Oondasta Health Nerf

Dungeons, Raids and Scenarios
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Only way I can ever see a tough world boss existing is just a random spawn 40 man single boss instance that is up for 30 minutes to an hour. With tag sharing you'd never be able to make a true anti Zerg mechanic in ever again.
Only way I can ever see a tough world boss existing is just a random spawn 40 man single boss instance that is up for 30 minutes to an hour. With tag sharing you'd never be able to make a true anti Zerg mechanic in ever again.


Azuergos style anti zerg.
I certainly don't want to knock the work of the encounter designers, they've done some great work lately.

..but I have to wonder how anybody though giving the boss extremely easily grief-able mechanics that wipe raids without question was going to be a good idea. It's unfathomably simple to wipe an Oondasta raid simply by forcing the tanks out of position through a number of means.
Took enough pictures of the amazingness prenerf so the nerf is welcome and not entirely unexpected. Sure as hell brought a faction together on servers though when it took 3+ groups to down him.
Whatever, makes my shots at his mount that much easier.
Oondasta clearly did not deliver on our original expectations. We'll apply the lessons learned from this experience to any future world bosses we add.


Oondasta might not have met your expectations, but I must say I have not had this much fun in the world in a long time. WoW is an MMOrpg, so I think it is awesome to see 100 people getting together to do something out in the open. Also the environment passively (just regular spawning) interacts with the fight as well which makes it a bit less predictable (DBM will probably never track the respawn time on a butt load of random mob spawns) and a bit more hectic. It is nice to see a fight in a raid such as OS 3D where to kill the boss your guild has to do some intricate, detailed, and well planned dance almost for the duration of the fight. On the other, hand it is nice to see content that you have to be willing to just throw yourself at. Prior to the health nerf it was going to be some time before an organized 25 man raid went in and did the fight *perfectly* to get a clean kill, and who wants to see that anyways? That is for the Ra-den no deaths on first attempt achievement. Oondasta , however, is a big !@# dinosaur enhance with armor and other troll magic/technology created by the Zandalari to be what he is - a WoW player killing machine.

I do not jump for joy at loads of deaths in raids, but how long has it been since you have HAD to get tons of people and even with them you ARE going to die and run back and die again, and run back some more.

We do not beat Oondasta. We slowly wear him down with all of our 5 or 6 lives to the point he decides to let us have some loots.

Edit: and not to brag....but if you look at my belt.... :D. Good luck to the rest of you!
Oondasta clearly did not deliver on our original expectations. We'll apply the lessons learned from this experience to any future world bosses we add.

That's rather unfortunate. I still think reducing the target cap, and the multiplier, on Spitfire Beam would have been plenty ~ that way it didn't instantly kill off 17 people. If you made it so 1-5 would take heavy damage, then 6-10 would likely die, I think the boss would have been fine. :(
Stupid question. When I die in a raid my release button is greyed out. If you wanted to stop the boss from being zerged why didn't you just grey out the release button for players who where engaged in the encounter the same way you do for other raid bosses?
And what we have increasingly been observing was players massing around Oondasta in such great numbers that it brought servers to their knees.


And then some. Every time I tried to kill him, every tank "phased out" so the boss was meleeing no target according to what I could see. Impossible to keep tanks up when you can't even target them to heal them.
That still doesn't fix the problem on high pop servers.

Proudmore is being brought to it's "knees" with Sha and Gal as well. Even if it's non-threatening, with faction tagging there's no reason not to run over and grab your quick easy loot. Sha and Gal aren't intended to be dropped in 20 seconds by 500+ people either, but it's still happened this tuesday and last tuesday.
World Bosses so far seem like a failure

Sha-style worked out fine (once they fixed the spawn timers), as a way of keeping people out in the world somewhat more than in instances.

If you wanted to stop the boss from being zerged why didn't you just grey out the release button for players who where engaged in the encounter the same way you do for other raid bosses?

This would lock out players from doing -anything- (including leaving the isle) while the boss was engaged. Does not work out in the world with a boss that can take 20 minutes to kill.

Hell, I wish they'd even add a (hard to access) override release to the raid lock release, as I've been stuck inside a raid for 20-30 minutes dead when working on soloing it due to the encounter not quite resetting.
My stance still stands, you cannot design an encounter like this and _NOT_ expect it to be zerged.

You can also not design an encounter like this that requires positioning mechanics to _NOT_ have issues when people are cramming into a small space, like try doing c'thun with 160 in that room. GOOD LUCK.

The point is.

Say a guild with 25 people want to do Oondasta the way it was MEANT to be done ie: placing people in the right place, being on vent, having gear, having a strat all the normal "raiding" infrastructure in place.

Now, Oondasta pops up, "We're going to Wreck it Guild" shows up and gets all setup. then 160 'tag alongs' show up because they found out Oondesta is up, "We're going to wreck it guilds" plans just got thrown out the window because all these people are literally going to just get in the way.

It would work if there was some way to isolate the boss from the rest of the people so the guild could literally work on it by themselves, but this isn't the point of world bosses, they are literally for everyone to take shots at. But if you want to make a raid boss with these kind of mechanics it doesn't work really well for a raid boss. Putting him in a VoA type enviroment would be amazing. and Isle of Bones, is not as "Remote" as one would think, and your "Really elite dinos" can be killed by a tank and a healer, so they arent really all that elite.
This would lock out players from doing -anything- (including leaving the isle) while the boss was engaged. Does not work out in the world with a boss that can take 20 minutes to kill.


It wouldn't take 20 minutes to kill if you couldn't zerg it. The kills that take 20 minutes is because chunks of people get gibbed and rez in bunches continuously. Those 20 minute kills would quickly turn into 3-4 minute wipes.
Lead Encounter Designer Ion "Watcher" Hazzikostas noticed this thread last night and has these thoughts to share:

Yes, Oondasta's maximum health has been reduced by 50%. The design intent behind this boss was for the primary audience to be guilds rather than pickup groups. That is why we placed Oondasta on a relatively remote island, surrounded by powerful elite dinosaurs that make solo travel in the area a dicey proposition. It's why he has mechanics that will outright kill you without the coordinated use of cooldowns, and careful positioning. It's a very different philosophy than our approach to designing bosses like Sha of Anger or Nalak. Of course, things didn't exactly play out as we envisioned -- as we all know, it was possible to overwhelm Oondasta with sheer numbers. While not intended, that was not entirely negative. There have been some pretty epic experiences on the Isle of Giants in the last couple of weeks. There's something to be said for the sight of a hundred spells and missiles flying through the air at a huge dinosaur.

We could have made a number of changes that would have made this approach entirely impossible: Consider a version of Oondasta with a Spiritfire Beam that could hop to 99 targets instead of 20, and a Doomwalker-style debuff that prevented players who had died during the encounter from re-engaging. Definitely not zergable. But that doesn't mean that people would stop trying, and the result would likely be a boss that no one could kill, and a frustrating experience for most participants. So we didn't do that.

Ultimately, while our server hardware is much, much more powerful than what we had in place during the days of events like the Opening of Ahn'Qiraj years ago, it still has limits. And what we have increasingly been observing was players massing around Oondasta in such great numbers that it brought servers to their knees. As word spreads that Oondasta has spawned, more and more people flock to the Isle of Giants for a piece of the action. Many people have been in Oondasta fights where spells took multiple seconds to cast, and the dinosaur perhaps stopped using its abilities entirely. Players with anything but the very best computers saw nothing but a slideshow. And in extreme cases, the entire continent of Pandaria crashed. That simply isn't an acceptable experience for our players, and so we reduced Oondasta's health, so that smaller groups are more likely to be successful, and he'll likely die before so many players arrive that it degrades the experience for everyone present. If server capacity were limitless, we wouldn't have made any of these changes, but alas that is not the case.

Oondasta clearly did not deliver on our original expectations. We'll apply the lessons learned from this experience to any future world bosses we add.


Just to point out:

Me and HUNDREDS OF PEOPLE pointed out this would happen on the PTR forums AND the main forums.

You ignored us.
The annoying thing now is that everyone gets into the 'OMG NERF = FREE LOOT JUST PULL 30 PEOPLE IS ENOUGH' mentality.

Which is surely followed by the "OMG THE BOSS GOT NERFED HOW DID YOU BADS WIPE" anger.

It would work if there was some way to isolate the boss from the rest of the people so the guild could literally work on it by themselves


Interesting...perhaps an even more isolated area, specific to the group themselves? This ... 'Instance of personal space' let's call it could perhaps even contain a multitude of such encounters! Oh the fun we could have!
Got my Gloves of Tyranomancy per Nerf :)
Instead of the stacking buff over time he should stack the buff when he kills a player, unfortunately too many griefers. Maybe the first kill of a particular player?

Also you famously asserted that "We are prepared for tears", yet at the first sign of tears...
World Bosses so far seem like a failure, I'd almost prefer Archavon style to Sha style, Blizzard being afraid to tune a 100 man world boss above a 25 normal raid (870m health is in line with normals) while calling it epic is proof we can't have nice things, especially now that Oondasta is barely tuned above 10 man (Below some 10 man heroics).Just instance loot pinatas and tune them right, stop the lagfests, griefests


For once I agree with you 100%.
Stupid question. When I die in a raid my release button is greyed out. If you wanted to stop the boss from being zerged why didn't you just grey out the release button for players who where engaged in the encounter the same way you do for other raid bosses?


My guess is while it didn't meet their expectations, what it did become was fun for a different group of people than it was intended and figured its fine fulfilling that niche instead.
My guess is while it didn't meet their expectations, what it did become was fun for a different group of people than it was intended and figured its fine fulfilling that niche instead.


Pretty sure there are other bosses which fill that same niche.

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