future of Ret in pvp?

Paladin
I just got my pally to 90 in preparation for 5.2 and I would love to play Ret in arena and RBG's...but every time I get on the forums it seems that the general consensus of Ret is sub par, and if I want to PvP on my pally competitively, id better roll holy. Can anyone who's been playing Ret this season attest to whether or not Ret will be up to standards based off of the coming changes Or how theyre doing on the PTR?
I haven't played a lot this season, but I have a pretty good grasp on the state of Ret.

Ret suffers from what all melee suffer from, namely ranged classes having excessive CC, survivability and damage all the while being able to focus fire and switch targets much easier. Damage for most melee classes is comparable to ranged classes barring extreme circumstances (IE stampede), and some of them have some sort of gimmick that makes them valuable enough to warrant a spot on the team. Deathknights for example have grip to combo with solar beam and vortex and single target grip to initiate a focus fire train, rogues have CC and smokebomb to isolate a target and shut down focus heals long enough to bring the target down, and warriors have insane burst damage, high mobility and passable survivability through second wind and defensive stance (which now no longer restricts ability use.) Granted, warriors are being nerfed in 5.2, so it remains to be seen how effective they are come patch day.

Ret however has none of that to define it. The utility it brings is shared with holy, their damage is reasonable (which in PvP means it's pressure to be added to the focus fire train, not a focal point to build the team around) and their personal defenses largely rely on self healing, which is both underwhelming and unsustainable.

If Ret had a monopoly on utility such as HoF and HoP as well as CC like blinding light (which is kinda happening with their adding a cast time to holy spec BL) then there might be precedence to taking a ret paladin for support that happens to add to the focus fire train. Currently, they die very easily to focus fire, their damage is mediocre, and you can get all the extra goodies by speccing holy and becoming a very strong single/dual target healer.
Thanks for the feed back...even if it pretty much deterred me from rolling ret now lol...i guess holy is the way to go :/
Blinding light doesn't seem like enough to convince me.
Play what you find fun.
Simple.
Holy is boring to me. I find the most enjoyment in my Ret Paladin REGARDLESS OF HER SITUATION.

I love the utility. I love being able to BoP someone and it completely saves them. I love throwing offheals. I love giving the flag runner freedom and watch them zip to safety.

We're not absolutely useless, no. We have some issues. Right now our biggest thing is we bring nothing unique buff wise to class compositions. Mix that in with melee being undesirable in RBGs, and bammo. A lovely mix of PUGs don't want you.

If you have friends, guild, or a constant group that runs RBGs, you can earn your stay.

Don't play something because it's powerful, play it because it is fun!
02/26/2013 09:33 AMPosted by Klareh
Don't play something because it's powerful, play it because it is fun!


i think 99.99999999% of us can agree that being powerful is fun. Explains every FOTM roller ever. Also explains all the QQ because imbalance is not fun. Its a valid question because what needs to be hotfixes end up coming once in 3 months along with new content release. aint nobody got time to get facerolled by OP classes for an entire season.
Don't play something because it's powerful, play it because it is fun!


i think 99.99999999% of us can agree that being powerful is fun. Explains every FOTM roller ever. Also explains all the QQ because imbalance is not fun. Its a valid question because what needs to be hotfixes end up coming once in 3 months along with new content release. aint nobody got time to get facerolled by OP classes for an entire season.


While I agree with your point to an extent, not EVERYONE likes being powerful. I don't want to be gimped, but I don't want to be OP, either. I quite like the Ret play-style in both PvP and PvE. I like being able to either wear my enemies down and then burst them the rest of the way, or just pop everything as I engage combat and hope that they're dead by the time my CDs wear off, otherwise it's going to be a long fight.

Not to mention, off-healing as a DPS is pretty fun. Throwing out blessings, protections and freedoms. It's going to be even better next patch with the buff to healing and Blessing of Sac.

If things get hairy, I will jump off a cliff and then bubble before I hit the ground, then mount up and fly away. Safe and sound. It might not be the bravest tactic, but when 3 or 4 Horde swoop in, of course I am gonna gtfo.

And my personal favorite, the ability to bubble-hearth with the glyph.

I absolutely love my Paladin. There are some flaws, but that's normal. There will never be a class that's flawless, especially with the game constantly changing.

Who knows where the Paladin class will be in a couple of patches/expansions.

EDIT: Also, I actually like Inq. It can be frustrating at times, but if it didn't exist, Ret would feel extremely dull. It's nice having to actually pay attention to what you're doing if you want the best results.
There will never be a class that's flawless


Every Mage would like to have a word with you.
Ret is fine in pvp and will continue to be fine in pvp. As the others said, if its fun for you then play it, not because you can blow people up every 2 mins. with all that raw power but because you enjoy the playstyle of being able to offheal and put out damage and provide some utility with bop/bof/sac etc.

~Ark
For WPVP, random Bgs and 2's for points, ret is among the best class for pvp.

For RBG's, if its 1600-1700ish or under, just being good at your class will earn you a spot more than rolling the proper class.

For random Bg's in particular, Ret is the my most favourite and self sufficient and able to make a huge impact on the outcome of the match more than any other spec/class (with maybe the exception of a good tank for WSG/TP or just a super good healer)

You can run into a skirmish and save two people from death instantly, global someone while you sac two other people back to back, meanwhile topping everyone up with FoL and WoGs, doing decent damage, blinding half their team and HoJing their healer.
Amieclaire ^^ excellent!
02/28/2013 12:56 PMPosted by Runforth
Amieclaire ^^ excellent!


:D
There will never be a class that's flawless

Every Mage would like to have a word with you.


Every Mage would still want buff's if they could get them and some would even say they aren't overpowered, so they aren't flawless in a Mage's eyes.
02/28/2013 07:40 AMPosted by Xianith
There will never be a class that's flawless


Every Mage would like to have a word with you.


Mages won't be considered flawless until their terrible level 90 talents get fixed. I play a Mage at 90 and they probably have the worst 90 talents out of all of the classes.
Stmichael nailed it.

If we are talking rated play and not just random bg's/2s and world pvp..
Then ret is well behind the 8 ball.

However

Play what you find fun.
Simple.
I haven't played a lot this season, but I have a pretty good grasp on the state of Ret.

Ret suffers from what all melee suffer from, namely ranged classes having excessive CC, survivability and damage all the while being able to focus fire and switch targets much easier. Damage for most melee classes is comparable to ranged classes barring extreme circumstances (IE stampede), and some of them have some sort of gimmick that makes them valuable enough to warrant a spot on the team. Deathknights for example have grip to combo with solar beam and vortex and single target grip to initiate a focus fire train, rogues have CC and smokebomb to isolate a target and shut down focus heals long enough to bring the target down, and warriors have insane burst damage, high mobility and passable survivability through second wind and defensive stance (which now no longer restricts ability use.) Granted, warriors are being nerfed in 5.2, so it remains to be seen how effective they are come patch day.

Ret however has none of that to define it. The utility it brings is shared with holy, their damage is reasonable (which in PvP means it's pressure to be added to the focus fire train, not a focal point to build the team around) and their personal defenses largely rely on self healing, which is both underwhelming and unsustainable.

If Ret had a monopoly on utility such as HoF and HoP as well as CC like blinding light (which is kinda happening with their adding a cast time to holy spec BL) then there might be precedence to taking a ret paladin for support that happens to add to the focus fire train. Currently, they die very easily to focus fire, their damage is mediocre, and you can get all the extra goodies by speccing holy and becoming a very strong single/dual target healer.


Well-said

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