mean for soloing voidlord is just as good so why give us a tanking chance if we werent meant to tank. I personally would love to see a clothy tank, or even just a casting tank for that matter. It would be new and give more flexibility in a raid comp.
this is just another example of blizzard devs bowing to the QQ pressure on the forums. The moment that certain people got a whiff that their lock could withstand multiple hits whilst hellfiring the little synapses kicked into gear and pushed them to the next conclusion:

"WE CAN TANK!!"

please blizzard let us tank or we will unsub.

Warlocks are cloth-casting DPS and should remain as such. Let the demons do the dirty work.

Personally if I wanted to tank i'd pull out my Plate-wearing DK or Warrior.

Feel free to disagree...im sure the tank-locks out there will.
Blizzard has noted that Dark Apotheosis is not meant to allow you to tank. It is there for "oh !@#$!" situations/questing and things like that. They compared it to a Fury Warrior throwing on a shield. You may be able to take more boss hits than normal, but you are not meant to actually tank anything.
Well i dont plan on threatening unsub, I just wanna see more from Dark Apotheosis, its a neat addition, I mean since vanilla there hasn't been a casting tank, not since boomkins tanked the twins. Just would be nice to see it put in before they forget they made the ability.
When you look at all aspects of warlock lore do you see them standing at the front of the army dressed in their tier cloth ready to withstand the onslaught of the enemy? no, you'll find them in the back summoning their demons to do this task.

Personally i think for lores sake this is where we should leave the warlock.

He/she would risk his soul to command demons for power but would not risk life nor limb in a melee battle...thats what the meatshields are for.


Honestly, in terms of terms of this, I usually see something more along the lines of Cho'gall or something. I could see him out in front of a demented army of insane cultists. I can see a Warlock, which are a little more behind the shadows political type of group, breaking out when everything is prepared. Plus, as a demo lock, I do feel pretty awesome when I have a couple of demons and imps behind my back. We sort of already lead an army of demons already. Sure, they can tank for us too, but Voidwalker is really more like a hunter pet.

Plus, Dark Apotheosis just doesn't really fit with any of the other emergency tanks right now. Look at Druids with Heart of the Wild and Rogues with Growl. They are short term defensive and threat boosts. Those are emergency tanks. Warlocks are more structured like actual tanks with actual active mitigation, and the ability to gear specifically for tanking. Honestly, it is just sort of in a weird spot right now. It needs to change so that it is more of its own thing, really a spec, because that what the glyph really is, or decide that fun is not allowed, and make it fit more in line with other emergency tanks.

10/03/2012 06:40 PMPosted by Photonic
Personally if I wanted to tank i'd pull out my Plate-wearing DK or Warrior.


This argument really bugs me. I didn't roll a warlock for the same reasons you did. Honestly, I rolled my Warlock in Wrath, loved Demon stuff, and wanted to be a demon and wreck stuff. Dark Apotheosis fits this description for me. Add to the fact that it is fun (I'm actually liking it a little more than normal demo actually >.<), and would add more variability to my character, and has a lot of groundwork in place already, and it sounds like a great idea to me.
For lore's sake

The Dark Apotheosis talent turns us into full fledged demons 100% of the time. We are dreadlords incarnate.

So yes, we would be tanking.
10/03/2012 06:46 PMPosted by Umbros
Plus, Dark Apotheosis just doesn't really fit with any of the other emergency tanks right now. Look at Druids with Heart of the Wild and Rogues with Growl. They are short term defensive and threat boosts. Those are emergency tanks. Warlocks are more structured like actual tanks with actual active mitigation, and the ability to gear specifically for tanking. Honestly, it is just sort of in a weird spot right now. It needs to change so that it is more of its own thing, really a spec, because that what the glyph really is, or decide that fun is not allowed, and make it fit more in line with other emergency tanks.


I agreee we arent an emergency tank, and we arent strong enough to be a full tank, or at least not for raid bosses, maybe heroic dungeons but thats pushing it.
One thing some folks have been overlooking is that when used properly this glyph can and will save tanks. Ive had a few runs where i see the tank about to die from just plain too much damage due to gear or poor healing and ive managed to pop apoth and steal aggro for just long enough to save that tank. Sure a few have resulted in my death but hey dead tank=wipe. Better to bite the bullet and have dead warlock=a bit less dps.
Who needs it when your VW or VL can out tank half the PLAYERS in the game?
I can tank heroic dungeons fine, grab sacrifice void and you got a 20% base health increase and +30% health last stand and since all moves are % based drain life is 15k a sec heal ( 30k+ imp) and 50k every 15 second shield + +15% fear heal +30% heal over time, in demo I'm cranking 60% armor and 19% dark ap so that's a fair amount of damage reduction, give us ability to queue as tank!
10/03/2012 06:45 PMPosted by Squirrelock
Well i dont plan on threatening unsub, I just wanna see more from Dark Apotheosis, its a neat addition, I mean since vanilla there hasn't been a casting tank, not since boomkins tanked the twins. Just would be nice to see it put in before they forget they made the ability.
Didn't locks tank a blood prince in ICC?
10/03/2012 11:52 PMPosted by Sveik
Well i dont plan on threatening unsub, I just wanna see more from Dark Apotheosis, its a neat addition, I mean since vanilla there hasn't been a casting tank, not since boomkins tanked the twins. Just would be nice to see it put in before they forget they made the ability.
Didn't locks tank a blood prince in ICC?


ever since there was a fight that needed a ranged "tank" the lock was the one that was normally given the job since we can self heal like mad. Even back in vanilla a lock could keep himself alive easier than any other class besides healing classes.
10/04/2012 12:05 AMPosted by Adamishereto
Didn't locks tank a blood prince in ICC?


ever since there was a fight that needed a ranged "tank" the lock was the one that was normally given the job since we can self heal like mad. Even back in vanilla a lock could keep himself alive easier than any other class besides healing classes.
Yeah, I figured. I remember leveling this lock, I could literally dot up 20+ mobs and just stand there while they died.

It was fairly amusing.
there was also leotheras the blind, the add during the kaelthas fight, and illidans demon form phase as well
10/03/2012 10:36 PMPosted by Antryz
give us ability to queue as tank!


Yes blizzard, I switched up my bars to try tanking and actually tanked better than most tank classes tank, or at least in heroic dungeons. So let us queue as tank!!!
10/04/2012 10:19 AMPosted by Squirrelock
give us ability to queue as tank!


Yes blizzard, I switched up my bars to try tanking and actually tanked better than most tank classes tank, or at least in heroic dungeons. So let us queue as tank!!!
To be fair, the dungeons aren't all that hard. I'm sure that if I controlled him right, my voidlord could tank a fair majority of the mists dungeons.
10/04/2012 10:41 AMPosted by Sveik
To be fair, the dungeons aren't all that hard. I'm sure that if I controlled him right, my voidlord could tank a fair majority of the mists dungeons.


He can.
10/04/2012 10:47 AMPosted by Baalsamael
To be fair, the dungeons aren't all that hard. I'm sure that if I controlled him right, my voidlord could tank a fair majority of the mists dungeons.


He can.
So lol.

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