Ret DPS, is it really that bad?

04/04/2013 11:43 AMPosted by Keten
Sometimes I wish everyone had my luck with LFR weapons.

Agreed. I've been most fortunate this expansion with weapon drops in LFR, but I hear a lot about people who've been doing LFR since day one and still have an heroic blue. >_<
Then I remember Gurthalak.

I got that thing so often...
Retribution is fine in 10 man. You can't really stack prot paladins and holy paladins without missing something that another tank/healer would bring. About mid pack DPS, one of the higher bursts.

You can always find use for extra hand of protections, salvation, sacrifice, freedom, devotion aura, and purity though. Not to mention hybrid healing capabilities on a few fights.

Might not be as desired in a 25 man setting but they are good in 10 man.
Ret dps is decently strong atm. It is only weak if your undergeared (Like most classes). But IN most cases you only want one ret in group at a time for 10 and 25 man.
The DSBolt would have done absolutely nothing for AoE; the bolt would have been applied solely to your active target - like stacking Censure in AoE. Besides, 2pT15 already boosts our AoE, and all you have to do is slot a particular glyph - a glyph you should already be slotting for AoE situations.
04/05/2013 05:50 PMPosted by Invincible
Dealing more damage to your primary target while aoeing is more aoe damage.

That's a single-target increase with incidental cleaving. It was also less of a single-target gain than the HolyTVs.
I wouldn't call it a boost. More of a nudge.

6% is fairly significant.
04/05/2013 06:12 PMPosted by Invincible
Less sarcastic - I don't have a problem with single target dps, it would be a fair trade.

I don't have problems with single-target DPS, either; I also don't have problems with AoE.
Only times I've been out-done by those classes is on trash, and trash DPS is fairly meaningless - especially when people like to pop CDs for trash and I don't, but I still make top ten.

And I know I have played with at least one really good Rogue in LFR, recently, as I managed to edge him out on both Horridon and Council.
In reality the buff will make up less than 1-2% of your total total damage.

It is "something to sneeze at" to turn a phrase.

Our AoE is almost entirely Holy damage. It's not a 6% buff to all damage, but it is a 6% buff to our AoE abilities specifically.

You're playing with bad people. Hunters, dks, monks, mages, locks, warriors and rogues all outshine us in cleave damage.

AoE and cleave are not the same thing. E.g. hunters have good AoE, but no cleave to speak of. Ret has good AoE and decent cleave, but our cleave is directly coming from our AoE abilities so they aren't balanced around cleaving specifically like certain other class abilities (Blade Flurry, Sweeping Strikes, Storm Earth and Fire, etc.) are.
Burst aoe damage is extremely important on fights with adds.

In some cases, yes (Yor'saahj comes to mind); this tier, not so much. I've stopped AoEing on Horridon as I've found ST to be far more effective in burning down adds, since they're often spread out and/or chasing DPS (bad players, can't deny it). Council, same - though on Council, I do DJCleave.

Ji-Kun and Tortos are the only fights I've seen so far that would favor burst AoE, though with caveats - the first, only if you're on Hatchlings (I've done that before, and done it quite well, though it is really hard to measure in LFR with just Recount, I'll admit); the second, only important if your tank(s) don't fail and can actually put the bats where you can AoE them.

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