What is skill?

Darkspear
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What is the difference between playing at 2500 rating...
... and leading a 1400 team to victory against a 1700 team?

I've been exploring a great deal of different skill levels in the game. Last season, I led a group of players to 2200, 13 of which had never been there. After that, I took on some 1800 players and helped them reach 2000.

But this season, I joined a group of players who were for all intents and purposes 1400 players. They didn't CC, they did very little DPS and heals ran OOM quickly. The only redeeming factor was that they listened to me and followed orders to the best of their abilities.

We won against a 1500, 1600 and then fought a 1750 and lost. A 1700 followed and we won. Our ending MMR was 1450. Calling things out was tough... battles were not won, and the only way victory could be assured was capping nodes, flags, and sometimes just trying to survive as long as possible.

So I wonder... is this a different kind of skill? Could leading a 1400 team be harder than leading at 2500 one? Having done all levels in between, I have to wonder...

Running Hunter/Rogue/Priest 3s to 1800 on week 1 of playing a priest after 4 years hiatus with a rogue who ran the comp to no more than 1500 (though certainly a better player). Is that more skill than raising a TSG 100 points to 2590 the first week I joined it in season 8 pre-shadowmorne?

My point is, it's easy to call someone a bad player. But maybe, just maybe, they posses a a great deal of a different 'skill.' I just hope that skill, for some of you, isn't just trolling the forums... especially of a game some of you play less than you talk about it.

Concerned,
Eliaegl
we are not worthy

I liked it better when you were in hiding over a broken heart
Good for you eliangel. Mustering up the courage to post again. Hopefully bow can fill that hunter shaped hole zonx left in your heart.
hey now, leave me out of this!
Spectacular. I agree. After all, #1 Worst Warlock Sir Chillerace knows everything about being bad.
What is the difference between playing at 2500 rating...
... and leading a 1400 team to victory against a 1700 team?

I've been exploring a great deal of different skill levels in the game. Last season, I led a group of players to 2200, 13 of which had never been there. After that, I took on some 1800 players and helped them reach 2000.

But this season, I joined a group of players who were for all intents and purposes 1400 players. They didn't CC, they did very little DPS and heals ran OOM quickly. The only redeeming factor was that they listened to me and followed orders to the best of their abilities.

We won against a 1500, 1600 and then fought a 1750 and lost. A 1700 followed and we won. Our ending MMR was 1450. Calling things out was tough... battles were not won, and the only way victory could be assured was capping nodes, flags, and sometimes just trying to survive as long as possible.

So I wonder... is this a different kind of skill? Could leading a 1400 team be harder than leading at 2500 one? Having done all levels in between, I have to wonder...

Running Hunter/Rogue/Priest 3s to 1800 on week 1 of playing a priest after 4 years hiatus with a rogue who ran the comp to no more than 1500 (though certainly a better player). Is that more skill than raising a TSG 100 points to 2590 the first week I joined it in season 8 pre-shadowmorne?

My point is, it's easy to call someone a bad player. But maybe, just maybe, they posses a a great deal of a different 'skill.' I just hope that skill, for some of you, isn't just trolling the forums... especially of a game some of you play less than you talk about it.

Concerned,
Eliaegl


I wish I could upvote this post more than just once. It's nice to see well thought out and level headed posts like this as opposed to most of the trash/troll posts I get to read on a daily basis.

As far as skill goes, I think it varies from environment to environment. I think in RBGs the ability to follow directions and everyone listening to the leader far outweighs personal skill (character knowledge/enemy knowledge). This of course puts a lot of responsibility on the leader or target caller. A team can go very far by just being on the same page and not running off in different directions.

In arena, it's more about cooldown management, personal knowledge of your class as well as you're enemies class/comp and their major cooldowns, avoiding their major dmg cooldowns, and timing your own with your partners while CC'ing at the right time to score a kill. Much more micro management.

With that said, I've noticed as time has gone on from Vanilla to now, it seems more and more people would rather complain or place blame outwardly onto others than accept that they need to improve. Just look at the arena forums for example. There used to be tons of threads asking for advice against certain comps and for tips and strategies. Now you can scroll down and find at least half a page of "X class needs a nerf" threads.

Hell, you can't even get someone to acknowledge a "good duel" anymore without one of the following excuses:

1. Lag
2. I didn't have CDs
3. Doorbell rang or phone call.

Why can't people just be gracious in defeat and say "Good duel, you were the better player this time."

I'll be the first to admit that I'm an 1800-1900 player at best when it comes to any rated PvP, but I'm always looking to improve. I've started at season 1 and 2 as a clicking and backpedalling mage getting 1900 with RMP and thought I was the bomb just because I knew how to use a focus macro back then (LOL). In cata I finally keybound all my abilities (still backpedalled) and we ran Ret/Holy Pal/Fire mage into the 1850s (Worst comp ever, I know, but we had fun). Towards the end of Cata I unbound my 'S, D and A' keys and replaced them with ability keybinds, got a gaming mouse, and never looked back.

I guess the point I'm making in the last paragraph is this. You can sit back and complain about other classes being overpowered, you can blame lag (or other external factors) for your loss, or you can man up and own your loss, think of what you can do better next time, and start improving. I've always taken the ladder approach.

Now that I'm done babbling like a fool, I wanted to reiterate that this was a very good post Eliaegl, please keep them coming =)
because........ swifty

ps. very good post
TLDR this game is hard I say
Nun chuck skills, bow-hunting skills, computer hacking skills... I NEED GOOD SKILLS AGGHH
You may be horde, but I like and agree with what you said.
@Steelfists

*Standing applause*

This is why I like doing arena with you man, we are on the exact same page my friend =D
/salute to NF and the op for being decent PEOPLE, not just good players.


They are neither. NF spends all day zerg balling and camping people. How can you call a person who does that decent?

There's sort of a gang mentality going. They are a really buddy buddy to the people who do what they want and ruin the game for everyone else.
That's life on a PVP server.


Naw... That's life on Bonechewer. You are making a great deal of assumptions about how this server works. As Horde all I had to do was stand outside Seven Stars for 30 seconds or so to get the Alliance flooding out.

Proof:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0GcVSPj6DmM

The Alliance dueling were actually people that arrived earlier to see what the hell was going on. There was at least 10 people out there by the time I left.

There is plenty of other places that produce the same results if someone that truly wanted to PvP visited them. NF wants to have 15 second zerg ball fights and nothing more. A handful of people will never come out to fight a raid, especially in a zone that's way out of the way like Outlands or IoT. If anything the raids are counter-productive. The only reason I have to set foot into IoT is to troll NF now. There's absolutely zero chance of me finding some real PvP before they hunt me down.

I'm guessing you missed some of my earlier hijinks as Horde, but trust me when I say NF isn't doing anything positive for this server.

EDIT:
Here's another quick one:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PxoZeneGB8I
Obviously a 20 man raid is required to get Alliance into Goldshire.
06/23/2013 09:59 PMPosted by Redead
That's life on a PVP server.


You are making a great deal of assumptions


This is literally ALL you do.
06/24/2013 12:22 AMPosted by Bosspaw


You are making a great deal of assumptions


This is literally ALL you do.

I'm assuming you know nothing of what I'm talking about since you've played on Stonemaul up until a year ago at the most, despite bragging that you've been on Darkspear forever in the past.

That was a fun vid, was the bottle vortex trinket at the end? I use to use that + glider in WSG to run flags.

Nitro Boost malfunction.
06/23/2013 09:59 PMPosted by Redead
That's life on a PVP server.


Naw... That's life on Bonechewer. You are making a great deal of assumptions about how this server works. As Horde all I had to do was stand outside Seven Stars for 30 seconds or so to get the Alliance flooding out.

Proof:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0GcVSPj6DmM

The Alliance dueling were actually people that arrived earlier to see what the hell was going on. There was at least 10 people out there by the time I left.

There is plenty of other places that produce the same results if someone that truly wanted to PvP visited them. NF wants to have 15 second zerg ball fights and nothing more. A handful of people will never come out to fight a raid, especially in a zone that's way out of the way like Outlands or IoT. If anything the raids are counter-productive. The only reason I have to set foot into IoT is to troll NF now. There's absolutely zero chance of me finding some real PvP before they hunt me down.

I'm guessing you missed some of my earlier hijinks as Horde, but trust me when I say NF isn't doing anything positive for this server.

EDIT:
Here's another quick one:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PxoZeneGB8I
Obviously a 20 man raid is required to get Alliance into Goldshire.


There is plenty of other places that produce the same results if someone that truly wanted to PvP visited them. NF wants to have 15 second zerg ball fights and nothing more. A handful of people will never come out to fight a raid, especially in a zone that's way out of the way like Outlands or IoT. If anything the raids are counter-productive. The only reason I have to set foot into IoT is to troll NF now. There's absolutely zero chance of me finding some real PvP before they hunt me down.

I'm guessing you missed some of my earlier hijinks as Horde, but trust me when I say NF isn't doing anything positive for this server.


Redead is one of about 4 kids who have started trolling us for absolutely no reason, that number seems to be down to about himself and just 2 others now.
If you look back you can see from the very first post we made with our introduction that we were moving here, he started trolling/flaming in which case he obviously had no real knowledge or justification of any of us other than my introduction post.
15 second zerg fights? again proving for the community that you have no idea what your talking about, we have hour long back and forth large scale battles (wpvp finest) can attest to that.

Also, we fight plenty of times at the darkportal, in Iron forge, in goldshire, we've also fought several times in Storm wind, the alliance PvP vendors, pretty much everywhere YOU say is "important"

I would imagine the reason you PvP solo all the time and brag about it is pretty simple you have no friends, my bet would be that carries over throughout many aspects for you.

You are basically upset because we pvp together with a group of friends, we dont let our members be camped and were actually promoting pvp all over the lands.
On almost every raid as of recently, there are usually at least 20 NF guys showing up to try to help defend Org.

Keep continuing to be "you" we're enjoying all the guild members who have left your guild and come to us because were and I quote "actually doing something" I believe was the last guild member who joined us coming from your guild.

You should also not present your case like you represent the server, there are plenty of decent people here on this server both alliance and horde and you sir do certainly not represent the majority here.
You are a small minority who spews nothing but ignorance and stupidity but I guess I would come to expect nothing less from someone of your caliber.

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