vol'jin 5.3 bluff called

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04/18/2013 05:39 PMPosted by Lynara


I love seeing that war criminal squirm.


Just go.


Nah, I'll stay.
04/18/2013 05:39 PMPosted by Lynara


I love seeing that war criminal squirm.


Just go.

If I overreacted in calling him a troll in that other thread, I think we can agree it applies this time.


Just go.

If I overreacted in calling him a troll in that other thread, I think we can agree it applies this time.


It's an opinion. Again, I am entitled to one~

This would have been totally a non-issue had the dialogue for Vol'jin not been threatening or insulting.

Alliance PC: So we've been in a war for the past few years. Why should we join forces and help you?

Vol'jin: Truth is, we need each other. We've got our differences but there's one thing that's constant and that is that Garrosh needs to go. We need your supplies and you need our guerilla experience.

Alliance PC: Okay.
Suddenly, life has new meaning to me!

Now, if we can follow some Alliance heroes instead of Vol'jin, we will be in business.

the devs have my sympathy at this point

their trying


How long have we been !@#$%ing Siast?

04/18/2013 05:43 PMPosted by Quirnheim
We need your supplies and you need our guerilla experience.


I think that it is more like we need thier knowledge of the land. We fight just fine
04/18/2013 05:43 PMPosted by Quirnheim
It's an opinion. Again, I am entitled to one~

"Varian is a ballerina" isn't an opinion. It's a (false) statement.

Only "ballerina" isn't a loaded term meant to pull at heartstrings and elicit a visceral emotional response, whereas "war criminal" is very much so. Using said expression inappropriately then retreating behind "but it's my opinion" when called out on it very much constitutes trolling.

The entire situation would also have been a non-issue had the player character not been given the opportunity to act like an !@# when they were acting as ambassador in the first place, but hey.

I can live with this text even though I think it sets an unusual precedent.
Alliance PC: So we've been in a war for the past few years. Why should we join forces and help you?

Vol'jin: Truth is, we need each other. We've got our differences but there's one thing that's constant and that is that Garrosh needs to go. We need your supplies and you need our guerilla experience.

Alliance PC: Okay.


That would be a perfectly acceptable dialogue... but, Alliance-supporting players would surely cry about it. "We're at war, dis is not World of Peacecraft" and stuff of that kind. Like fighting one enemy along some people who knows that enemy is insane and they'll be better off trying to take both at the same time.
You should know me by now. I'm a big Alliance supporting player. Have been for 3 years.

And I think it would have been perfectly okay.
This guy is the strongest candidate for the next warchief? Forget it. He's weak. It's a shame that assassin didn't do his job. This whole expansion has been a failed attempt to appease the story concerns for everyone who loves alliance. They are putting things like Hordebreaker and having the ability to simply talk down to the leader of the revolution, that isn't a good story that is just trying to go around the problem then actually face the issue that they cannot write alliance.


This happened because Vol'jin told alliance players to go die, now we have the option to tell him off.
This happened because Vol'jin told alliance players to go die, now we have the option to tell him off.

Again, in a sarcastic response which is only brought up if the Alliance player character acts like an !@# in the first place.
Eh, I think it works.

Really, Vol'jin DOES need the Alliance more than the Alliance needs Vol'jin. For him to get mouthy when his options are either, "hope the Alliance can do it on their own," or "hope Garrosh isn't anything like the LAST Dark Horde and take after the Darkspear like Blackhand took after the Draenei"... The Darkspear didn't hang on to become the last viable troll tribe by being prideful and stupid, and this is NOT the time to start.

Eh, if all our leaders had better diplomatic skills, though, I suppose none of this would be happening in the first place.
04/18/2013 05:54 PMPosted by Kellick
This happened because Vol'jin told alliance players to go die, now we have the option to tell him off.

Again, in a sarcastic response which is only brought up if the Alliance player character acts like an !@# in the first place.


And now we get to be even bigger asses, it's pretty great.
04/18/2013 05:53 PMPosted by Lena
This guy is the strongest candidate for the next warchief? Forget it. He's weak. It's a shame that assassin didn't do his job. This whole expansion has been a failed attempt to appease the story concerns for everyone who loves alliance. They are putting things like Hordebreaker and having the ability to simply talk down to the leader of the revolution, that isn't a good story that is just trying to go around the problem then actually face the issue that they cannot write alliance.


This happened because Vol'jin told alliance players to go die, now we have the option to tell him off.


The Alliance player should have never had the option to talk smack to him in the beginning. I suspect the only reason they added it was because alliance players were complaining on why they had to help the rebellion at all and not take out all the horde groups. Or sit back and go on a holiday to Lordearon while the rebels and orcs killed each other.

Honestly this doesnt solve the major problem with the Alliance side this patch which is the underwhelming lead in quests. But if the angry mob is placated that easy with a title and making Vol'jin beg then fair enough.
04/18/2013 05:54 PMPosted by Kellick
This happened because Vol'jin told alliance players to go die, now we have the option to tell him off.

Again, in a sarcastic response which is only brought up if the Alliance player character acts like an !@# in the first place.

Wasn't the initial Alliance dialogue asking why they should help Vol'jin when they could keep the supplies for themselves?

That's a pretty valid question, even if it's not phrased in the most polite manner.
Wasn't the initial Alliance dialogue asking why they should help Vol'jin when they could keep the supplies for themselves?

That's a pretty valid question, even if it's not phrased in the most polite manner.

Considering the Alliance player character was the one to approach him in the first place, turning around with "Or we could just take it all and leave you to rot, thoughts?" is a wildly inappropriate diplomatic move.

Like I said, I can live with this flavour text, I just think it sets an unusual precedent.
Now that you babies have your pacifier, will you finally put this obnoxious complaint to rest?
Wasn't the initial Alliance dialogue asking why they should help Vol'jin when they could keep the supplies for themselves?

That's a pretty valid question, even if it's not phrased in the most polite manner.


Yeah, though it begs the question why approach Vol'jin in the first place?

Or did you character risk his life in approaching Vol'jin just so he could go why do we need you?

Thats like a salesman doing door to door sales and then asking all the people interested in his product 'Well why should I be selling to you?'. It defeats the purpose of why your there.

What this dialog does is make Vol'jin grovel and show that alliance heroes are lowsy diplomats.

Best if they just left it out.
*claps*

A little humility from a Horde leader, finally.

NOW I'm happy to help.

"If your enemy defies you, serve him steel and fire. But if he bends the knee, you must help him back to his feet, else no man will ever kneel to you." -Tywin Lannister
04/18/2013 06:04 PMPosted by Kellick
Considering the Alliance player character was the one to approach him in the first place,


This was the writers first mistake, making us approach horde heroes. It should have been conducted between Vol'jin and Mathias Shaw/Varian Wrynn, not Player and Vol'jin. It would have been a good short video where they both talk to each other and set the rules for the engagements, and then have SI:7 go in and do their thing.
Now that you babies have your pacifier, will you finally put this obnoxious complaint to rest?


You don't really have the right to be condescending to us and call out our obnoxious complaints when you make an immature antagonistic post like this one.
*claps*

A little humility from a Horde leader, finally.

NOW I'm happy to help.

"If your enemy defies you, serve him steel and fire. But if he bends the knee, you must help him back to his feet, else no man will ever kneel to you." -Tywin Lannister


This. Combined with the "Hordebreaker" title and I think that Alliance players are coming out of this patch pretty darn good. I don't consider any further complaints about it to be valid.

What this dialog does is make Vol'jin grovel and show that alliance heroes are lowsy diplomats.


Seizing on Vol'jin's weakness to squeeze things out of him isn't lowsy diplomacy, it's excellent diplomacy.

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