Seriously irritated with my druid right now.

Druid
Now this may not make a lot of sense to those of you who ONLY play a druid, but for the rest of you, who play multiple classes, you may get this.

Now that I have more than one class leveled to 90...I find that whenever I want to do a semi-difficult battle - say, farming Zandalari Dinomancers in IOG, or killing the random named around Pandaria - I log off my druid, and I log into a class that's actually capable of killing things, usually my warlock.

Sure, the druid CAN kill these things - sometimes - but it's WAY harder. If I make a single mistake - I'm dead. The Warlock, or even my rogue, on the other hand, have some pretty good leeway. My warlock can honestly just plow through stuff.

This isn't a gear issue either - my toons are both in I-level 476 PVP gear. And even skill-wise - I have far more experience with my druid. The druid is Balance, btw, however I have a feral set and spec as well.

Now granted - I am seriously glad I have the Warlock, or I'd probably just quit. But this is making me feel like leveling the druid was just a big waste of time.
As someone who used to have a blast doing Mother Smolderweb solo runs in non-raid gear, this post hit me right in the sads.
476 pvp gear and trying to kill things? Yeah, it's going to be bad.
476 pvp gear and trying to kill things? Yeah, it's going to be bad.


Except, I use the same exact gear on my warlock, and I steamroll stuff.

As someone who used to have a blast doing Mother Smolderweb solo runs in non-raid gear, this post hit me right in the sads.


I hear ya. Used to get a couple rogues and do quite a few of the named there as well.
Except, I use the same exact gear on my warlock, and I steamroll stuff.

Classes are different.

Moonkins need much more gear than 476 pvp items to be decent in pve content.
05/07/2013 07:59 PMPosted by Cyous
Except, I use the same exact gear on my warlock, and I steamroll stuff.

Classes are different.

Moonkins need much more gear than 476 pvp items to be decent in pve content.


When a class needs "so much better gear" than another class, to be equally viable with that class - it means they're considerably weaker than that class.
When a class needs "so much better gear" than another class, to be equally viable with that class - it means they're considerably weaker than that class.

No. Gear is a factor for everyone. Balance druids use secondary stats. You need more gear.
Posted by Cyous
Except, I use the same exact gear on my warlock, and I steamroll stuff.

Classes are different.

Moonkins need much more gear than 476 pvp items to be decent in pve content.

When a class needs "so much better gear" than another class, to be equally viable with that class - it means they're considerably weaker than that class.


No, he's not saying that you need 522 ilevel as a boomy to be equal to ilevel 476 locks, he's saying that locks outperform boomkins at lower levels, and at higher gear levels, boomkins catch up better because they scale better when getting more crit.

Also as a side note why not go feral? You have more defense and healing as feral as well as more dps actually. I can kill basically everything except the big dinos (and obviously oondasta) solo on IoG without too much trouble.
I see. So I need to have full raid gear to become viable.

Honestly...that doesn't change how I feel much.

And yeah. Feral is clearly stronger than balance, however, that means I need to build up yet another gearset for the druid, as my feral gearset is not as good.

It also means while the lock only needs one set to do decent in PVE and good in PVP, my druid needs 2. Which means double the farm time.
I see. So I need to have full raid gear to become viable.

Honestly...that doesn't change how I feel much.

And yeah. Feral is clearly stronger than balance, however, that means I need to build up yet another gearset for the druid, as my feral gearset is not as good.

It also means while the lock only needs one set to do decent in PVE and good in PVP, my druid needs 2. Which means double the farm time.

you dont need 522 gear to be viable. but you cant compare PEt classes against a kiting class.
Balance is a really klunky spec, and you really don't have any "on demand" window of damage per se, at least not like you do with a SP or LOC where you can save up for when you need/want it.

I think druid damage classes are by far the most RNG oriented.

I've been leveling my loc lately, and having a "oh, I need damage now, I'll push this" is really handy.

I am admittedly the worst boomkin in history though, and trying to do it in resto gear doesn't help any. I ended up doing pve with boomie only because my pvp gear was all int based, and that's what I spend most of my time doing.

The problem I have with feral (which I leveled with the entire way) is I think their energy usage/regen is a bit out of whack.

All that being said, druids are the best class in the game. The variety and complexity, regardless of which spec you play, makes them really fun for me.
05/07/2013 08:03 PMPosted by Ilt

Classes are different.

Moonkins need much more gear than 476 pvp items to be decent in pve content.


When a class needs "so much better gear" than another class, to be equally viable with that class - it means they're considerably weaker than that class.


it just means they scale at different rates.
Scaling. When my frost DK hit 90, I was pulling 50k dps in ransoms right away. Try doing that as feral, hah. Go to noxious, check out their dps sims. Yes they are not accurate, but look how certain classes go up or down, like my opposite feral and dk
OP is trolling.
I find it hard to believe this Lock is serious.
If you hate your druid, don't play it. Because posting how much you hate that your can't flavor of the month steam roll a fight (because of lack of skill) isn't going to change a thing.
Like others have stated, ilvl 476 pvp gear is not 'geared' at the very least. In fact, its quite terrible for a moonkin.

If you're so irritated with your moonkin, why didn't you post on your moonkin so maybe we could offer more advice? You won't see a huge jump in dps until you're 485-490+, gemmed and fully enchanted and reforged properly.

In terms of gear scaling for example, I recently started gearing my fresh 90 lock also. My warlock hits 60-70k burst dps and can't even get into ToT LFR yet. My hunter is about 4 ilvls higher, around 480ish and my burst is lousy. I can't even touch the numbers my lock hits.

Warlocks are amazing, even at lower levels if you know what you're doing. Boomkins on the other hand are not as forgiving and require a massive amount of secondary stats that other classes don't lean so heavily on.
no, the OP is right. Stuff that gets me slaughtered as a druid is easily beaten by a shadow priest or a monk. too many of the DPS spells w/ their long cast times (easily interrupted) and no real aoe damage by spells that can be cast on the run...

I got Harry to 90, but I am not looking forward to the other grinds.

and don't get me started on how this game is just that, one lonnnnnggggg grind after another
05/07/2013 08:10 PMPosted by Cyous
When a class needs "so much better gear" than another class, to be equally viable with that class - it means they're considerably weaker than that class.

No. Gear is a factor for everyone. Balance druids use secondary stats. You need more gear.

I disagree. Why can´t I have fun while I dont have higher item level while others can?

Gearing should be fun. People with better gear should do a better job than others with bad gears, but when you compare people with the same item level?!!!

For example: you need crit to have starsurge procs. In PVP is dificult to cast Wrath and Starfire. Moon Fire, Sun Fire, Starfall and Starsurge procs will be the main spells (Starsurge procs being the strongest single target spell). If you have low level gear, the procs dont come and you kill nothing.

OP, you´re right. And this is one of the reasons I stoped playing druid.

Edited:
OP is trolling.
I find it hard to believe this Lock is serious.
If you hate your druid, don't play it. Because posting how much you hate that your can't flavor of the month steam roll a fight (because of lack of skill) isn't going to change a thing.

Many people complain about druid/balance because it has flaws. People need to talk, because developers look at it.
Posting here this kind of aggressive comment, full of assumptions (Lack of skill? Have you ever seen OP playing?) dont help anyone.

Edited 2:
05/08/2013 10:17 PMPosted by Shikoku
Warlocks are amazing, even at lower levels if you know what you're doing.
Not in PvP at low level. Take a look at Warlock forums. I leveled a lock and have to agree with people that say this there.
People need to talk, because developers look at it.

Except developers have often said they avoid the class forums because the discussions are basically an echo chamber. There's basically 6 months between blue posts in the Druid forums.

Developers pay attention to PTR and Role forums and GC, for reasons I'll never understand, uses that corner of the internet where stupidity is distributed as 140 character quips.
Gearing should be fun. People with better gear should do a better job than others with bad gears, but when you compare people with the same item level?!!!

A lvl85 DK with a 471 weapon using 397 gear can dismantle any creature at lvl88. Using my DK as an example. I destroyed EVERYTHING as I leveled my way through BGs. You could kill me yes, but probably killed 3 people before I died. Most of those players are using 420+ ilvl as well.

~~ ~ ~~ ~ ~~
(@quoted; this is not directed at you, though it did seem like it at first -- just making note of it)
~~ ~ ~~ ~ ~~

Why does this phenomenon occur? Why is it some classes are stronger than other with less gear? It's simple; it really is. Using melee as an example: Melee weapons are massive damage increases than any 1 piece of gear, maybe bigger than boosting 10 ilvls in non-weapon gear. Once you give a melee specc a powerful weapon, they can dominate for their average gear level.

"But wait Cyous! WW Monks don't scale well with weapons!" ~ Correct! What does this mean? Perhaps WW Monks don't use Weapon Damage as a major part of their ability formula. Could they are based more on AP and secondary stats. ~ Yes.

So what does this mean? ~ Speccs use different formulae with their abilities. This causes slight imbalances when compared across all classes. Some formulae use Weapon Damage as a primary factor. From this we can suggest Weapon Damage plays a key role when it comes to damage output and may cause a large imbalance when compared to other classes.

"What does this have to do with Balance druids, Cyous?" ~ We are based heavily around Critical Strike and Haste ratings. Crit offers more Starsurge procs. Haste helps maintain higher Nature's Grace uptimes.

"Are you implying I need gear to perform as well as other speccs in the same gear?" ~ Not entirely. Players who know how to play typically don't worry about gear (given everyone is similar in ilvl). Gear only makes killing things go by faster. The result is still the same, the rate of which is different. Gear helps, not denying that. But gear is only one factor in this equation. Without the other factors, you can't make an honest comparison.

Balance druids rely on secondary stats more than other speccs. Pitiful PVP gear in a PVE environment is a bull!@#$ excuse for disliking a specc. If you dislike the gear requirement to make it feel better, that's perfectly acceptable. Balance druids need a lot more effort than botting your way to a full set of 476 gear. If you don't want to play Balance, don't play it.

My experience as a Balance druid with 463 gear in Week 1 was awful. When I got to 476 gear, there was a big difference from 463 in output. Nearing 489 gear, questing was a joke, I pulled as many mobs as I wanted. At the end of the tier in 510 gear, I felt pretty good about my specc of choice. Sitting in 533 gear, I cannot pull enough mobs to make effective use of my cooldowns. Everything in a 40 yard radius is pulled and drops dead as they reach me. My experience is that stacking secondary stats provide much more use than a single item upgrade. Gear played no role in how I learned to manage my toolkit. I was pulling 10+ mobs in 463 gear because it made questing faster. My single-target was awful, but my multi-target was very strong.

Learn to play your specc to its strengths and avoid it's weaknesses when you can. If you cannot AOE, don't pull so many that you need to AOE. If you have amazing cleave, pull a couple extra. If you can handle 10+ mobs, pull 10+ mobs.

Use your toolkit. Stop using gear as an excuse for avoiding the flaws in your personal gameplay.
Now this may not make a lot of sense to those of you who ONLY play a druid, but for the rest of you, who play multiple classes, you may get this.

Now that I have more than one class leveled to 90...I find that whenever I want to do a semi-difficult battle - say, farming Zandalari Dinomancers in IOG, or killing the random named around Pandaria - I log off my druid, and I log into a class that's actually capable of killing things, usually my warlock.

Sure, the druid CAN kill these things - sometimes - but it's WAY harder. If I make a single mistake - I'm dead. The Warlock, or even my rogue, on the other hand, have some pretty good leeway. My warlock can honestly just plow through stuff.

This isn't a gear issue either - my toons are both in I-level 476 PVP gear. And even skill-wise - I have far more experience with my druid. The druid is Balance, btw, however I have a feral set and spec as well.

Now granted - I am seriously glad I have the Warlock, or I'd probably just quit. But this is making me feel like leveling the druid was just a big waste of time.


Let me see if I'm understanding you correctly... You are irritated because it is "hard" for your druid to SOLO content that is intended for GROUPS?

You... You... I see what you did there!

You're trolling aren't you?

Lol, good one XD

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