Why are dungeons so easy now?

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11/07/2012 09:51 AMPosted by Snuzzle
But that's the thing: I don't want to rush. I don't want to die all the time, but I don't want to faceroll and have zero danger of dying either. I want a happy medium between the first thing you said and the second thing you said. Where do I fit? What content do I do?
11/06/2012 11:24 AMPosted by Jessebella
Something something challenge modes Something something fart.
I feel two ways about this. Its good its dead easy cause if I dont have alot of time I know I can finish a few and maybe get a few bits. But then if you wipe just once you can have everyone drop group. Even if the wipe wasnt anyone fault.

Where with the ZG/ZA instances you mostly did once at least 3-4 times. Well with the groups I was in. The only thing that annoyed me with those was the ZG last boss, where if you didnt have the ranged you were basically screwed.

Though at the end even 1-2 instances again that are hard would be good. Sure I can just do challenge modes. But running the same instances that I can just do as heroics, I see a burnout coming from that.
my first heroic after barely meeting the gear requirement (and at least two others in group were also new to this dungeon- scarlet monastery maybe?), we had a tank drop shortly into the first boss fight. Frost mage (me) tanked and the healer was able to keep me and the other 2 rdps up while we burned boss down. I am always happy to avoid a wipe, but I don't see why a barely geared group that is unfamiliar with the fight should be able to beat a boss without a tank on heroic.

My problem with cata wasn't that the dungeons were hard. It was just long and grindy.

MoP dungeons feel like the right length, but the scaling is ridiculously easy.
Not to beat the dead horse, but CRZ makes leveling time consuming, and the dailies are also time consuming. But heroic content is faceroll? It shouldn't take longer to collect level 20 bear poop than it does to complete a current heroic.

I'd prefer things to depend more on skill and at least paying attention and less on just plain time spent. Honestly, there's no particular reason to even read up on the heroics before queuing.
Blizz wants to make money. More subs means more money. The vast majority of people (including almost every single person in this thread) are painfully horrible at video games. Do the math.
X_______X
11/09/2012 05:13 AMPosted by Peverell
The vast majority of people (including almost every single person in this thread) are painfully horrible at video games.


Judging from what? Gear? Pfft. Look at me, I'm a friggin mistweaver healing in agility gear. I don't take low levels seriously, so I don't neeeeed to gear myself properly.

I've seen players in kick !@# gear play their class like noobs, and vice versa. Don't judge a player primarily by their gear. Who knows, they might have logged out in RP gear.
Dungeons are boring.

I remember BC dungeons fondly as being a challenge and I would look forward to getting through them successfully, now in MoP it's honestly mind numbingly boring, you don't even have to think at all.
The ability to get in quickly and easily by being automatically matched with other players has a ton of great benefits, including just being able to get in and do dungeons without needing to spend time coordinating a group or spamming chat channels. Plus it has the whole Set It and Forget It benefit of being able to go do stuff while you're in queue. But the ease of entry has a downside in that tolerance goes down, and the fact of a random group is a lack of consistency from run to run. Random players being matched together injects a ton of inconsistency, but if it goes bad you can just jump back into queue and are probably not much worse for the wear.

Cataclysm dungeons tended to require things like CC, and in general a fairly in-sync and coordinated group to be consistently successful (at least until enough people outgeared them). The problem comes when matching random players together that there is no consistency. While you may go in with a group and all learn something, that a specific mob needs to be CC'd, or a certain boss behavior to avoid a wipe, those lessons are more than likely out the window with the next group you're matched with. While you may have some knowledge, maybe no one else does, and most people don't want to spend every run waiting for everyone else to learn all those same lessons. That can just be a frustrating experience. So instead of trying to force a group of strangers to be so heavily coordinated (maybe even having to jump into voice chat) just to complete the first steps of progression, we reduce the complexity to a point where the random groups that are being put together can most of the time be successful without needing to be hyper-organized or educated on each pull. Instead, that organization is far more important for the organized content where random people aren't matched together: normal and Heroic raids.

Of course there are players that want every piece of content to be very challenging, even going so far as wanting hard questing and daily quests, but the breadth of types of people playing World of Warcraft mean that we need to have a wide variety of content, and a wide variety of difficulty, to try to appeal to a variety of tastes. Obviously it's not an exact science, as you'll see from expansion to expansion, or even patch to patch, we may change difficulty to suit what we believe will achieve the best results for the people attempting that content.


The easy solution would of been to make REGULAR dungeons regular and heroic dungeons HEROIC.

Instead regular dungeons are 3 mannable, and heroic dungeons are 4 mannable.

I dont think ive EVER whiped in a single heroic this expansion. Except for the SM boss that can suck your whole group into a torando, but thats only because my group memembers forgot to wear their helmets that day.
Yes, LFG runs are not very challenging. Wipes do not occur unless someone in the group does something incredibly stupid.

I am not really a fan of the current setting. If I want a challenge, I have to run a challenge dungeon that offers no loot. Earning loot was my reward for winning a challenge. Now, I just get a special transmog. /shrug I'd rather have a shiny axe.

I'd still love to see another tier of dungeon difficulty added. LFG easy, original normal mode, then herioc. But even heriocs nowadays are not heriocs.
The ability to get in quickly and easily by being automatically matched with other players has a ton of great benefits, including just being able to get in and do dungeons without needing to spend time coordinating a group or spamming chat channels. Plus it has the whole Set It and Forget It benefit of being able to go do stuff while you're in queue. But the ease of entry has a downside in that tolerance goes down, and the fact of a random group is a lack of consistency from run to run. Random players being matched together injects a ton of inconsistency, but if it goes bad you can just jump back into queue and are probably not much worse for the wear.

Cataclysm dungeons tended to require things like CC, and in general a fairly in-sync and coordinated group to be consistently successful (at least until enough people outgeared them). The problem comes when matching random players together that there is no consistency. While you may go in with a group and all learn something, that a specific mob needs to be CC'd, or a certain boss behavior to avoid a wipe, those lessons are more than likely out the window with the next group you're matched with. While you may have some knowledge, maybe no one else does, and most people don't want to spend every run waiting for everyone else to learn all those same lessons. That can just be a frustrating experience. So instead of trying to force a group of strangers to be so heavily coordinated (maybe even having to jump into voice chat) just to complete the first steps of progression, we reduce the complexity to a point where the random groups that are being put together can most of the time be successful without needing to be hyper-organized or educated on each pull. Instead, that organization is far more important for the organized content where random people aren't matched together: normal and Heroic raids.

Of course there are players that want every piece of content to be very challenging, even going so far as wanting hard questing and daily quests, but the breadth of types of people playing World of Warcraft mean that we need to have a wide variety of content, and a wide variety of difficulty, to try to appeal to a variety of tastes. Obviously it's not an exact science, as you'll see from expansion to expansion, or even patch to patch, we may change difficulty to suit what we believe will achieve the best results for the people attempting that content.


The easy solution would of been to make REGULAR dungeons regular and heroic dungeons HEROIC.

Instead regular dungeons are 3 mannable, and heroic dungeons are 4 mannable.

I dont think ive EVER whiped in a single heroic this expansion. Except for the SM boss that can suck your whole group into a torando, but thats only because my group memembers forgot to wear their helmets that day.


regular dungs are for lvling, and for that able to be done +-easy to ppl not lvl 90 yet, heroics are the normal dungs of max lvl players.

do you want a harder 5man experience? challange mode

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