5.4 brings us.. Virtual Realms.

Oceanic General Discussion
Virtual Realms are sets of realms that are fused together, and will behave exactly as if they were one cohesive realm.

Players on the same Virtual Realm will be able to join guilds, access a single Auction House, join arena teams and raids, as well run dungeons or group up to complete quests.

Players belonging to the same Virtual Realm will have a (#) symbol next to their name.


So far this is pretty much all we know. This will be great for the smaller Oceanic realms that we have, fingers crossed they don't screw it up!

Thoughts on Virtual Realms? I suppose the way I see it working is similar with CRZ (PvE with PvE, PvP with PvP) Perhaps Frostmourne will be excluded from it :P
This is what CRZ should have been from the beginning to provide the real benefits available from the technology.

CRZ is a pain, not because you have to deal with other people, but because you cannot benefit from their competition i.e. - if 3 players from 3 realms are farming for a rare drop, and 1 player wins it and goes and pops it on their AH, the other 2 economies never see that drop. Even though statistically it's available to all of the realms, some are being deprived at some time. Hence why some economies are completely out of kilter.

So, what happens now is, taking the same scenario, the item (lets say the Darkmoon Bunny) ends up on the AH. Because the AH is shared by those same 3 realms, the instances of the Bunny appearing on the economy actually increase. The economy starts to become more realistic and over time, we see a return to WotLK style economies. Which, in my opinion, is a good thing.

This will impact people like me who make their money off of cross realm pet selling. Assuming that is allowed to continue, it'll only be of benefit to servers not linked to yours. Do you try and sell up now or wait? Hard decision. More research is needed I think.

People will whine about the increased competition for nodes, rare spawns etc etc but let's be honest. If you were playing pre-Cata, when server pops were higher, the current scenario is unnatural and cannot be maintained with declining subs. Despite the frustration, people like playing with people. People like seeing useless chatter in trade. People attract people.

My only concern is - how to deal with Frostmourne. My personal opinion is there needs to be free xfers off and the server needs to be locked. With this coming in, they need to look at a cap. Unless they go - all PvE to the left, all PvP to the right. That *may* solve the numbers game, but having 175k toons on one server is plain stupid when others are dying a slow and painful death.
I see what you're saying about the economy and I do hope for the sake of the lesser populated realms that it eases the prices a bit.

With Frostmourne.. if Blizzard have any sort of brain they won't allow merges with that server to happen. Purely based on the fact they have so many *active* players ON the server. It's had queues before and if they try to pack anymore people onto it.. people will complain about the queues again.

Not exactly sure how it's going to work but fingers crossed they evaluate what they need to do with the Oceanic servers to keep it balanced. I do assume it'll be PvP with PvP and PvE/PvE.

Considering we have 12 realms it could be split into 4's (4/8/12) or even 3's (3/6/9/12) probably 3's seems something that could be comfortable.
Actually, I thought similar tonight - quartering the populace - PvP split in two, PvE split in two. Just briefly looking at the numbers, I think that would work out.

Frostmourne is a beast they should have kept caged. It's their own fault and I don't think the virtual realm will be the cure-all that they're hoping for for those types of realms.
Wow! Sorry, I'm just trying to work through the plethora of analogies in that post to find out exactly what your thoughts were on Virtual Realms.

It's a backwards step? Yet many other MMO's have been trying ridiculously hard to implement the technology for years. Rift is a great example although even they couldn't manage it as well and neither could GW2. A pure seamless MMO without server restrictions (and therefore no limitations to where your mates are, no paying for server transfers etc) is one of, if not THE Holy Grail of MMO's.

All future MMO's will be chasing this tech. Any new Blizz MMO will carry this tech. It'll save subscribers money and it'll *possibly* halt some losses. I'm at a loss as to how that is a bad thing for a business. After all, that is their job - you know, to stay in business and to deliver innovation to it's customers.

I'm not sure how this is 'whack a mole' (it covers all aspects of the game and addresses the current 'holes' of CRZ), poor GC is being hung out to dry *again* when he's delivered some of the most innovative game developments (just because they aren't console based or 'cool doesn't make the tech behind WoW non-innovative) and the old chestnut of people being bored and frustrated because 'mummy and daddy aren't listening to us'. Well, as a parent, I always say to my kids - go find something to do - it's not my job to keep you entertained 24/7. The same can be said for a game. Don't like it, don't play it. Put it down, play something else. Come back to it. Want to whinge? Get into the Suggestion Forums and, I dunno, make a suggestion. Blizzard cannot be all things to all people. You'd think the poor buggar's would have satisfied the world between WoW, Diablo and SC2...

I can't say VR's will be perfect. But, if they work, it'll be a serious game changer.
I'm going to be curious as to how it works out. I'm quietly bemused because this is what I expected WoW to be like when I first started playing. An MMO with everyone interacting in the same world. I had no idea about different servers and the fact that if you were on one server and someone was on another, you couldn't see them.

Joining the economies might be interesting. I play on two servers at the moment, my PvP server is pretty close to dead for alliance, the stuff in it's AH costs twice as much as my PvE server. Part of that is demand and supply, the other part is it is a much older server and most players have a lot more gold to spend. I'm not sure what will happen when the auction houses get joined. It could be interesting.
I'm really optimistic about Virtual Realms for several reasons:

1. People! When realms are crowded it's exciting!

2. Guild recruitment will be better with a larger playerbase.

3. Server economies will be so much better with enchants, gems etc being much cheaper. There will be a greater variety of items available as well.

4. With Frostmourne's high ally population, and Barthilas' high horde population, we'll actually see some semblance of balance on the collection of servers resulting in more dynamic World PvP, raid progress competition, etc.
06/18/2013 07:00 PMPosted by Shedalandia
Rift is a great example although even they couldn't manage it as well and neither could GW2


GW2 does it whole lot better than what Blizzard could ever do, but it's a totally different game in a lot of aspects. Please don't generalize about games you have no idea about.

06/17/2013 04:44 PMPosted by Aislinge
poor GC is being hung out to dry *again* when he's delivered some of the most innovative game developments


And yet he is the reason why this game is losing subs with all his "innovative" game developments. This game is dull and boring, it's old and no new ideas that have been Blizzard own doing has come in a long time. Sorry but you sound like a fanboy who Blizzard can't do wrong by you.

All VR is, is just another name for CRZ, unless it's like GW2 where you don't share Mining / Herb node and every gets the credit for a kill no matter what kind of NPC it is then it has a chance of working. This is just a copy paste from GW2, really "innovative" game development from Blizzard.. ROFL


Firstly, I have been playing Rift and GW2 both since Beta. GW2 doesn't employ VR - they have shards for which you now have to pay to transfer across. They could not get the tech to function. Rift is exactly the same. While shards may 'blend' for events (ie WvWvW), they are not seamless and they do not share guilds or AH's. The 'VR" you refer to exists in instances only and not in the wider world. They are not comparable to what Blizzard is about to launch. I know what I'm talking about. Do you?

As for GC, I'm no 'fanboi' (l2slang). Before you go and create fresh DK's on non-Oceanic realms to come back and troll your same point again, try investing in a point. The fact is, Blizzard are constantly coming up with innovation in this genre which others find hard to compete with. Does it make WoW the most *exciting* game like eva man? No, of course not! Don't be so childish in your expectations! This is a game still running, at it's core, on an engine built and designed before 2004. It's a granddad in it's class. But irrespective of the loss of subscriptions, it's still the heavy-weight and no-one has come close to knocking it off it's perch.

Your references to GW2 in terms of VR clearly demonstrate you just don't understand what VR is or how it works. You feel the need to benchmark it off of another game which came after when Blizzard has been working on this tech for years. If you paid attention to BlizzCon and the Dev Panels, you would have known years ago that this was in the works, especially when they said they were working on allowing your 50 character account allowance to be available on any singular server. You didn't have to know what VR was for bells to be going off in your head *ding ding ding* The VR is not CRZ 2.0 - that remark just makes you look silly. CRZ should be seen as the first step of VR.

We may end up with:

WoW still having servers but your need to transfer etc is gone as everything is seamless. Toons are still server based.
They push it further and are able to make it 100% seamless with no servers at all. Toons are account based. The limitations may be based on Battlegroups or some such, purely to have a population cap.

They may also introduce overflow servers to handle population in areas etc but this tends to give people the irrits and cause more complaints than it's worth. GW2 sees plenty of server transfers as a result of this.

Your references to GW2 nodes for example is a phasing tech, not a VR reliant tech and within WvWvW is working within an instance. GW2 decidedly chose to implement this style of farming due to the economy, lack of mounts, size of the world etc etc. They could hardly have the same sparseness of nodes, have everyone running for them and oh, oops sorry, ninja'd again! The complaints would be sky high! Blizzard opted long ago for a different route - high node pops, high spawn rates, mounts, flying, smaller world by comparison. You can hardly say one should have done the other when the reasoning behind it is totally different.

In the end, it doesn't matter who starts the tech, who has first crack. It's who gets it to work over millions of players and makes it stick. So far, no one has been able to manage it.
I personally don't think any realm will unaffected by VR due to some of the benefits that can come of VR for every player.

I also suspect we'll see the end of queues. That some of the larger realms with queues can see their traffic end up going through other servers but still with their original server tag. Mixing larger realms with low pop realms is of great benefit to the low pop realm while having minimal impact on the high pop realm.

VR'd realms will be permanent.

I can't see any reason why all the Oceanic pvp realms won't be VR'd together and same with all the Oceanic PvE realms being VR'd together.

Also about the crz talk. CRZ was never meant to fix low pop issues and CRZ is in all likely hood the portland cement of VR.

This game was never designed around having hundreds of people crammed into one Zone. Why do you think CRZ failed so much, same thing will happen with VR.


Clearly you're not a Vanilla/BC player or if you are, you have a short term memory. When ALL zones were constantly packed with players, fighting for all nodes was common place When getting a stack of anything was earth shattering because it meant you could finally level a level or two in a profession and all of that came from running around like dimwits because you couldn't get a mount before 40 and it cost the (relative) earth.

CRZ has not created anything that was not there before hand. If you're complaining about competition for rares, nodes, your favourite 'whatever' spot, then you've had it too good for too long. Harden up.
If you're complaining about competition for rares, nodes, your favourite 'whatever' spot, then you've had it too good for too long. Harden up.


This complaint is a hangover from Cataclysm when everyone was in sw/org and people played the game as a single-player RPG.
I am going to beat a dead horse here. Blizz, please just do it. Do it today. I will take my chances to get trolled. I will deal with guild hopping jerks. I will worry about drama. I will accept the risks associated with a Virtual Realm vs. dying a slow death by depopulation on Dath.

Avalanche has been a guild on Dath for at least 6, maybe 7 years now and has had a lot of highs and lows. We have always been a strange group made up of insomniacs, shift workers and lost Eurotrash and enjoy doing stupid things like raiding regularly at 4 am server. But we have always had enough to do things as a team. Until recently.

I am tired of our regulars having to miss out on raids when one or two can't make it and there is literally 40 other L90's server-wide to even ask to fill a slot (do you have any idea how many of them are very awake / interested to raid at 4 in the morning?). We are considering a guild transfer off to another server that is more active our time of the day (US, EST for instance). But truth is, we don't really want to do that. We just want more people around. People to have fun with and get to know.

So, quit teasing and do it already. Thanks in advance for your help in making our life a bit more exciting and dramatic - sincerely, Chezwick, Avalanche Guild on Dath'Remar
Most likely what will happen, is that all the PVE oceanic servers and all the PVP oceanic servers will become one, and this will be of GREAT help to all my toons, as although I retreat to Moonguard all the time, at the heart of it, I want to meet as many other Australians as possible, and with the realms merged together more, it will be much easier to do that.

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